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General => Movies and TV => Topic started by: KevShmev on February 08, 2015, 07:45:45 PM
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It begins tonight. Should be interesting to see how good it is.
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The product placement in the first five minutes was painful.
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I'm going to give it a shot despite not having watched one episode of breaking bad.
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Any idea what the electromagnetism disorder Chuck has is?
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That ending though :o
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Oh my god!
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I have a hard time decipher if you guys reactions are positive or negative!? :lol
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Oh my god!
Yeah. Did not see that coming. Feck.
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Seems way too early to start bringing in so many Breaking Bad crutches.
The brother relationship was easily the best part of the show. So there were good things and worrying things.
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I have a hard time decipher if you guys reactions are positive or negative!? :lol
Entertaining and I will definitely watch more I just hope that it becomes its own thing and not too much BB fan service.
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Yeah it was a fun episode. A bit depressing seeing him live through all that shit, but still good.
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Since I hadn't watched Breaking Bad, the references were over my head, but it was really good so far. Can't wait for the second part tonight
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Seems way too early to start bringing in so many Breaking Bad crutches.
Not encouraging. I haven't watched the episode yet, but I likely won't stick with it if this becomes a trend.
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Seems way too early to start bringing in so many Breaking Bad crutches.
Not encouraging. I haven't watched the episode yet, but I likely won't stick with it if this becomes a trend.
The funny part is: If you didn't watch Breaking Bad, the cameos would be irrelevant and therefore, wouldn't detract from the fact that some good story lines were set up last night.
Michael McKean is definitely an interesting part of the cast. Like that guy quite a bit and there is something very interesting going on with his character.
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Yeah, considering how it was set up, I don't think Breaking Bad is exactly required to enjoy thi (though a concurrent splurge would definitely help immersion for those who haven't seen it yet). Even if you were a devoted fan, we were introduced to and are now following James McGill as opposed to the character we already knew. And considering what they could have done, that it's just the first episode and judging it by one hour alone, I disagree that the references are acting as crutches as opposed to nods they could fit in (aside from the relevant character reprisals, which are likely more story than anything and who wasn't kind of tickled by that last cameo?) though how they treat this the rest of the season remains to be seen. I loved the opening sequence, the color of the TV lightly reflecting off of Saul's glasses in the black and white intro and the courtroom scene's slow buildup, etc, and the tone was also set very nicely and the shifts in humor and drama aren't as jarring as I thought they'd be.
One thing I thought was great was that they got Odenkirk to do his British accent already in the first episode. Sounds just as silly 20 years later lol. Fingers crossed for a scene where he and McKean just fuck about with the accents.
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I really enjoyed that episode. And I totally disagree about the BB nods being crutches.
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Was that Tuko?!
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Was that Tuko?!
No it was the chupacabra from The X-Files.
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They should start a cooking show featuring Tuco. I'd totally watch.
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They should start a cooking show featuring Tuco. I'd totally watch.
They already had that. It was called Breaking Bad.
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They should start a cooking show featuring Tuco. I'd totally watch.
They already had that. It was called Breaking Bad.
Ha nice one :tup
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I honestly thought this show was going to be "Joey" after "Friends", but it seems like it will be "Fraiser" after "Cheers". I loved that first episode, and I can't wait for tonight!!
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It will be a miracle if they manage to pull this off, with the same gripping thoroughness that Breaking Bad had, but they're off to a good start. I'm eagerly awaiting next week's show.
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Breaking Bad set a high hurdle. If the show is judged on its own merits, it will probably have better reviews. Even half as good as Breaking Bad is still better than most TV shows out there.
SPOILER
One of my favorite moments was when Saul's (I mean Jimmy's) brother told Saul he couldn't use his own name for his law practice. Is this where "Saul Goodman" is born?
They really couldn't have picked a better Breaking Bad character for a spin off.
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I'm just waiting for someone to go "It's all good, man!", and see the lightbulb switch on for Jimmy. I don't know if they'll do that, but it would be funny.
The second episode was great. The desert scene especially.
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Any idea what the electromagnetism disorder Chuck has is?
Pacemaker related?
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Wait, this isn't a spoiler thread? Do we need to do small-text or spoiler warnings when posting things about an episode which has already aired?
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I think once "Spoillers" is added to the threat title, anything goes.
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I've never watched one episode of Breaking Bad.....although I'm constantly reminded how much I'm missing out on.....but anyway, I watched the first espisode of this show and I liked it alot. I think that despite not having any BB reference to fall back on this show could be pretty good.
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Any idea what the electromagnetism disorder Chuck has is?
Pacemaker related?
I'm guessing strictly psychological at this point
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2nd episode was excellent. Much better than the first.
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Any idea what the electromagnetism disorder Chuck has is?
Pacemaker related?
I'm guessing strictly psychological at this point
Yeah, that's the vibe I got from the 'space blanket' scene as well.
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2nd episode was excellent. Much better than the first.
Agreed. That scene in the desert was fantastic.
I've never watched one episode of Breaking Bad.
(https://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4289723/you-serious-clark-o.gif)
I think once "Spoillers" is added to the threat title, anything goes.
It is now. Don't want to know what is going on? Don't read this thread. :biggrin:
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I've never watched one episode of Breaking Bad.
(https://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4289723/you-serious-clark-o.gif)
Yep. I consistently get hazed for it as well by my brothers and friends who've watched it. They can't believe someone who watches as much TV as I do didn't watch that show. I'm sure I'll binge watch it sooner or later....
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I think it should be sooner rather than later. :biggrin:
Plus, winter is a good time to do it, while you're inside a lot and before that deep playoff run the Blues will make in April and May. ;) :hat
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For the record, threads that deal with a current subject are inherently expected to have spoilers of all readily available content.
For example, this thread is obviously going to have info about recent episodes as soon as they air, and nobody should have to feel to hide their feelings or spoilers. The onus is on people who haven't seen the episode to avoid the thread till they do.
On the other hand, let's say this is the Rush thread, and someone obtained a legitimate copy of the setlist for the tour that started in a few months. That's what you would need to hide. And again, once the tour starts, if you don't want spoilers, don't come into the thread.
Hope that makes sense.
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Just finished the 2nd episode.
When you immediately check your DVR schedule to see if you have to wait a whole week for the next episode, you know you are hooked.
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I got spoiled on Breaking Bad. Waited till the series ended to start it, and as such was able to pick up the seasons and basically binge watch the entire season. I could barely stand the 5 minutes it took me to piss and grab a drink between episodes, and now... an entire week? fgafogijafogkljafgl;
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That desert scene was fucking tense.
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Just caught up on the two. I'm liking it a lot more than I thought I would. Michael McKean's character is so awesomely weird. And Bob Odenkirk makes me nostalgic for BB.
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Every time I see Michael McKean in something, I secretly hope for Harry Shearer and Christopher Guest to do a guest spot.
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Every time I see Michael McKean in something, I secretly hope for Harry Shearer and Christopher Guest to do a guest spot.
That is Season 4. As part of McKean's therapy for his illness, he must play ELECTRIC guitar. Spinal Tap is born.
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I like the small ties to Breaking Bad and it is my favorite tv show ever. But Gilligan appears to be playing it smart in his writing of where this show may go. So far 2 brilliant episodes. Odenkirk is amazing as usual. I am sure we will see more tie ins to BB but I like so far that the show is standing on its own merits. It is a tuff thing to do to make a sequal/prequel to the greatest tv show ever. Odenkirk already gets an emmy nod for the desert scene. This show has real potential. They have already introduced Mike into the picture who was Gus right hand. Will be interesting to see where they take it. Possibly a Gus intro soon? That would be awesome.
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I hope they don't bring Fring in too soon (from what I gather I believe Mike ends up working as Saul's PI?), or even at all. I would hate for this show to bring in too many BB elements and sorta ride those coattails out. Especially since - like you say, the show stands on its own merits. I think its amazing that that's evident just two episodes in.
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I agree. I trust Gilligan. Inevitably there will be tie ins as we have seen (aka Tuco, Mike) but if he does it properly it can be an awesome series. I would like it to be a stand alone series, but there will be tie ins. Needs to be done to see how he became Saul. There is no way of not using BB back story to do that. One thing I really hope is if they are going to introduce the BB guys (Jessie, Walter, he waits a loooooooooooooooong time)
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They have already introduced Mike into the picture who was Gus right hand. Will be interesting to see where they take it. Possibly a Gus intro soon? That would be awesome.
Tuco (sp?) was supposed to be Tuco, but was Mike supposed to be Mike ... or just a neat little cameo? Was that made clear? The episode 3 previews suggested Mike steps out of his role (toll booth).
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I'm pretty sure Mike is Mike and that he ends up working for Saul. Which would be awesome given the shit way he went out on BB. He was always one of my favourites. The sticker gag had me laughing out loud.
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I'm pretty sure Mike is Mike and that he ends up working for Saul. Which would be awesome given the shit way he went out on BB. He was always one of my favourites. The sticker gag had me laughing out loud.
I'm trying to put together Mike's back story from BB with where he is in this one. BB had the back story of him trying to get cash to his past criminal peers (children). So is the toll booth gig just him in the middle of running some criminal scheme?
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I don't think Saul ever met Gus. I could be wrong about that, but I seem to recall something in that direction. So I'm not expecting to see him ever.
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The way I read it Mike works for "Saul" eventually. as a PI. But he eventually works for Gus. How that tie in can be interesting. A rumour I heard is that "Saul" eventually knows Badger prior to the BB stuff. I just hope as awesome as the first 2 episodes have been is they don't destroy what BB was. But I Digress and I trust Gilligan.
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Did Mike and Saul interact in BB at all? I can't remember, its probably time for a re-watch. Maybe they work together in BCS and end up having some kinda falling out leading to Mike working as a solo PI, eventually landing work with Fring.
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I don't think Saul ever met Gus. I could be wrong about that, but I seem to recall something in that direction. So I'm not expecting to see him ever.
I do not think they did either,not face to face. But they both knew of each other.They had to. But the Mike/Gus/ Saul connection exists.
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Spoilers for those who've never seen Breaking Bad:
When Saul got Walt a meeting with Gus, he had no clue who Gus was. He knew "a guy who knows a guy..who knows another guy."
Jessie did state that Saul got Emilio and Krazy-8 out of hot water before, so we might see those guys.
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I would have to do a recheck but Saul and Gus never met in person but knew of each other. The tie would be Mike to Saul and Gus. If I recall there is an epsisode where Saul refers to Gus. HMMMMMM now im doing a BB binge lol
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Right, but that was long after Walt was associated with him. Prior to Walt working for Gus, Saul had no idea who Gus was.
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Spoilers for those who've never seen Breaking Bad:
When Saul got Walt a meeting with Gus, he had no clue who Gus was. He knew "a guy who knows a guy..who knows another guy."
Jessie did state that Saul got Emilio and Krazy-8 out of hot water before, so we might see those guys.
That's right. I forgot that. I was going to say that Saul already knew Krazy 8.
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Right, but that was long after Walt was associated with him. Prior to Walt working for Gus, Saul had no idea who Gus was.
in BB yes. But if Mike was already working for Gus, well eventually, the Saul .........Mike connection can exist.
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Right, but that was long after Walt was associated with him. Prior to Walt working for Gus, Saul had no idea who Gus was.
