Author Topic: Mass Effect (merged thread)  (Read 34338 times)

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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Mass Effect (merged thread)
« on: February 01, 2010, 08:36:56 PM »
Just beat Mass Effect 2 and, although I could easily just post this in the Official Video Game thread, felt the need to start a new thread because at the moment I'm overwhelmed by how awesome the final mission was.

My only criticism of the game is that the story seemed non-existent up until the end. Yea, it was there in the background but it wasn't like the first game where every second you felt like you were part of something big, and the game constantly reminded you about it. Otherwise, it's better than the first game in every conceivable way. It'll be interesting to see how the first game holds up when I play it next. Don't know when that will be - could be in a month, could be in the summer, could be in a year (nah, I'm too big a fanboi for that).

**Spoilers on ending** Jack died - I basically sent her to her death because she wasn't loyal to me and I was worried if I kept her with me something bad would happen, so I sent her away with the survivors. Used Tali in the shaft and Garrus leading the other team to start. Samara for the barrier and Garrus leading the other team after. Chose to destroy the base.
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Offline RandalGraves

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2010, 10:37:33 PM »
I adore the first game and while I agree the second was better gameplay wise, the story wasn't quite up to par.  I thought the end might be a little more . . . grand.  Also, I was a tad disappointed in the fact I could reach the max level in one playthrough. Despite the fact it took over 30 hours, it seemed to go by so fast.

SPOILERS

As to who dies in the end, I'm not quite sure what determines that.  There's discussions over at gamefaqs saying it might be who's not loyal, or strong enough, or who you send to do what . . . and some say it even might be random.  Who knows.

END SPOILERS

Anyway, phenomenal game.  I'm playing through the first again, and I'll launch back into the second the moment I'm done.  Those two games really take my top spot as far as next-gen systems go.

Offline Nigerius Rex

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2010, 02:31:54 AM »
Spoilers:

Their survival depends on whether or not you do their side missions which earns their loyalty, and if you have the ship plating and shield upgrades.

But yes, awesome game. It felt a little too much of a console port to me and I liked ME1's fighting system, ammo, and upgrades better.

Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2010, 03:21:43 AM »
From what I've heard the members dying is dependent on loyalty and all that, but it is also on who you send to lead squads and stuff. If you send Tali to lead a squad, some might end up dead, but if you send Garrus it works out better.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2010, 05:11:17 PM »
What I really wanna know is what is the canonical ending?
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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2010, 05:24:48 PM »
I just assumed that both endings carry over to ME3 just like it did to ME2. You are most likely going to be able to import your saves again, so I don't see why they wouldn't carry both over.

Offline Scurvy!Dreams

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2010, 05:32:57 PM »
Of course you can carry over, but Super Dude wants to know what Bioware considers the "real" ending. ie, you could have saved the Council in the first game, but if you don't import your save then the default is that the Council died.


My ending:
Legion for hacking, he died closing the door. Chambers died because I didn't get there fast enough. Jack got taken away by the swarms at the end of the barrier section. Zaeed successfully escorted the survivors to the ship. (Can you screw this one up??) And I didn't destroy the collector ship.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2010, 05:38:07 PM by Scurvy!Dreams »

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2010, 05:36:32 PM »
Right-o.  I love exploring possibilities, but I also want to experience the series the way the developers envisioned it.
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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2010, 05:56:30 PM »
I don't think they wanted ME to be a contained world like they did with KOTOR. I always got the impression that they wanted player choice over a concrete story line.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2010, 06:44:14 PM »
Yeah, but that doesn't mean a canonical story doesn't exist.
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Offline Nigerius Rex

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2010, 01:57:25 PM »
Spoilers:

They didn't make a canonical ending. They designed so virtually everyone can live or die and the game will still continue. Even if everyone on the mission dies Joker still reports to the illusive man in the end cutscene, so thats probably the closest thing to canon.

In my first play through everyone but myself died because I didn't piss away credits on upgrades or spend time doing any loyalty missions. Second play through though I am trying to get morinth over samara and have her rape my brain.....

Offline Scurvy!Dreams

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2010, 06:52:21 PM »
No loyalty missions?! You missed like a third of the game.

I don't get how buying upgrades is "pissing away" credits. What else are you supposed to do with them?

Offline RandalGraves

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2010, 01:47:22 PM »
Granted, it says "Spoilers" in the thread title anyway but I thought I'd reiterate that there are some end spoilers here, regarding who you send to do what in the final mission.  Some people thought it was random or a glitch (as far as who lives and who dies) but a dev was nice enough to spell it out for everyone.

Mordin's death is not a glitch or bug. I believe that when people are surprised with Mordin's death, it's during the "Hold the Line" time where you leave crew behind as you and two squad mates move onward. Tech had their moment in the sun with the tunnel infiltration. A biotic is key for the protective bubble. The Hold the Line sequence is time for your soldier types to do their best.

Basically you want your best DEFENDERS to hold the line. Don't think about offensive solo strikers. Think about the guys that can dig down and hold a position with moxie. You want them to hold the line.