But what if Saul met Gus the businessman with no knowledge of Gus the drug kingpin.
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good point. he just owned a few chicken joints. but I still find the gus-mike-saul thing interesting
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I'm pretty sure Mike is Mike and that he ends up working for Saul. Which would be awesome given the shit way he went out on BB. He was always one of my favourites. The sticker gag had me laughing out loud.
I'm trying to put together Mike's back story from BB with where he is in this one. BB had the back story of him trying to get cash to his past criminal peers (children). So is the toll booth gig just him in the middle of running some criminal scheme?
How far back timewise is BCS? His granddaughter could be an infant.
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I wasn't a huge fan of Tuco in BB. He worked as a character that lasted the length of time he did, but I think I would've got tired of him had he been around longer, and I didn't get why people seemed to rave about him so much after. So when the first episode ended with him, my first thought was, "ah fuck, really?"
The desert scene made me a bit more optimistic though. It played up to his character - paranoid, savage, not as bright as the best - absolutely perfectly. And they seem to be going to utilise his brother (?) as much as, maybe even more than him, and he seemed interesting.
Jimmy bartering with Tuco was hilarious.
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Jimmy bartering with Tuco was hilarious.
I liked that Jimmy/Saul was across the finish line, but actually put that in jeopardy to *save* the other guys. Everything he does is always a question of "is this all about himself or does he actually care about others?"
I'm betting that most people in real life would have just kept walking once they saw their own finish line.
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Depends on how much guilt they would've felt since he kept saying that he was the one that put them in that situation. He just seems like a normal guy trying to be shrewd that got caught with his pants down instead of a sociopath that would've just let Tuco have his way with them once he was freed.
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Jimmy gave his all to save those idiots, but I think Saul would've walked.
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True. Saul was a real puss towards the end of BB.
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True. Saul was a real puss towards the end of BB.
Yeah, looks like he's picking up where he left off. Not sure what to make of this show just yet. The appearances of Mike and Tuco aren't really doing much for the show. Maybe too early to tell.
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So since a name change is imminent, I bet they're going to address the origins of "S'all good, man."
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Pretty good episode tonight- I hope they can keep this up...
I'm still trying to wrap my head around a show all about Saul, as a serious character no less, but I'm getting there.
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Purposely avoided this thread while I watched the episode. Banks is definitely Mike. First time I saw him, I figured it was just a cameo by Banks rather than Banks' character, Mike.
The fact that Saul keeps being put in situations where the *honorable* move is the least safe move is nice screenwriting.
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Of course he's Mike. I didn't even know that was being questioned. That would be a godawful "cameo" to throw Banks in and not have him be Mike. Why confuse the fanbase that way? And why show him in the trailer?
Not to mention it was announced a long time ago that Mike would show up from time to time in BCS.
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Not to mention it was announced a long time ago that Mike would show up from time to time in BCS.
I guess if you follow that stuff. I try not to as it usually ruins shows/movies.
Cameos are pretty common where the actor shows up, but isn't the character. I didn't catch the year yet, but I think is supposed to be about 2001 or 2002 based off the time stamp on his first case ... or about 6 years before Breaking Bad. That seems like quite the rise for Mike to go from Toll Booth troll to having so much responsibility with Gus. And we know he had less than normal activity prior to 2002, so it is a strange job position for him to currently be in. As I said earlier, perhaps it is a temporary job so he can talk to D.A.'s to get some inside info in a unsuspecting opinion. Or maybe he was retiring to a simple job like that only to be dragged back in.
So far, lots of unanswered questions.
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Great episode. This show is definetely managing to show the same 'spirit' as Breaking Bad did, but still be it's own thing. Which is really the perfect thing for it to be that everyone hoped for.
And I love how Jimmy just told the girl everything, as in actually explained the situation. That's what real life people do. They don't always lie in weird ways as so many people do in other shows, and is something that has always bothered me.
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I like this so far, but I have to be honest: if this were a brand new show, with no Breaking Bad having existed, I would not consider this "must see TV." But, because of the Breaking Bad factor, I am all in for the duration.
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I like this so far, but I have to be honest: if this were a brand new show, with no Breaking Bad having existed, I would not consider this "must see TV." But, because of the Breaking Bad factor, I am all in for the duration.
I'm teetering on dumping it. I've enjoyed each episode.....but I am not just dying to watch it. I figure though that I've given less shows a season to win me over....so I'll probably do the same here.
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That's basically how I feel. I'm interested, but can fully acknowledge a lot of my interest is based on the BB link. It doesn't feel like a show I would be watching without that. I'm giving it a chance because they're most likely still setting bigger stuff up, but if it doesn't get much more interesting than this within the season, I can't see myself returning to it.
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I figure Gilligan knows where he set the bar with the fandom, so he figures he's able to get away with drawing out the setup a bit longer. Which seems to be the case.
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You guys are crazy. This show is awesome so far.
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You guys are crazy. This show is awesome so far.
yessir
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You guys are crazy. This show is awesome so far.
yessir
In my case it's less about how good the show is and more about trying to filter the amount of shows I'm watching. It's out of control for me. I'm trying to get to a manageable number of shows I enjoy to where I'm not killing myself on the weekends to watch 16 hours of tv shows on Friday and Saturday nights. Anyway, I do agree that it is a good show....I've enjoyed it....but I'm still just not fully 'in' at this point, that's all
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Very few shows, including a lot of great shows, are HOLY FUCK BALLS AMAZING three episodes in. You can't expect mid-run excellence three episodes in.
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Very few shows, including a lot of great shows, are HOLY FUCK BALLS AMAZING three episodes in. You can't expect mid-run excellence three episodes in.
I know. And that's why at the least its getting the full season. And again.....I do like the show! :lol
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You guys are crazy. This show is awesome so far.
yessir
In my case it's less about how good the show is and more about trying to filter the amount of shows I'm watching. It's out of control for me. I'm trying to get to a manageable number of shows I enjoy to where I'm not killing myself on the weekends to watch 16 hours of tv shows on Friday and Saturday nights. Anyway, I do agree that it is a good show....I've enjoyed it....but I'm still just not fully 'in' at this point, that's all
Holy crap! What shows are you following?
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I have nothing else to watch on a Monday night so this works for me.
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You guys are crazy. This show is awesome so far.
yessir
In my case it's less about how good the show is and more about trying to filter the amount of shows I'm watching. It's out of control for me. I'm trying to get to a manageable number of shows I enjoy to where I'm not killing myself on the weekends to watch 16 hours of tv shows on Friday and Saturday nights. Anyway, I do agree that it is a good show....I've enjoyed it....but I'm still just not fully 'in' at this point, that's all
Holy crap! What shows are you following?
Not in any particular order
The Walking Dead
The talking Dead
Better call Saul
Storage Wars
12 Monkeys
Helix
Vikings
Face Off
Wizard Wars
Shark Tank
Yukon Men
Alaska: Final Frontier
(Not currently on)
The Intruders
Hannibal
Survivor
Deadliest Catch
Plus, it's Hockey Season so I rarely miss a Blues game. Like right now....watching them get their a$$ handed to them by Dallas
It seems like I'm missing a couple shows also....those are just the ones that popped in my head.
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Sheesh! I can count the shows I follow on one hand I think. That's crazy.
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Sheesh! I can count the shows I follow on one hand I think. That's crazy.
I've been trying to cut it down for a while. I have some sort of problem I think....only because I generally don't start trying to watch the recordings until 8 or 9 o'clock Fri/Sat nights and stay up until 2 or 3 am....full well knowing I have to get up early and do the dad thing of running to games or whatever. Oh well.....
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Very few shows, including a lot of great shows, are HOLY FUCK BALLS AMAZING three episodes in. You can't expect mid-run excellence three episodes in.
True, although Breaking Bad did it. By the time the 3rd episode of that was over, I was in balls deep. :lol :lol Then again, Breaking Bad is the best thing ever, so holding everything else to their standard is just unfair.
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Breaking Bad and The Americans might be the only shows I was balls deep in that early in a series.
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I follow 12 shows, only 4 of which are currently coming out weekly, one of which is Better Call Saul. Some shows that are currently on TV that I want to see I'll just wait with until one of the ones I do follow ends.
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Just caught up with the latest episode. It was kinda... meh. Hopefully the action picks up. Good to see Mike getting more screen time!
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Breaking Bad and The Americans might be the only shows I was balls deep in that early in a series.
The Sorpanos grabbed me just as quickly as BB did. Episode 1 wowed me and I was "all in" after that.
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Sad as this may sound, Better Call Saul is the first show not on Comedy Central in many years I've followed from day 1. Everything else I always watch on DVD after the fact, or catch up a few seasons in and then watch from there on out. Hell, even this series only partially counts as I'd probably never have started watching it already if it wasn't for breaking bad.
I guess I typically wait till a show is a few seasons in at least and get a good look at the feelings towards a show on a whole than jumping in from the start.
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Sad as this may sound, Better Call Saul is the first show not on Comedy Central in many years I've followed from day 1. Everything else I always watch on DVD after the fact, or catch up a few seasons in and then watch from there on out. Hell, even this series only partially counts as I'd probably never have started watching it already if it wasn't for breaking bad.
I guess I typically wait till a show is a few seasons in at least and get a good look at the feelings towards a show on a hole than jumping in from the start.
That's what I used to do, but for some reason lately I decided to put a couple new shows that look interesting in the DVR bank. There is so much crap that it feels like work instead of relaxing. I need to go back to my old method (your method). I might miss that one cult classic that was only on for one season, but its just TV.
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Haven't watched ep3 yet so I skipped the last page or so, but is the nail salon that Saul uses for his office the same one he tried to get Jesse to buy for his money laundering? I think it is.
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It is.
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I'm liking the show so far. I recently started re-watching BB, and I will say that while S1 was good, the show definitely improved over time. S1 on its own legs was not fantastic, but it set up a great show, and only got better with each season IMO.
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I think all the post-hype and all the often revisited moments online has made some people forget how slow Breaking Bad was a lot of the time. Not saying it wasn't good, it is one of the best shows, but it was really slow almost all the time. Which is probably why I haven't got as my #1 show as many others do.
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I think the average person didn't start watching Breaking Bad until it was a season or two in and started to hear how good it was. I recall watching two seasons in a short amount of time via Netflix. So that probably contributed to not realizing the slow pace.
I do know that while I was catching up, I kept telling myself "last episode today ... got things to do". Then that episode ended and all I can think is "I gotta see what happens next ... one more"
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I'm no longer on the fence. After tonight's episode, I'm a full fledged fan of this show. I just didn't want the episode to end tonight.
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Yeah it was a great one.
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I'm no longer on the fence. After tonight's episode, I'm a full fledged fan of this show. I just didn't want the episode to end tonight.
I agree. I jumped off the fence and am now playing in it's back yard. I like the way they've used the past to give you a frame of mind of what he's capable of and the way he thinks.
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I jumped off the fence and am now camping in it's back yard.
Fixed ;)
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The whole episode was great, but the beginning was nonstop great lines
1. I'll come to your McDonald's where you work. I'll buy the whole damn place and I'll fire ya. I'll say drop your mops you buttholes cause you're fired. Then I'll roundhouse kick you right in your stupid head.
2. You wanna talk about legal ... I mean slavery ... human slavery
3. You're the kind of lawyer guilty people hire (here's your bribe)
4. You assume that criminals are gonna be smarter than they are
All that in just the first few minutes.