Under the hood, each character has a "hole the line" score, which gets a bonus if the character is loyal. Characters like Mordin, Jack and Tali are squishy and not exoeruenced with bunkering down and holding out for an extended period of time. Characters like Grunt and Zaeed are tanks who thrive on this type of work. The score is tallied for all the team members that are holding the line, and the number of survivors are calculated. If people are to die, the non-loyals squishies go first through the list to the loyal tanks. Alas, I think Mordin is at the head of the death list. Some characters can't survive without help even if they are loyal. Others can survive even if not loyal.

Here are some examples for the group holding the line:
Loyal Mordin by himself: He can't hold the line by himself. He dies.
Non-loyal Grunt by himself: Grunt lives. He hunkers down and gets the job done, and doesn't have to worry about helping any one else.
Loyal Mordin and non-Loyal Grunt: Grunt dies, but Mordin lives. Grunt is able to hold the line but goofs up helping Mordin... he was just too aggressive without his right of passage.
Loyal Mordin and Loyal Grunt: They both live.

Note it is possible to get non-loyal henchmen to survive through the end game with the proper group holding the line.

So what is a good strategy? Send back a loyal squishy with the crew, like Mordin or Tali. Leave your defensive bad asses to hold the line (hmmm, Garrus defended a base all by himself to an extended period of time....) and take your loyal offensive favorites with you to the end.

As for saving Kelly and the crew, you just need to make sure you go through the Omega-4 relay right after the crew is taken, and make sure you send a loyal squad mate back as an escort."

Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2010, 07:31:54 PM »
I haven't read this thread, nor do I intend to until I finish it but...


THE COLLECTORS ARE THE PROTHEANS?!?!?! HOLY BABY JESUS!!!!
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Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2010, 07:34:45 PM »
I thought they were Protheans fucked around with by the Reapers?
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2010, 07:37:34 PM »
I thought they were Protheans fucked around with by the Reapers?
Yes, but they still were them. That's what I was trying to say.
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Offline Sigz

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2010, 08:29:07 PM »
Just finished it. Holy fucking shit, what an ending. I lost Jack (not a huge deal, she hated me anyways) and Tali  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

Easily one of the best games I've ever played.
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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2010, 08:39:51 PM »
How the hell could you let Tali die!

Offline Sigz

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2010, 09:01:15 PM »
I HAVE NO IDEA

Seriously, I upgraded everything, had her highest loyalty and everything. I have no idea why she died.
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Offline faemir

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2010, 07:54:09 AM »
You chose the wrong people at the end!

Offline Sigz

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2010, 10:13:11 AM »
Must have  :sadpanda:
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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2010, 10:42:06 AM »
So I'm doing a full renegade play through for ME1 and 2. Renegade is funny as hell, my favorite line is when the Turian councilor says " Do you enjoy committing genocide on an entire species"

And you just reply "Depends on the species, Turian."

Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2010, 12:51:56 AM »
Just finished the game, even though I tried going for a renegade side, everyone survived and I destroyed the ship. Here's how I chose the teams:

Legion for the hack, Garrus leads the other team. Samara for the swarm part and Miranda leading the other team. Mordin lead the survivors to the rendezvous, he lived. On the final part I took Samara and Thane with me, Samara because of the biotic and Thane because he's the most awesome character in the game, I thought about bringing Grunt, but I left him behind so all my strongest soldiers were there.

Did all of the loyalty missions and all upgrades, except the bigger fuel tank and upgrade board, which didn't really matter at the end. Sexed up Miranda, but I really wanted Kelly.


Question: And how does the story changes if the Council dies? Do humans now run the Citadel?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2010, 01:03:07 AM by Dimitrius »
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Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2010, 08:01:11 AM »
Answer: From what I can tell from the quick-character option for ME2, the canonical ending of the last game was to kill the Council.  I'm guessing you transfered your character over?
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2010, 08:25:09 AM »
Yes. But you haven't answered my question. Does it even make a difference? I only saw the Council the first time I went to the Citadel, where they told me they were gonna reinstate my Spectre status. After that, they are never heard from again.

Maybe a better question is what happens in Tuchanka if Wrex is dead?
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Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2010, 09:00:02 AM »
To your first question, the Alliance runs the Citadel.  To the second question, I have no idea.  Keep in mind that I do not own the game; I'm just going off of what I know from videos of the opening sequence on YouTube.
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Offline skydivingninja

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2010, 09:01:34 AM »
If Wrex is dead, his blood brother is the chief of the Urdnot.  I haven't done Grunt's side mission yet, so I have no idea if there's that conflict between Uvenk and the Chief over letting Grunt take the rite of passage.  I have yet to recruit Tali and Legion, I've just gotten to the point where I have to go aboard the collector ship.

Offline Sigz

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2010, 11:25:32 AM »
Yes. But you haven't answered my question. Does it even make a difference? I only saw the Council the first time I went to the Citadel, where they told me they were gonna reinstate my Spectre status. After that, they are never heard from again.