This episode was just plain great from beginning to end.
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2. You wanna talk about legal ... I mean slavery ... human slavery
Those lines of dialogue were indeed funny. "Yeah... This is right up there with that.." :lol
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Totally agree, that was an awesome episode. Great to see a bit of action happening, and the 'Saul' character taking shape.
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I really enjoyed this week's episode. Gotta like the slow burn they are doing with showing how Jimmy transforms into Saul.
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"Saul Goodman, yeah. Like, 's'all good, man'"
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some awesome music/music references in the last episode!
- a Rush poster in the background . . .
- while Chicago is playing (it was "Listen" if I recall correctly) . . .
- right after the big dude was humming "Smoke on the Water"
- then later they played some Dave Brubeck during the scene where Saul was calling all the reporters
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"Saul Goodman, yeah. Like, 's'all good, man'"
I said that to myself a couple weeks ago and had a complete "...oh god dammit" moment right after.
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"Saul Goodman, yeah. Like, 's'all good, man'"
I said that to myself a couple weeks ago and had a complete "...oh god dammit" moment right after.
I never picked up on this during the entire run of Breaking Bad. I nearly fell out of my chair when he dropped that line. Awesome!
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Saul does actually point it out somewhere in an episode Breaking Bad. Not sure when.
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Saul does actually point it out somewhere in an episode Breaking Bad. Not sure when.
So much happened in Breaking Bad that it is easy to miss something from what was at the time of Saul's introduction, a minor character. I missed it from Breaking Bad and I'm betting it was as simple as somebody interrupting me during viewing (which happens frequently).
And the name is one of those things that makes you :facepalm: because it was staring you in the face, but he pronounced it "mon" instead of "man" so it didn't click. As soon as you pronounce it literally :facepalm:
I liken it to my YTSE Jam moment. A friend and I got so hung up on what Y.T.S.E. stood for as an acronym, that we missed the obvious. We actually found out by meeting Portnoy before an I&W era tour. This was a time when he would literally just come out and talk to the fanatics like us (showing up hours early to a concert so we could get right up to the stage). He talked to us for so long, we actually ran out of things to ask him. But there was this exchange:
Calvin: So what does the YTSE in YTSE Jam stand for?
Portnoy: Do you know the name of our band before Dream Theater?
Calvin: I heard it was Majesty?
Portnoy: Ok ... now think about Majesty and look at the name YTSE Jam again.
<Play Jeopardy music>
Calvin: :facepalm:
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I did not know that. Cool.
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Random question that I'm not sure has been addressed here or not, as I only did a quick scroll. If I remember correctly from Breaking Bad, Mike was one of Gus's guys, right? I remember a scene where Walt took Mike to Saul's office ater Gus was killed so they could meet. Saul and Mike didn't know each other, from what I remember. So, now we're being told in "Better Caul Saul" that Saul and Mike did, in fact, know each other all along?
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Having a hard time getting into this show. Yeah, I realize Saul is trying to make a name for himself but the storyline so far is so slow and not very interesting. Breaking Bad was lightyears ahead of this show.
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In terms of first episodes, I think BCS is doing a better job. But I do not believe that it will reach the same hights that BB did.
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Random question that I'm not sure has been addressed here or not, as I only did a quick scroll. If I remember correctly from Breaking Bad, Mike was one of Gus's guys, right? I remember a scene where Walt took Mike to Saul's office ater Gus was killed so they could meet. Saul and Mike didn't know each other, from what I remember. So, now we're being told in "Better Caul Saul" that Saul and Mike did, in fact, know each other all along?
IIRC, Saul sends Mike to clean up all the drug paraphernalia etc after Jane's drug overdose.
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In terms of first episodes, I think BCS is doing a better job. But I do not believe that it will reach the same hights that BB did.
I wouldn't put money on that yet. Saul Goodman is a more likeable character than Walter White.
Walter was kind of a dick with a superiority complex that tried to justify his bad behavior as necessary for his family.
Saul is a guy that is in a dick profession (lawyer) that tried to go on the straight and narrow by building up his practice (not even making it paycheck to paycheck). The only person he is truly vindictive toward is Howard Hamlin. And the backstory seems to be that Hamlin screwed over Saul's brother big time. But he has definitely shown a ton more empathy that Walter White ever did.
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In terms of first episodes, I think BCS is doing a better job. But I do not believe that it will reach the same hights that BB did.
Okay, but that's an impossible standard. BB at its best crushes just about everything (except the early seasons of The Sopranos).
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Random question that I'm not sure has been addressed here or not, as I only did a quick scroll. If I remember correctly from Breaking Bad, Mike was one of Gus's guys, right? I remember a scene where Walt took Mike to Saul's office ater Gus was killed so they could meet. Saul and Mike didn't know each other, from what I remember. So, now we're being told in "Better Caul Saul" that Saul and Mike did, in fact, know each other all along?
IIRC, Saul sends Mike to clean up all the drug paraphernalia etc after Jane's drug overdose.
Yes, that's right! Why did I think Mike was one of gus's guys the whole time? So mike had connections with both gus and saul.
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Yes, that's right! Why did I think Mike was one of gus's guys the whole time? So mike had connections with both gus and saul.
Because Breaking Bad kind of was murky in Mike's relationship to Gus and Saul and which one was stronger. At least that's how I remember it.
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Probably my least favorite episode so far. It had some good bits, but I am 100% uninterested in Jimmy's elderly-law thing. Hopefully it won't be a thing for long. Also, the Chuck stuff works better when it's shorter.
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As with any prequel, the tough part is knowing the way things end up to some degree. For this, there's Kim Wexler. While things could end with Jimmy moving away and changing things, I have a bad feeling something bad happens to/with her at some point in the series.
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Probably my least favorite episode so far.
It felt like a calm before the storm episode.
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I enjoyed that episode a lot. I thought the whole thing with Chuck was great, and the beginning of telling the Mike story was nice.
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I enjoyed that episode a lot. I thought the whole thing with Chuck was great, and the beginning of telling the Mike story was nice.
I think we just enjoyed the previous episode so much, that this one was bound to feel less compelling. And the Mike story seems set up for next week.
So do you think Hamlin is just worried about a disability claim or cashing out Chuck's share of the partnership? Or do you think Chuck's problem was brought on by something related directly to the law firm?
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All I can say about tonight's episode is 'WOW'.....such a strong episode. Acting was top notch.
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Yeah the episode was really good. Really cool seeing Mike this way, and his entire fake-drunk-thing was awesome. Did we ever hear anything about his son in BB?
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No. I believe there were two references to him being a cop before (the first in his "half measures" speech to Walt, and the second when Hank and Gomez interrogated him early in Season 5), but aside from Hank's comment about his career as a cop ending..."dramatically," there was nothing else.
Anyway, yeah, that was terrific last night. :tup :tup
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I enjoyed that episode a lot. I thought the whole thing with Chuck was great, and the beginning of telling the Mike story was nice.
I think we just enjoyed the previous episode so much, that this one was bound to feel less compelling. And the Mike story seems set up for next week.
So do you think Hamlin is just worried about a disability claim or cashing out Chuck's share of the partnership? Or do you think Chuck's problem was brought on by something related directly to the law firm?
I think Saul mentions in one of the first episodes that Hamlin is more worried about Chuck bowing out of the company and taking his share of the company with him, meaning that Hamlin would have to sell the law firm to pay Chuck out, like 6 million dollars or something like that? I may have that completely wrong.
Just caught up on the last two episodes, really good stuff and some amazing acting from Jonathan Banks. It was a relief (comic relief, lulz) to see Saul in this episode. I miss his goofy ass when he's not around, especially with an episode as heavy as that. I love that they're digging a bit deeper into Mike's story in this, he's definitely one of the characters in BB that deserved more attention.
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I really enjoyed the shading in of Mikes back story. I thought Johnathon banks acted more in that one episode than he did in the entire BB series.
That might be a tad unfair though as he is really good at playing under stated.
Me and my Mrs are hooked on this series though. Excellent choice for a spin off. It has the potential to be a Frasier rather than a Joey.
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Last night's episode was pretty good.
I like how Saul was caught in the "you're in this with us" trap. So he went after the Achilles Heel of every thief; you can't report the goods you've stolen ... stolen.
This guy stole our money.
What money?
The money we stole.
So you admit you stole the money?
No, we didn't steal it. There is no money.
So the guy didn't steal any money then?
No, he stole it. Arrest him.
It's funny because the wife managed deviously controlling and utterly clueless at the same time.
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Great episode. Cool to see the beginning of Saul and Mike's future working relationship.
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This series is showing some promise. Mike is adding a whole new dimension to the storyline. Starting to like it. :biggrin:
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I'm all caught up on this show after last night. I'm loving it so far. I'm so happy it's not a bust.
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Really good episode. Halfway through I thought they were heading towards a big court case finale with Saul pulling a miracle out of his ass and Kim leaving HH&M to help out. Now that they settled that case, I'm really curious how they're going to end the season over the next 3 episodes.
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There's only three episodes left?? :eek
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Yup. Breaking Bad only had a 7 episode first season, then went to 13 for seasons 2-4 (two sets of 8 for season 5). With the way things are going, I'm feeling good that we'll get a full 13 for next season.
EDIT: Season 2 is confirmed to have 13 episodes (https://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/06/19/amc-releases-first-photo-from-better-call-saul/275154/).
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Really good episode. Halfway through I thought they were heading towards a big court case finale with Saul pulling a miracle out of his ass and Kim leaving HH&M to help out. Now that they settled that case, I'm really curious how they're going to end the season over the next 3 episodes.
I had the same plot possibility going in my head as I was watching it. That's what I like about the show so far. As you are watching, there are quite a few possibilities about how something could play out. And the one that actually plays out is the most surprising one.
The feeling I'm getting from the entire story arc of season 1 is simply:
Saul, by nature, is a scammer. But he's trying to do the right thing with the idea that you push through doing things the right way and eventually people notice your integrity. This is enforced by his brother saying exactly that. And even though his brother is in a bad place now, he obviously at one time did very well based off his own advice. But every time he does the right thing, he just seems to get the short end of the stick. But every time he runs a scam, he gets ahead.
Take a bribe from people that are douchebags anyway, get ahead.
White hat scam to get the douchebags back to the right deal that also helps his biggest friend, his dream of expanding gets compromised.
The whole season seems to be the theme that schemers get ahead. Integrity's "feel good moment" is short-lived when the bill collectors are knocking at your door.
So he will eventually make the compromise that he will be that scheming lawyer, but justify it by scamming people he considers had it coming to them.
He's breaking relatively bad.
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Betsy Kettleman is bat shit insane, but kinda hot, too.
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Betsy Kettleman is bat shit insane, but kinda hot, too.
I'd even consider the character even somewhat effective. She is a 1 to 2 step planner, and she's not bad at arranging those plans. But she fails to connect steps 8 and 9 to steps 1 and 2 when it matters. She's playing checkers to Saul's chess (overused, but fits)
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In terms of first episodes, I think BCS is doing a better job. But I do not believe that it will reach the same hights that BB did.
I wouldn't put money on that yet. Saul Goodman is a more likeable character than Walter White.
Walter was kind of a dick with a superiority complex that tried to justify his bad behavior as necessary for his family.
Saul is a guy that is in a dick profession (lawyer) that tried to go on the straight and narrow by building up his practice (not even making it paycheck to paycheck). The only person he is truly vindictive toward is Howard Hamlin. And the backstory seems to be that Hamlin screwed over Saul's brother big time. But he has definitely shown a ton more empathy that Walter White ever did.
I basically agree with this.
And I think that's part of why I'm really loving this show so far, more so than Breaking Bad. Both shows are fairly slow-moving, that's all part of the style (BB literally only kicked up the pace in the second half of season 5), but BB was all centred around Walt who was basically a bit of a dick. He was a fairly interesting character, and I do like the show, but I found it hard to care much about him and actually found myself caring more about a number of the more peripheral characters.
Whereas two of my favourite characters in BB were Mike and Saul, so a prequel show centering primarily on those two (at least so far) is much more up my alley and already I'm finding it really engaging. If the quality keeps up then I expect to end up liking it quite a lot more than BB.
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I'm glad that Mike is getting so much focus on the show. I thought he'd have a few things to do here and there but mostly be used as a bridge from the BB universe. I'm thrilled that he has a main role.
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Yeah, he's a really good character.
I think it also works well because we didn't really get to see that much of his character/personality/background in BB. Expanding him into a main character now makes sense, and I think we've already seen more variety and depth from him than in the whole of BB.
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Just caught up, great episode. Some really awesome cinematography in it as well, which is always neece. I'm not sure I'm as sucked in as was after 7 episodes of BB, but I'm still into it in a rather large way.
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If the quality keeps up then I expect to end up liking it quite a lot more than BB.
I definitely think BCSaul has a good chance of surpassing BBad, and I absolutely loved BB.
One thing is for sure. I'm 100% sold on BCSaul being on its way to an all time classic show for me. They'd have to have something pretty ridiculous happen for me to abandon it at this point. Like most people, it gets recorded on my DVR. Most TV shows (and even movies) don't get immediate viewing from me. In fact, sometimes I let it build up 10 episodes and then binge watch those. But not BCSaul. As soon as I see that BCSaul icon in my recordings list, I press play. If I'm in the middle of doing something that can wait, it waits. Can't even think of another current show I have that gets that kind of fanaticism out of me.
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Some really awesome cinematography in it as well, which is always neece.
Good point. I think the cinematography so far has been at least on a par with the last two or three seasons of BB, which was a big step up from the first couple of seasons which were mostly a lot more straightforward.
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Coming from a guy who hasn't watched BB (yet) this series easily stands on it's own. I understand that there are characters and 'easter eggs' in BCS.....but as a stand alone series this is more than standing on it's own. It's very well written....as has been mentioned the cinematography has been great.....characters are strong....it's just a good series. I'm digging it for sure.
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Coming from a guy who hasn't watched BB (yet) this series easily stands on it's own.
Actually, I think it would be even better not having seen BB yet. That is the biggest problem with a show going in the past. Certain people you know 100% will not die. And that was part of the BB thrill. Is this guy (or chick) finally gonna get their come uppance?
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Another good episode.
I really liked the attorney sit down session. Really showed the difference between the "standard" attorney and Saul. Attorneys really do have a "hey, what you been up to?" talk that goes on between "enemy" attorneys. Sometimes it is just separating work and personal, sometimes it is a veneer to catch others off guard. Saul on the other hand definitely has a problem with being the "snarky" attorney. It could be part of the reason real success is eluding him. That and the "not a real college" thing brought out in this episode.
There is, however, lots of passive aggressive talk that happens. "Oh were you not aware of that?" type of talk.
Or an exchange like:
"Did you not catch that? Should we have the deposition / meeting notes read back to you?"
"No. I think we all understand what was said."
"Well, I think there's some doubt here, so let's just have it re-entered."
A way to jab and put an exclamation on a point they want repeated for effect, disguised as being helpful that everybody in the room knows is anything but.
But Saul is more straight forward snarky. Which stems from his inferiority complex spelled out in greater detail this episode.
Great stuff.
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Yeah, cool episode. Great to see Chuck laying the smack down on those jabroni lawyers.
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Good episode. While I didn't care at all about the whole 'elder law' thing in the first place, I'm glad it led to something bigger and that it wasn't just a pit stop in Jimmy's career. And to see him do some proper lawyering was fun, I hope there's more of that. Also, I'd love to see him in court some more. Maybe next week.
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Good episode. While I didn't care at all about the whole 'elder law' thing in the first place, I'm glad it led to something bigger and that it wasn't just a pit stop in Jimmy's career. And to see him do some proper lawyering was fun, I hope there's more of that. Also, I'd love to see him in court some more. Maybe next week.
Yep, agreed with all that, quality episode.
Somethings feels a little foreboding about it, as though something is going to go pretty hugely wrong. Maybe not, but something about it feels like it's not going as well as it seems.
Anyone else getting that feeling?
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Absolutely.
Chuck's firm will not be happy with him working with Jimmy on an outside case.
And I am curious where they go with Kim, since she is kind of caught in the middle. Howard will not be pleased when he finds out she was helping them.
But yeah, killer episode last night.
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Absolutely.
Chuck's firm will not be happy with him working with Jimmy on an outside case.
And I am curious where they go with Kim, since she is kind of caught in the middle. Howard will not be pleased when he finds out she was helping them.
This. Whatever settlement or the entire case is essentially going to get taken away from Jimmy.....he will miss some huge payday....like the $20mil Chuck said. Bummer for him....
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My bet is they win the case for a sum near that $20mil. And even though Chuck will be helpful, it will boil down to the legwork that Saul put in. And also finding a not so obvious angle to win (like the lawyers credited Chuck with during the sit down).
Then Hamlin will sweep in and threaten that Chuck was faking the whole time to go out on his own, threatening not just his job and the little (for an attorney of his stature) they are paying, but pension .. etc. etc., putting him in a "watched my whole life's work go up in smoke" moment.
So Saul will agree to letting Hamlin not just take their share of the attorney fees, but the fame as well. Just another notch in their belt, but it could have made Saul. They might even add insult to injury and *allow* Saul to be part of some big winning team picture or news story, only to be just outside of frame.
It won't just be the money they lose. It will be a full on ego rape.
At least that's my guess.
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What a fantastic episode. I can't get over how good this who actually is. It gets better every week. I can't really say much that hasn't already been said. I almost puked during the dumpster scene.
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My bet is they win the case for a sum near that $20mil. And even though Chuck will be helpful, it will boil down to the legwork that Saul put in. And also finding a not so obvious angle to win (like the lawyers credited Chuck with during the sit down).
Then Hamlin will sweep in and threaten that Chuck was faking the whole time to go out on his own, threatening not just his job and the little (for an attorney of his stature) they are paying, but pension .. etc. etc., putting him in a "watched my whole life's work go up in smoke" moment.
So Saul will agree to letting Hamlin not just take their share of the attorney fees, but the fame as well. Just another notch in their belt, but it could have made Saul. They might even add insult to injury and *allow* Saul to be part of some big winning team picture or news story, only to be just outside of frame.
It won't just be the money they lose. It will be a full on ego rape.
At least that's my guess.
^^^^^^^What he said
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I almost puked during the dumpster scene.
Yeah, they did a genuinely great job of making that really quite immersive and visceral. :lol
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Not just any dumpster scene. A senior citizen's dumpster. Some nice depends diapers in there.
Honestly, TV has gotten so loose with showing feces/vomit that it has ruined my "let's watch some TV while I eat my dinner" time. So when I see a scene like the dumpster scene, I more or less turn my head and just listen to what is happening until it sounds like the next scene has begun. If you guys are talking about puking, sounds like I made the right choice there. :laugh:
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Anyone else catch the Kettleman's mail box?
(https://i.imgur.com/ey5Z61A.png)
That's awesome.
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I'm catching up on the show today and the episode about Mike's past, what drove him to NM, that was just as great as anything done in BB!
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Tonight's episode. So effing awesome.
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Tonight's episode. So effing awesome.
Yep. Mike was cool....and man, I was hoping all along that it wasn't Chuck but alas....Chuck screwed his own brother due to his massive ego. Really good episode.
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I actually get Chuck's POV. If someone on the forum got a Ph.D. from a diploma mill school that wasn't accredited, I wouldn't view them as my peer based on merit. At this point, it seems like Jimmy is willing to grind out honest work and prove that he can do quality work, but Chuck either is willing to see or accept that Jimmy is making an honest go of it because he still see the conniving schemer he used to be, which is probably going to be the driving force into his transformation to Saul.
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Yep. Mike was cool....and man, I was hoping all along that it wasn't Chuck but alas....Chuck screwed his own brother due to his massive ego. Really good episode.
Every character was just so good tonight. And the Hamlin character suddenly had a whole new dimension.
BTW, when Hamlin asked Kim to close the door and then the scene ended, my guess was the conversation was about her using HHM property to help the McGills with the initial legwork (from an episode or two ago) and he was threatening her job (again) and then possibly coming up with something like "we could sue the McGills for this resource theft."
And I just love the Nacho character so much as well. The dude has the *speaking with facial expressions only* down to a science. I'd say it has already surpassed Breaking Bad for me, but I don't want to jump the gun based off just 9 episodes. Longevity is just as important.
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I actually get Chuck's POV. If someone on the forum got a Ph.D. from a diploma mill school that wasn't accredited, I wouldn't view them as my peer based on merit. At this point, it seems like Jimmy is willing to grind out honest work and prove that he can do quality work, but Chuck either is willing to see or accept that Jimmy is making an honest go of it because he still see the conniving schemer he used to be, which is probably going to be the driving force into his transformation to Saul.
I don't think his scheming is what will *drive* him to becoming Saul. The disrespect (which means people will never base their opinion off his merit, but their bias) is what will drive him to Saul. He won't fall back into Slippin' Jimmy because he falls back into bad habits. Slippin' Jimmy will be his saving grace. He has the education. He has the work ethic. He has the ability to read people extremely well (something that really is more of a personality trait than a book-learned one).
I *get* Chuck's POV. And I disagree with it strongly. Chuck is dead to me. As Louis C.K. would say, he can suck a bag of dicks.
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Haven't finished watching the ep yet, just paused it to jump on here and say I let out a gasp when I saw Chuck and Jimmy sitting outside. <3
EDIT: Just finished. Oh whoopdeedoo Chuck was outside. Fuck him.
:lol
What a fantastic episode. Jimmy spat some fucking venom, that was awesome. I agree with Calvin, like I understand where Chuck is coming from but the whole 'people don't change' thing really got my goad. I think he's bang out of order and I hope his kerosene stocks catch a spark. What a cunt.
Mike is a boss. Was that psuedo they were delivering to Nacho? I couldn't quite catch what he said it was.
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BTW, when Hamlin asked Kim to close the door and then the scene ended, my guess was the conversation was about her using HHM property to help the McGills with the initial legwork (from an episode or two ago) and he was threatening her job (again) and then possibly coming up with something like "we could sue the McGills for this resource theft."
I thought maybe since she said that Jimmy was her friend that Hammlin broke down and told her that Chuck was the one who told him not to hire Jimmy.....she takes that info and then knows that Jimmy will never get anywhere with Chuck backstabbing him and tries to convince Jimmy to take the deal/$$.
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It was always gonna be Chuck that betrayed him! Chuck is defined by "Jimmy's the screw up and I'm not" he could not possibly ever see him as an equal.