Maybe a better question is what happens in Tuchanka if Wrex is dead?

The council is pretty much non existent - if you kill the council, the balance of power swings to the humans, but then the new council refuses to even see you.

In Tuchanka, Wrex's brother becomes chief, and there's another dude who opposes Grunt's rite of passage that you have to deal with.
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Offline Scurvy!Dreams

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2010, 12:32:18 PM »
The theory is that Wrex living puts the Krogan on your side for the final confrontation with the Reapers, whereas if he dies you don't get any Krogan help.

Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2010, 12:35:22 PM »
I can't see how Renegade Shepard will be able to beat the reapers. I had him kill the Rachnai, kill Wrex, Kill everyone at Zhu's Hope, kill the Council, and half my team died.

Offline skydivingninja

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2010, 01:16:33 PM »
I can't see how Renegade Shepard will be able to beat the reapers. I had him kill the Rachnai, kill Wrex, Kill everyone at Zhu's Hope, kill the Council, and half my team died.

There'll be more cannon fodder in Mass Effect 3.  :xbones

But I feel the same way.  It just feels sort of wrong playing though Mass Effect 2 as a Renegade, story-wise and it actually makes me feel like a bad person.  Its not like KOTOR where the evil options can be incredibly hilarious, you're pretty fucking evil if you go full renegade.  I've been doing a sort of balancing act, doing more renegade actions than paragon, but being nice to people I like, like Garrus, Thane, Samara (I want that Reave power with Advanced Training, dammit!), and Mordin (by far the coolest character).  The scene where he sings is great.

Offline Sigz

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #31 on: February 12, 2010, 01:26:57 PM »
I can't see how Renegade Shepard will be able to beat the reapers. I had him kill the Rachnai, kill Wrex, Kill everyone at Zhu's Hope, kill the Council, and half my team died.

There'll be more cannon fodder in Mass Effect 3.  :xbones

But I feel the same way.  It just feels sort of wrong playing though Mass Effect 2 as a Renegade, story-wise and it actually makes me feel like a bad person.  Its not like KOTOR where the evil options can be incredibly hilarious, you're pretty fucking evil if you go full renegade.  I've been doing a sort of balancing act, doing more renegade actions than paragon, but being nice to people I like, like Garrus, Thane, Samara (I want that Reave power with Advanced Training, dammit!), and Mordin (by far the coolest character).  The scene where he sings is great.

I've noticed that in both Dragon Age and Mass Effect - I just can't bring myself to be a total asshole, I feel too bad about it. I'm on my second playthrough now though and I've been doing more of the 'badass' renegade actions, like threatening the other NPCs and shooting them in the middle of conversations when you get the chance. I'm still good to my people and the other innocent NPCs though.
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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #32 on: February 12, 2010, 01:33:00 PM »
I can't see how Renegade Shepard will be able to beat the reapers. I had him kill the Rachnai, kill Wrex, Kill everyone at Zhu's Hope, kill the Council, and half my team died.

There'll be more cannon fodder in Mass Effect 3.  :xbones

But I feel the same way.  It just feels sort of wrong playing though Mass Effect 2 as a Renegade, story-wise and it actually makes me feel like a bad person.  Its not like KOTOR where the evil options can be incredibly hilarious, you're pretty fucking evil if you go full renegade.  I've been doing a sort of balancing act, doing more renegade actions than paragon, but being nice to people I like, like Garrus, Thane, Samara (I want that Reave power with Advanced Training, dammit!), and Mordin (by far the coolest character).  The scene where he sings is great.

I've noticed that in both Dragon Age and Mass Effect - I just can't bring myself to be a total asshole, I feel too bad about it. I'm on my second playthrough now though and I've been doing more of the 'badass' renegade actions, like threatening the other NPCs and shooting them in the middle of conversations when you get the chance. I'm still good to my people and the other innocent NPCs though.

Spoilers:

Exactly, I can never bring myself to be a dick to my team. I can pretty much be an asshole through everything else, but when I yell at my team members it makes me think they hate me! Although I thought being evil in KOTOR is just plain fucked up, at least at the part where you end up killing half your team.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #33 on: February 12, 2010, 01:54:53 PM »
I've started a renegade playthrough and I don't like it as much as a paragon or balanced playthrough. You feel like such a cock stain half the time; for example, there are like four different instances where someone's gasping their last breaths in front of you and you can save them with medi-gel, but to be a full-on renegade you have to just let them die. Really weird feeling, even though it's just a game. :lol
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Re: Mass Effect 2 *Spoilers*
« Reply #34 on: February 12, 2010, 01:55:43 PM »
I've started a renegade playthrough and I don't like it as much as a paragon or balanced playthrough. You feel like such a cock stain half the time; for example, there are like four different instances where someone's gasping their last breaths in front of you and you can save them with medi-gel, but to be a full-on renegade you have to just let them die. Really weird feeling, even though it's just a game. :lol

Yeah, I just can't go through with it, it's too terrible.

I'm such a loser.
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