Great episode!
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The last couple episodes have been really good. It'll be interesting to see how the first season wraps up.
I loved (in fact, it's probably my favorite of the whole season) the Mike scene in the parking garage :lol
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Yeah awesome episode. The last scene between Jimmy and Chuck was both brilliantly written an brilliantly acted. Really painful to watch.
Mike was really cool as well.
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I loved (in fact, it's probably my favorite of the whole season) the Mike scene in the parking garage :lol
yeah that was a great scene. you could feel it coming.....loved how he was just picking through the guys pockets and what not as he lay there choking :lol And the fact the big dude took off running was a great exclamation point.
Yeah awesome episode. The last scene between Jimmy and Chuck was both brilliantly written an brilliantly acted. Really painful to watch.
You could get the sense even in the flashback that Chuck was not thrilled with the fact Jimmy became a Lawyer....and the manner in which he did it. Once he burst into the confession it was like years of pent up emotion unleashed.
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BTW, when Hamlin asked Kim to close the door and then the scene ended, my guess was the conversation was about her using HHM property to help the McGills with the initial legwork (from an episode or two ago) and he was threatening her job (again) and then possibly coming up with something like "we could sue the McGills for this resource theft."
I thought maybe since she said that Jimmy was her friend that Hammlin broke down and told her that Chuck was the one who told him not to hire Jimmy.....she takes that info and then knows that Jimmy will never get anywhere with Chuck backstabbing him and tries to convince Jimmy to take the deal/$$.
Yeah I think it was along these lines as well.
I understand where Chuck is coming from
I do not at all. He was an absolute douchebag, and considering the huge amount of time and energy that Jimmy has invested in trying to help and look after his brother, Chuck has ultimately treated him like crap. The episode was awesome, and made me feel really sorry for Jimmy.
I really like the fact that this show is really going into a lot of depth about aspects of Jimmy and Mike that made them so likeable in BB.
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"You can make it not easy." :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
Mike is just so awesome. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
The Chuck/Jimmy thing we all sort of saw coming, but that was still brutal. Definitely fantastic acting.
This show is so good.
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I know a lot of people probably disagree, but I might enjoy Saul Season 1 more than Breaking Bad Season 1.
Of course, Breaking Bad at its peak (seasons 3 and 4, for me) is probably a higher high than Saul will ever reach, but I've gotta say- this first season has been really (and somewhat surprisingly) satisfying.
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BTW, when Hamlin asked Kim to close the door and then the scene ended, my guess was the conversation was about her using HHM property to help the McGills with the initial legwork (from an episode or two ago) and he was threatening her job (again) and then possibly coming up with something like "we could sue the McGills for this resource theft."
I thought maybe since she said that Jimmy was her friend that Hammlin broke down and told her that Chuck was the one who told him not to hire Jimmy.....she takes that info and then knows that Jimmy will never get anywhere with Chuck backstabbing him and tries to convince Jimmy to take the deal/$$.
Yeah I think it was along these lines as well.
Of course that is what happened. I'm talking about what was in my mind before that was revealed. That's why I said Hamlin's character gained some massive depth in that 5-10 minute span. He went from the arch villain to the patsy.
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Definitely enjoying this although despite the show definitely being more lighthearted than BB I found the writing in the garage scene a little too canned comic relief and those other two guys almost comic booky. I didn't really get any enjoyment out of Mike kicking the crap out of that one guy because you knew it was coming the second he opened his mouth.
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That's why I said Hamlin's character gained some massive depth in that 5-10 minute span. He went from the arch villain to the patsy.
This, exactly. Hamlin/Chuck's character switch is an excellent piece of writing.
I understand where Chuck is coming from
I do not at all. He was an absolute douchebag, and considering the huge amount of time and energy that Jimmy has invested in trying to help and look after his brother, Chuck has ultimately treated him like crap. The episode was awesome, and made me feel really sorry for Jimmy.
I just meant I got why he didn't want to be associated with Jimmy, because of his past etc, and because Chuck took the hard road and was incensed that Jimmy could shoot to the top on the back of one case, pretty much. That doesn't make me like him any more. I get his reasonings, I just don't sympathise with em.
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Did anyone else notice that the guy who Mike beat up is the same actor as Trevor from Grand Theft Auto V?
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Definitely enjoying this although despite the show definitely being more lighthearted than BB I found the writing in the garage scene a little too canned comic relief and those other two guys almost comic booky. I didn't really get any enjoyment out of Mike kicking the crap out of that one guy because you knew it was coming the second he opened his mouth.
There are people just like that annoying dude in real life. Big talkers. Can't Walkers.
What I liked about that scene was the big fat dude running. The point being, Mike kicked the prison bully's ass and the rest of the prison fell under his authority. Mike instantly gained the "I don't need to fight. I rule by intimidation because everybody knows I can fight."
Here's the Mike scene played out in a totally different environment with the same results.
YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eD8_XO29_oA)
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This show is fantiastic. I hoped it wouldn't completely bomb and it has ended up being nothing short of amazing. I bet Chuck kills himself next episode.
I actually get Chuck's POV. If someone on the forum got a Ph.D. from a diploma mill school that wasn't accredited, I wouldn't view them as my peer based on merit.
I have to disagree with this. I had someone at my last job pissed at me because they went and got a masters degree in MIS and I was in the same position making the same pay holding only a bachelors. I would actually say Saul was smart for doing what he did. He saved money and is able to start on the ground floor with no debt. Chuck had to work his ass off just so he could pay off the $100K+ he probably owed his school. He's probably jealous of Saul. A good lawyer is a good lawyer, it doesn't matter where you went to school. Just like a good computer programmer is a good computer programmer. Hell, most of the world's best coders didn't go to college at all.
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I'm avoiding spoilers so I haven't checked in here. Quick question though, am I correct that there's only one episode left of the first season? Do we know when it'll air? Haven't decided whether or not to watch it season by season or wait for a few of them yet.
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Barto, the last episode of the season is next Monday.
No way will Chuck kill himself next week. He didn't look like someone who had regret; he looked like someone who had been busted.
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Chuck won't kill himself but he will definitely get himself blown up.
Twice during that last episode there was a distinct sound of gas being released from the canister and the show made a point of letting the audience hear it. And the doctor already said he could burn the house down because of using those canisters inside.
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I don't know who Chuck is and I don't care if he kills himself or not, but thanks for the update. :tup
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He's probably jealous of Saul.
I definitely agree with this. He has the superiority / inferiority thing going on at the same time. He thinks he's better, but when he goes to sleep at night, he worries he is not.
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He's probably jealous of Saul.
I definitely agree with this. He has the superiority / inferiority thing going on at the same time. He thinks he's better, but when he goes to sleep at night, he worries he is not.
I think that's a safe bet. And, I'd venture to say that he knows deep down that Jimmy is 'smarter' than he is. Seems like Chuck may have the technical know how but when it comes to the presentation and personality Chuck knows Jimmy has something that no school can teach.
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He's probably jealous of Saul.
I definitely agree with this. He has the superiority / inferiority thing going on at the same time. He thinks he's better, but when he goes to sleep at night, he worries he is not.
I think that's a safe bet. And, I'd venture to say that he knows deep down that Jimmy is 'smarter' than he is. Seems like Chuck may have the technical know how but when it comes to the presentation and personality Chuck knows Jimmy has something that no school can teach.
I think Jimmy has the ability to read and predict people's reactions in way that many people can't.
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Seems like Chuck may have the technical know how but when it comes to the presentation and personality Chuck knows Jimmy has something that no school can teach.
I think Chuck only has the law vocabulary over Jimmy/Saul. Saul actually proved a couple of times with Chuck that he has the law down, and Chuck begrudgingly said Saul was right with something like "that's right --- more or less".
And Saul definitely has the social skills and psychology manipulation of people down way better than Chuck.
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I don't think that's fair to say, since we really haven't seen Chuck in action yet, except when he quickly laid the smack down on those lawyers with his "20 million dollars or we'll see you in court" line.
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Plus of course the way he's been manipulating Jimmy for years.
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Plus of course the way he's been manipulating Jimmy for years.
That's not using your brain. That's using your bloodline to take advantage. It is pretty low and even those with below average IQs can work that. It just takes being a scumbag. Never go into business with family. That's why. You give family infinite chances and put up with insubordination that would normally result in a few write ups and then a firing.
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Interesting way to end the season. I guess that answers why Jimmy never made it big time. He chose not to. He had the chance and decided to turn his back on it.
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That episode fell flat. His turn at the end felt like a cheap cop-out by the writers, especially after he seemed to genuinely care for his clients in that scene at Marco's place.
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That episode fell flat. His turn at the end felt like a cheap cop-out by the writers, especially after he seemed to genuinely care for his clients in that scene at Marco's place.
It did seem like the easy way out. I expected him to be 'burned' in some way.....not to just go full 180 in his moral outlook. I mean, he just dissed that chick (forgot her name) who has been looking out for him the whole time and even Hammlin in a way.
I don't know if that was their way of saying that his entire aspiration of becoming a lawyer and being 'good' was based on trying to make Chuck proud.....and now that he understands Chuck doesn't respect him at all as a lawyer....he'd just sayingn 'F' it and he's going back to what he knows best? But like you said....it could have been developed much more rather than a two minute scene at the end of the season.
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I thought it was great, and I fully bought his change of heart. This has been a fantastic season of television, and I'm very much looking forward to more. I'm guessing there'll be more? I haven't heard anything.
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I thought it was great, and I fully bought his change of heart.
I did too.....just would have preferred to have more than the final scene dedicated to the 'switch' I know the whole episode was basically it.....but, I'd have liked to see a bit more at the end
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I think my favorite thing about the show so far has been when they elaborate on those little things that, at the time, seem like throwaway lines Saul said on Breaking Bad.
Case in point:
(https://a.disquscdn.com/get?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn3.everyjoe.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F09%2Fsaul-goodman-kevin-costner.gif&key=rUqsYoarlXXdZqy20TY61w&w=480&h=246)
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Yep, as soon as I heard the Dances With Wolves comment in a voiceover, I thought, "Oh man, here comes the Kevin Costner thing he once talked about to Walt." :lol :lol
Overall, I thought the finale was good, but a bit underwhelming.
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I hope everyone saw the 2112 poster in that episode?
I was kinda disappointed with the ending, though overall it was a great episode again. I would have preferred it he got the job, worked the case, and pushed it ahead shining brighter than his brother. To me that would have been a far better "fuck you" to him than effectively turning his back on the straight lifestyle and apparently relapsing in slipping Jimmy again.
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I dunno if it's as black and white as him running back to his old ways though. For a prequel, this show has managed to keep in line with Breaking Bad in that it's damn near impossible to predict what's going to happen the next hour the rolls by, only for things to feel like that's the only way the story could have ever gone. Gilligan and Gould have got my trust my on that, and this just feels like another cliffhanger. I don't think Jimmy's pulling a simple "fuck it" routine. Plus, he's not Saul Goodman yet, and I don't think Saul would even do that with the money involved. All we were given was him driving off and the implications of him declining the offer. It seemed obvious while waiting for BB's Season 4 premiere that Gus wasn't going to be walking on sunshine when he confronted Walt, but nobody anticipated Box Cutter, right?
I mean, to me, it's not a stretch for him to be faced with an inner conflict that would ultimately lead to self-sabotage even when the answer's right there in front of you. I mean, I think we've all met a few people desensitized by the world constantly leaving a stinky steamer on their good intentions. Jimmy's clearly dedicated the past 10 years of his life to showing Chuck that he didn't make the wrong decision in bringing him to Albuquerque, and, as we know, the irony is that Jimmy did having everything going for him except the very person that brought him out of the shitter in the first place. It only takes for one moment where things click, like finding out that your brother and literal hero has been working against you from the beginning, for this perfect schema you've been managing to come crashing down, even if it's just for long enough to fuck your life up. Shit, to realize that not only was Chuck against him, but was in fact everything he hated about Hamlin the whole time? Everything that's happened to Jimmy in the past two weeks save that sudden offer could very well leave him thinking like he only has one clear choice with what he's got.
However, as I said earlier, that might not be the case. He could be driving off with a better plan in mind, using a con man's wit to manipulate the case back under his total control. Maybe he heard himself having to use McGill for the firm name and, despite his fight with Hamlin to use it, might just abandon it for Goodman. This could just be the first, and most ethically unchallenged, instance where we see Slippin' Jimmy make use of his law degree. It would mean bypassing the climbing of the ranks and minutiae he would have had to endure at HHM and lead him straight to Francesca and his own modest office. I feel like after all this shit with Chuck, the perks like that great office with the view next to Chuck's don't matter as much as his independent success.
Or he, Walt, Jesse, Mike, Huell, and Tio could just poison Sandpiper's reps with ricin, it's just so difficult to predict with Gilligan, the bastard.
As for the ep itself, I thought it was top notch as was the rest of the seriesl. I think it felt slower because it was the first episode in a while to not have any tension, but I don't think BCS needs it all the time anyways, not even for the finale since the last bunch have been heavyweights. Loving the whole 40's vibe to the show, from that sweet montage to Mike's noir adventures. Also, Marco's on The Last Man on Earth, which is great too.
Let me leave this here, in honor of Vince Gilligan's basing his decision on hiring Bob Odenkirk on Mr. Show. Intentionally have it starting sometime into the video on a certain sketch with a certain special guest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mav6X49fbTs&t=4m1s
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I think my favorite thing about the show so far has been when they elaborate on those little things that, at the time, seem like throwaway lines Saul said on Breaking Bad.
Case in point:
(https://a.disquscdn.com/get?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn3.everyjoe.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F09%2Fsaul-goodman-kevin-costner.gif&key=rUqsYoarlXXdZqy20TY61w&w=480&h=246)
Ah that's pretty neat, didn't notice that.
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Just a bit from a supposed lawyer on reddit, gives some context to Jimmy's turnaround.
I'm seeing a lot of people complaining that Jimmy turning away from the firm offer he had doesn't make a lot of sense, but a lot of it seems to me to stem from this idea that partnership track=guaranteed to become partner and that partners at these firms are Mitt Romney rich.
Partnership-track only means that partnership is on the table, there is no guarantee. Assuming generously that instead of being brought in as a first year associate, they would put Jimmy on track with a 4th year, he would still have 4-5 years to be up for partner.
Partners at even the most profitable nationwide firms may make 7 figures but usually not mid or high 7 figures. Given that this firm is a big regional firm based out of Santa Fe, I would imagine the partners aren't getting past 1.5 million/year if even that much.
Compare to this to what Saul Goodman makes. Even being conservative, we see him rake in 6 figures in deals made in a single day, 7 figure finders' fees, etc. Saul Goodman can make more in a day than Jimmy McGill would have made in a year at that big firm (and the fact that he walked away from 800k in the Kettlesituation made him realize as much).
At the moment where he is walking into the courthouse, Jimmy realizes that he really enjoyed his week with Marco. He likes being sleazy and skirting the law and he's damn good at it. And now he's "slippin' Jimmy with a law degree" (in Chuck's words/echoed in how surprised Marco is that slippin' Jimmy is a lawyer and not making bank).
So, his option is to take the job and work insane hours, spending 60-80+ hours/week reviewing documents, on a computer doing legal research, drafting motions, briefs etc. for low to eventually mid 6 figures and a shot at partner making maybe low 7 figures OR to embrace Slippin' Jimmy, realize pleasing Chuck is a futile task, and do the thing he really loves and enjoys for way, way more money.
Seems like a good choice to me and his time with Marco combined with the Kettlemoney (and Chuck's "slippin' Jimmy with a law degree" comment) made it a reasonable time for him to make the decision too.
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That ending was great.
There were two things holding Saul back from becoming an eventual partner with a big law firm.
1. Confidence: He just spent the last few years trying to win Chuck's approval. He figured Chuck had his best interest at heart and when Chuck would tell him that he wasn't ready or just had to work a little harder, he believed it. The call from the clients and Hamlin's / Kim's vote of confidence confirmed he was ready. He needed a 3rd party to say "we believe in you".
2. Freedom: When he works under somebody, he feels like he is steered in the wrong direction. He has the degree, but more importantly he has good instincts. When he puts those instincts aside and trusts his *superiors* have the better path, he always ended up getting the short end of the stick.
It is what the entire first season arc led up to. It was done brilliantly.
As far as Chuck helping him out? How?
1. Got him out of jail facing prison time. He might have actually been better in prison earning his law degree there.
2. Got him a job. At a mailroom? You don't need a high powered attorney referral to get that type of job. He could have done that all on his own. And he basically did.
3. Got him an education (law degree). Saul did that all on his own.
4. Put him on a good case to prove his worth. Saul, once again, did that all on his own. Kim helped him more by suggesting elder law.
All Chuck did was give him bad advice and put up roadblocks that wouldn't have been there had he done all of these things on his own.
Chuck was the Phantom Menace the entire time.
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For the most part, I agree with you, but I don't think Jimmy had any interest in becoming a lawyer until Chuck got him into the mail room. Not to mention that even if he had studied in prison, a registered sex offender would have an infinite road of shit waiting for him.Ultimately, Chuck did save his ass in that moment but had no confidence it would last, even after 10 years. The whole "hero" scam exacerbated his lack of faith. He gave him a chance, yeah, but he never thought much would come from it. Certainly didn't expect, and certainly won't accept, that Jimmy could actually be on par with him.
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What good is pointing somebody in a direction if you only plan to set up roadblocks? And did Chuck ever actually point him in the direction of "attorney" as a career, or was his career path mail room > legal secretary?
I think the point is Chuck gave Saul an inferiority complex. But Saul always had the goods, whether it be attorney or business proprietor. He has leadership qualities that, for the most part, you just can't teach.
The meaning of him telling Mike "that" was never going to hold him back again could be extrapolated in many different ways. But mainly it was the new belief that he can rely on others, but he doesn't have to. If his instincts go against what others tell him is "the right way", he will now trust his instincts. The whole season was putting him in situations where he listened to advice, it failed. He went on instinct, he succeeded. That was set in stone with Chuck's betrayal and his visit back to his kicking grounds (BTW, loved the Nigerian scam)
And by extension, not worrying about what is "the right thing to do" according to dogma. But that goes back to his instincts. I don't think he is about to go off and become mr. slimy attorney. They kind of hinted when he told Marco he wasn't running a scam on the senior citizens. He did it not just for his career, but because he actually cared about their well being. And he was put in many similar situations: the skaters and Nacho being a big one in the beginning.
And I really love the Nacho character. I'm in agony knowing how long I will have to wait for Season 2.
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That episode fell flat.
Yeah, I felt a little disappointed by it - it was less engaging than the other ep's - however I don't feel like the turn was a cop out. There was a whole episode of build up towards it, and the dude in that reddit thread seems to have nailed it. I felt the cinematography was a bit below par with this episode, even bordering on cheesy at times. Much different to how its been. I think overall it was a pretty disappointing end to an absolutely stellar season, very much looking forward to season 2.
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What good is pointing somebody in a direction if you only plan to set up roadblocks? And did Chuck ever actually point him in the direction of "attorney" as a career, or was his career path mail room > legal secretary?
I think the point is Chuck gave Saul an inferiority complex. But Saul always had the goods, whether it be attorney or business proprietor. He has leadership qualities that, for the most part, you just can't teach.
The meaning of him telling Mike "that" was never going to hold him back again could be extrapolated in many different ways. But mainly it was the new belief that he can rely on others, but he doesn't have to. If his instincts go against what others tell him is "the right way", he will now trust his instincts. The whole season was putting him in situations where he listened to advice, it failed. He went on instinct, he succeeded. That was set in stone with Chuck's betrayal and his visit back to his kicking grounds (BTW, loved the Nigerian scam)
And by extension, not worrying about what is "the right thing to do" according to dogma. But that goes back to his instincts. I don't think he is about to go off and become mr. slimy attorney. They kind of hinted when he told Marco he wasn't running a scam on the senior citizens. He did it not just for his career, but because he actually cared about their well being. And he was put in many similar situations: the skaters and Nacho being a big one in the beginning.
Oh no, totally, I agree with you essentially. Chuck's actions were indefensible. Jimmy's not quite Saul yet. My point was that Chuck did help (not that it was even fully voluntarily, as the mother had to ask I believe) Jimmy in getting out of that tough, possibly damning situation, and that it didn't seem that he had much interest in law before that. That was the catalyst, but everything else was all Jimmy's wit and work ethic.
I felt the cinematography was a bit below par with this episode, even bordering on cheesy at times. Much different to how its been. I think overall it was a pretty disappointing end to an absolutely stellar season, very much looking forward to season 2.
I could kinda understand as it was a slower episode, but I think the only thing that's really struck me as cheesy this season was the scene where Chuck is running around outside. Not the great space blanket long shots, but the shaky cam closeups, typical body rig stuff to give a manic sense of hysteria. Other than that though, I've been loving it! A nice 40's kinda feel to the whole thing. I actually really enjoyed that montage.
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Oh no, totally, I agree with you essentially.
Yeah. We are more or less agreeing, just looking at the same thing from different angles, both being right.
Overall, I loved the first season. The only thing that had me second guessing whether I would like it or not was how they were going to use Jonathan Banks. Couldn't be happier with his role as Mike in this.
Also, I'm very glad Chuck didn't die. The other poster on this thread was very convincing with the foreshadowing of the possible gas explosion. I didn't want it to happen, but they brought up some good points that had thinking it was very possible (and still possible). We don't need characters dying off left and right like we did in Breaking Bad. It made sense in BB, but it would seem like easy exits for Better Call Saul.
I'm guessing Saul will never reach the attorney heights that Chuck already has based off what happens in Breaking Bad (and especially the opening of Better Call Saul). I really don't want the series finale to be Saul and Walter's paths crossing. I want that to happen mid to mid-late series so we can get some "oh that's what Saul was up to when Walt was pissing everybody off" moments. So much opportunity for the to be an all time great TV series.
Knew Odenkirk pre-BB, and loved him pre-BB. Didn't know Nacho pre-BB, but I am loving his character immensely. Didn't know Banks pre-BB, and who doesn't want more Mike? This show is just so character driven. Dynamic characters.
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I felt the cinematography was a bit below par with this episode, even bordering on cheesy at times. Much different to how its been. I think overall it was a pretty disappointing end to an absolutely stellar season, very much looking forward to season 2.
I could kinda understand as it was a slower episode, but I think the only thing that's really struck me as cheesy this season was the scene where Chuck is running around outside. Not the great space blanket long shots, but the shaky cam closeups, typical body rig stuff to give a manic sense of hysteria. Other than that though, I've been loving it! A nice 40's kinda feel to the whole thing. I actually really enjoyed that montage.
Y'know, I didn't mind that body rig scene too much tbh. This season is 90% certified fresh in terms of cinematography in my opinion. I thought a couple of really minor shots on this last episode were a bit borderline for my taste. And I didn't like the 'hustle montage', though I feel like it was done as a bit of a piss take.
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And I didn't like the 'hustle montage', though I feel like it was done as a bit of a piss take.
You can't have a montage scene without the "Take it to the Limit" or "The Best Around" song playing. Rookie mistake.
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'Yew need a montaaaage! Even Rocky had a montaage!'
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I thought that was a little lack-luster of a finale. I was hoping for some serious shit to go down. I still really liked this season and can't wait for #2.
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So how does everyone think this show will end? Let's assume it's a success and can go a few season. Will it eventually get to the point where BCS is taking place during the same time period of BB? Will it end with Saul meeting Walter White for the first time?
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I don't think him meeting Walter will really be a big enough point to end the show on. Honestly, I have no clue when or how it will end, and I'm quite alright with that.
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Will it eventually get to the point where BCS is taking place during the same time period of BB?
I hope so. I love that type of stuff.
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So how does everyone think this show will end? Let's assume it's a success and can go a few season. Will it eventually get to the point where BCS is taking place during the same time period of BB? Will it end with Saul meeting Walter White for the first time?
??? We've already seen that.
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It'd be good to end it with Saul moving into the building he's in on BB
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How long in the current world of Better Call Saul will it be until he'd meet Walt? Are we talking 5?6..7 years or is right around the corner?
For those of you who've watched BB....and seen the pace of this show.....what's the "best guess" as to how many seasons they can get out of it? And, could they pull off the show if it caught up to BB time without showing any Walt? Was Saul a huge part of BB?
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I think like five years.
Saul first appeared in Breaking Bad in I think the 8th episode of Season 2, but the first two seasons of BB only covered like two months in the storyline (and the show itself covered two years, even though it went from 2008-2013), so yeah, about five years. They can cover a shit ton of ground before getting to when Saul first met Walt and Jesse.
Personally, whenever Better Call Saul does end, I think it will cover his post-BB arc (which for non-BB viewers, you saw a glimpse of in the pilot's cold opening).
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I did remember reading way back when that Better Call Saul was going to hop around in the time line.
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Season 2 begins next Monday!!
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Woot wooooot! I just watched the first season on flix of the net and I am so ready.
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Can't wait! I was really surprised by the first season by how much I loved it. This should be a fun season as well I'm hoping.
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Can't wait! I was really surprised by the first season by how much I loved it. This should be a fun season as well I'm hoping.
Me too. I think a lot of people were surprised with how great the show actually turned out. I think most people expected an AMC cash grab and the milking of a character. I don't think that's the case here. I think without Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul would have held up just fine on its own.
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Can't wait! I was really surprised by the first season by how much I loved it. This should be a fun season as well I'm hoping.
Me too. I think a lot of people were surprised with how great the show actually turned out. I think most people expected an AMC cash grab and the milking of a character. I don't think that's the case here. I think without Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul would have held up just fine on its own.
I'm a huge fan and I've never watched one episode of Breaking Bad. This show is great as a stand alone. I'm sure knowing the 'easter eggs' makes it more enjoyable....but I loved the first season without having any frame of reference other than what they showed.
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Can't wait! I was really surprised by the first season by how much I loved it. This should be a fun season as well I'm hoping.
Me too. I think a lot of people were surprised with how great the show actually turned out. I think most people expected an AMC cash grab and the milking of a character. I don't think that's the case here. I think without Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul would have held up just fine on its own.
I'm a huge fan and I've never watched one episode of Breaking Bad. This show is great as a stand alone. I'm sure knowing the 'easter eggs' makes it more enjoyable....but I loved the first season without having any frame of reference other than what they showed.
My son and son in law tried watching Breaking Bad, but could not get into the show. Besides the characters in BCS and BB appearing in both shows, the dented trash can in BCS was in BB, but was a towel dispenser.
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I honestly don't understand how someone can't get into Breaking Bad. Whether you cook/use meth or not, the show is outstanding.
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While I agree, Breaking Bad is fantastic, it requires a lot of patience at times.
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I honestly don't understand how someone can't get into Breaking Bad. Whether you cook/use meth or not, the show is outstanding.
Now that I have Netflix I fully intend to Binge Watch the series. I'm just trying to allow myself the proper time to do it because I know that once I start watching I won't stop until I'm done.
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While I agree, Breaking Bad is fantastic, it requires a lot of patience at times.
My brother told me that once I made it past the first four or five episodes of season 1 that it really starts to hit it's stride then. Is that a fair comment from him?
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I can tell you that there was a very humorous scene on the second episode that made me go "Yeah, ok, I'm gonna watch this entire series".
But yeah, the best comes in the latest episode in series 1, and it's the weakest of them all. It starts good and it gets even better, or "worse" according to the title of the show.
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While I agree, Breaking Bad is fantastic, it requires a lot of patience at times.
My brother told me that once I made it past the first four or five episodes of season 1 that it really starts to hit it's stride then. Is that a fair comment from him?
Yeah. Season 1 is good, but there's a lot of setting up that it needs to take care of. Season 2 starts at full throttle, and it basically doesn't stop until the final episode of the series. Granted, there are episodes that are more intensive, sadder, darker, etc.. than others, but I never once watched an episode and thought "well that just just a filler" like I seem to do 5 or 6 times a season with TWD. I hate saying it because so many people do, but BB was easily one of the best shows I've every watched. Usually when I watch a series for a second time, it's years after the first run. With Breaking Bad, I watched it again as soon as I finished.
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While I agree, Breaking Bad is fantastic, it requires a lot of patience at times.
My brother told me that once I made it past the first four or five episodes of season 1 that it really starts to hit it's stride then. Is that a fair comment from him?
I suppose. I think by then you've decided if you want to continue. But it is slowly paced sometimes all the way through. It's really good, but slowly paced.
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It's definitely a slow burner at times. I really love the series and while it's certainly not perfect, it's probably one of the only shows I've seen that I'd want to call it perfect. It absolutely benefits from binging though and really cuts down on the slow pacing of things.
I'll also say that while it's nothing major and it's all about how much you give a shit about it and what you take from it, but there are a lot of homages and nods to the series in Saul; some overt, some hidden away, but they're all really cool. After binging BCS and watching it a second time I noticed a handful of things that I hadn't noticed at first and it's just so damn satisfying to catch that stuff and puts a real special flavor to the show. There aren't many shows (actually for the ones I've watched, none) that have this much detail between the two of them and still connect them pretty much to as perfect a T as you can get.
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No one talking about this?
I thought the episode was great. Awesomely written dialogue and fantastic acting. I am very interested to see the rest of the season.
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The kick off episode was good. Made me realize I probably should have at least rewatched Season 1 or at least read a brief summary because when it started I had to think "now where exactly were we last."
Felt like one of those *slow burn* episodes Uncle brought up. Lot's of good small things happened, but we basically ended the episode where we began. The episode was a brief detour toward the inevitable.
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While I agree, Breaking Bad is fantastic, it requires a lot of patience at times.
My brother told me that once I made it past the first four or five episodes of season 1 that it really starts to hit it's stride then. Is that a fair comment from him?
I dunno, it picks up and is a strong show, but I definitely don't find it as mindblowing as a lot of people seem to. Personally, I think BCS is quite a bit stronger so far.
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Fucking love this show SO MUCH. Fantastic episode. Annnd the amazingly satisfying BB homages and nods just keep getting better. My jaw was agape when we saw "KENWINS". Then...THE TEQUILA. WHAAAAAT. That was so fucking awesome. Necessary? Not at all and you won't be missing storyline shit if you didn't see BB but that isn't to say you're not missing out because you are. A lot, in my opinion. It is SO. SATISFYING. I love that shit and I have a feeling they'll keep piling up.
Otherwise, awesome episode and I cannot wait to dive into this festival of debauchery and treachery.
Also +100 for the music.
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The Breaking Bad references are nice, but I also like the inner-episode comparisons.
Saul gets put in a situation with an easy way out, but setting off the mall alarm could bring the police. He plays it out in his head and considers the police could catch on to his false identity. Meanwhile, Daniel the pharmacist calls the cops, bringing them to the scene is what is essentially a turf war in which he's directly involved. Clearly, he's alerted the cops to his strange activities. Daniel is also a precursor to Walter White.
No single moment is a mindblower, but all the little details add up to well written episodes.
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Slow burn fo sho. Glad to see it back tho. And glad to see Saul finally get some sweet sweet lawyer bonerlage.
Hummer guy is such a douchenugget.
Missed the BB references tho...
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Pretty sure the white cop who came to check out Daniel's place is the same one from the episode where Skyler calls the cops when Walter moves back in.
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I'll be watching the new Saul tonight, but in regards to Breaking Bad. I found it to be a good show but not a great show. I watched it a year or so and I think it was so over hyped that I was let down overall. Worth watching, but not the greatest of all time.
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Pretty sure the white cop who came to check out Daniel's place is the same one from the episode where Skyler calls the cops when Walter moves back in.
Duuuude nice catch! That's awesome.
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I think it was so over hyped that I was let down overall.
this is what I think would happen in my case. my brother has hyped this show so much that I don't see how it can live up to how highly regarded he has it. That's why' I've yet to make the plunge. If I can get away with watching BCS without really needing to see BB other than missing some Easter Eggs....I'll probably never watch BB.
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I think you should see it. It's not one of my all time favorites either, and it is over hyped, but I still think it's a show you should see if you're into TV series in general. It's not always super good, but when it is, it's sooo good.
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I think you should see it. It's not one of my all time favorites either, and it is over hyped, but I still think it's a show you should see if you're into TV series in general. It's not always super good, but when it is, it's sooo good.
Yeah, there is the occasional moment that is absolutely superb. I'd agree with you - not mindblowing but definitely worth watching.
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I'm one of the people that think it's one of the greatest television shows ever created and always will be. But I'll also say that hype, ever single time, is a load of bullshit. Fuck hype. Watch it and if you like it, keep watching and you'll more than likely only end up loving it; if you're not so much into it, give it a chance and maybe it'll turn (this is how it was for me); and if you hate it then you hate it and the world will keep on spinning.
Hype has never done anything good for anything. Never. Not in my case at least. It's always been nothing but a fucking deluge of cumshots by rabid, deluded, blinded-by-excitement fans and ended up making me think something was going to be way better than it actually (or that I thought) it was. If you go into it with a level head, chances are you'll see it more clearly. Which in the end means only good things considering if you were going to dislike/hate it anyway, it'll just be less intense and if you were going to like it, you'll probably end up liking it more than if you thought you'd gain eternal life and a ten inch dick and a side of a hit of ecstasy from watching it (or playing it or listening to it or whatever insanely stupid hype is built up for whatever).
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Anyone else notice the tequila bottle was the same one Gus gave to Don Eladio in Breaking Bad's Salud episode?
Also, the Ken guy was clearly meant to be the KENWINS guy from the 4th episode of BB Season 1 (although I think it was a different actor).
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Yup, I posted about both earlier on; Ken is the same actor. Cool stuff indeed.
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Feels good to have the show back! Exciting months ahead, TWD, BCS and soon also Vikings followed by Fear of the walk... and of course GoT! :tup
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Loved the new episode. This show has exceeded all of my expectations and to be honest I enjoy it more than Breaking Bad.
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Yup, I posted about both earlier on; Ken is the same actor. Cool stuff indeed.
My bad.
But yeah, definitely cool stuff. :coolio
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S2, E2.....started slow, but so worth it.
Gawd, how we do love Mike.
And 'Boston creampie', along with the later comments of 'shedding real tears' :lol
From the start to the little twist at the end, a damn well crafted and written episode.
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Loved tonight's episode.
Now time for X-Files. Better Call Saul I couldn't watch fast enough. X-Files, I'm almost dreading.
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How fucking annoying is hummer guy. jesus.
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berry
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"Are you still morally flexible?".
Brilliant line. :lol
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How fucking annoying is hummer guy. jesus.
Well, that is pretty much the point. He is comically annoying.
The look on Mike's face when he talked about wanting to get his baseball cards back was priceless. :lol :lol :lol :lol
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Hoboken squat cobbler ftw.
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I thought the episode was great.
Maybe it's because I'm not a lawyer, but why is it so much worse to fabricate evidence than to just flat out make a story up and lie to the police, protecting a drug dealer?
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I think because the evidence could someday be used in court.
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Because he can say he didn't lie, but just repeated what the client told him.
But fabricating evidence has a bit more fingerprints.
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Also hot Kim said to never tell her that type of story again, for at least two reasons. So she doesn't have to testify against (or knowingly lie) for him. And because she values her job and would be pretty pissed if his recklessness took her down with him.
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Something pointed out to me: note that Kim never said 'don't do it again', but 'don't tell me if you do'.
And how Jimmy's face just went blank after that line, much like when he knew his brother was at the firm. Also found out that the 'douchebag' in Episode 1 was the same one that Walter White met at the gas station.....
This episode was the first on of BB and BCS that my wife and I watched 'live'. We were late to the game on both series. It is nice to have time to reflect as well as anticipate.
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How fucking annoying is hummer guy. jesus.
Well, that is pretty much the point. He is comically annoying.
The look on Mike's face when he talked about wanting to get his baseball cards back was priceless. :lol :lol :lol :lol
His and Mike's exchanges have been the highlights of the last two episodes for me.
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Hummer guys is a bit over the top.
Never really thought about it until now, but a successful formula for the obligatory dumb people for TV/movie is probably:
- small role: annoyingly dumb (cellphone stockbroker guy)
- recurring and somewhat important role: loveable idiot
I still like Hummer guy when watching, but when I reflect on his role I'm not as sold.
"Are you still morally flexible?".
Brilliant line. :lol
And the correct response is "I'm an attorney. Of course I am." If you are a criminal defense attorney, it is more or less part of the job description.
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We are now watching the old and the new episode each night. Didn't realize the dialogue we missed last week during the 'cobbler' scene because we were laughing too loudly.
Tonight, just another brilliant episode.
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Loved it tonight as well. It is very interesting that they are more or less using the Breaking Bad model. The choices made to get from point A to point Z. And doing it on Mike and Saul concurrently is very entertaining. What I find interesting is that both do not have the wife/kid family relationship going on. But Saul has Kim (and his brother) and Mike has the daughter-in-law (and granddaughter).
Kim is obviously his moral compass. So much so that it isn't even about her getting to him to do the right thing, but just weighing heavily on every decision he makes. First season, he tried to impress his brother (and her to a lesser degree). Now it is all about her. It is also interesting that Kim might be viewing his brother with more understanding as time goes on. It is a bad character flaw of Saul that he frequently has to be reminded that his decisions don't just affect him.
So far, this season, the good feelings for Saul that he is just doing what needs to be done because others are dismissing his value is being stripped away. He's becoming less empathetic.
And that is very Breaking Bad.
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Yea the way this show progress is just brilliant.
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Chuck better not piss off Saul too much or he may get a heavy dose of electrical vibes.
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Another strong episode this week. It is going to suck when Jimmy and Kim goes to hell, I felt awful when Jimmy comes back from getting reamed out on the phone like nothing happened and asked Kim if anything had blown up yet.
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Another strong episode this week. It is going to suck when Jimmy and Kim goes to hell, I felt awful when Jimmy comes back from getting reamed out on the phone like nothing happened and asked Kim if anything had blown up yet.
Yeah....that's the type of clever, subtle writing that I enjoy about the show. It's starting to unwind a bit for ol' Jimmy. Had Kim not said anything to him about the boss liking it and placed that seed of doubt, I bet he'd have shown him the tape prior to running it.
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Yeah....that's the type of clever, subtle writing that I enjoy about the show. It's starting to unwind a bit for ol' Jimmy. Had Kim not said anything to him about the boss liking it and placed that seed of doubt, I bet he'd have shown him the tape prior to running it.
The way I read it was that Jimmy didn't show it to his bosses because of the conversation with his assistant about how many meetings there were just about the swirl in the background of their last commercial. He knew he needed to get the commercial out there to keep his client outreach numbers looking good if he was going to stop soliciting.
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Yeah....that's the type of clever, subtle writing that I enjoy about the show. It's starting to unwind a bit for ol' Jimmy. Had Kim not said anything to him about the boss liking it and placed that seed of doubt, I bet he'd have shown him the tape prior to running it.
The way I read it was that Jimmy didn't show it to his bosses because of the conversation with his assistant about how many meetings there were just about the swirl in the background of their last commercial. He knew he needed to get the commercial out there to keep his client outreach numbers looking good if he was going to stop soliciting.
Yeah....that too for sure. Once he has these compounding factors weighing on his mind....and the fact that he 'knows' his commercial will work but probably knew that style of commercial wouldn't be approved....he just went for it. Bummer thing is that I don't think Burns and McDonnel (isn't that who he works for) is going to care that they acquired 100+ new clients....I think that 'style' of commercial will be looked down upon as 'two bit' and bad for that 'reputable' firm.
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Sadly, I feel this show slipping away from me. I think I saw the first two and haven't really been excited about it. Hopefully I can catch up on it sometime soon but I'm not as pumped for it as I have been in the past.
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Sadly, I feel this show slipping away from me. I think I saw the first two and haven't really been excited about it. Hopefully I can catch up on it sometime soon but I'm not as pumped for it as I have been in the past.
Can't keep straight what people watched, but did you watch Breaking Bad and if so, how?
The character development of these shows can lead to what feels like slow pacing. Spread it out over a few months for a season, and it might feel even slower. Perhaps try watching the 2nd season in a more binge like format once the season is complete?
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Sadly, I feel this show slipping away from me. I think I saw the first two and haven't really been excited about it. Hopefully I can catch up on it sometime soon but I'm not as pumped for it as I have been in the past.
Can't keep straight what people watched, but did you watch Breaking Bad and if so, how?
The character development of these shows can lead to what feels like slow pacing. Spread it out over a few months for a season, and it might feel even slower. Perhaps try watching the 2nd season in a more binge like format once the season is complete?
I think that's probably the right way to go about it. I binged all of Breaking Bad and loved it. I don't have a lot of patience for the slow-burning character dev. stuff. I fast fowarded through a lot of Skyler's boring shit in the middle of BB, season 2 or 3?
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Loved the latest episode.
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It was good, but the Tuco scene was completely ridiculous. Given how cautious we know Mike to be, there is no way he would do what he did there for a measly 25K, especially when Tuco could have easily just pulled out his gun and shot him in the head in an instant instead of merely using him as a punching bag.
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Tuco did pull his gun out. Mike quickly disarmed him.
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Okay, but there is no way of knowing if Tuco would have done that before they were that close to each other, meaning Mike could not have disarmed him before getting shot. My main point is, too much risk there for something to go wrong. It's not just something we ever see Mike do.
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It's not that I don't see your point, I'm just saying they actually addressed what you said.
He was very "old man" non-confrontational before they were in close proximity. First acting the confused old man, but not calling Tuco a liar. Then offering to exchange insurance information. He stepped it up when they were at arms length and stepped it up even further when the cops were very close (as per the sirens closing in the near distance). Then he even taunted him when the cops were out of their cars.
Would Tuco just pull out his gun and shoot Mike the minute he walked in after hitting the car? That seems more like taking Tuco's personality too far. Yes, he's a hot head. But if he literally just shot everybody that wronged him *unintentionally* in broad daylight, he would have already been in prison long before last night's episode.
It was actually very intelligently handled. Especially since this is also Mike's journey to Breaking Bad hit man / bad ass. He wouldn't have taken the assignment at all if not for the financial need. But he isn't ready to be a full on hit man ... or even break legs as he said last episode.
On a different note, I liked the starting with Mike's injuries and envelope of money. My first thought was that possibly Nacho set him up on a mission doomed to failure to teach Mike his place.
It is great how they are hammering home Saul's big flaw. He has very good short term strategy, but lacks the bigger picture. Especially how is actions affect others. His brother was right in his critique. And it is a perfect flaw for a con man. Eventually, somebody you conned is going to cross your path again and look for some revenge. And it shows a sociopath tendency. Many people don't do the con not just for fear of getting caught, but because it bothers them when they get away with it too.
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Oh, I definitely agree that Chuck is mostly right about Jimmy/Saul, but of course we are conditioned to root for Jimmy, so just like we were for Walt on BB. Serious lawyers and firms take ethics and doing every little thing according to procedure correctly, so the reaction of both firms was totally realistic. And the fact that Jimmy doesn't get it shows why he is Saul Goodman.
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I thought the point was hammered home with the partner's talking about how that commercial might be great for short term gains on Saul's case (as in he started it, even though it is the firm's case now), but it could be damaging to the rest of their clientele. At that point, it was clear beyond a shadow of a doubt that Saul was 100% in the wrong and wasn't even "proving his point" by doing it his way. I even thought Saul might come back with "I'm really sorry. I realize I might have let my focus blind me to the bigger picture." When he didn't, it was a big moment in his character development (for the story, not his progression).
Even his worry for Kim has a lot to do with her liking him (or even the chance of her still liking him at this point). If she made it clear that he will never be her friend again ... well ...
And it plays in with that moment in Breaking Bad where he tells Walter what a self-centered jerk he is.
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Oh, I definitely agree that Chuck is mostly right about Jimmy/Saul, but of course we are conditioned to root for Jimmy, so just like we were for Walt on BB. Serious lawyers and firms take ethics and doing every little thing according to procedure correctly, so the reaction of both firms was totally realistic. And the fact that Jimmy doesn't get it shows why he is Saul Goodman.
Totally this. Jimmy sees nothing wrong with what he is doing although 'we' can see it, but we don't care because 'we' can see his point. The big time law firms can't and don't want to see his point because as you said, they are perfect to the 'T' when it comes to procedure so Jimmy's methods are going to cost him in that respect.
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Another superb, but tough episode.
Shame on me......I wish there was a third person we were following. I don't want to lose some of the 'specialness' of Mike by having him on too much (if that makes sense). Would have preferred him keeping that last comment to himself, just for his own sake.
Jimmy becoming Saul is now resting on him. Works a bit better when the obstacles are created by others (such as last season). But it's still early in the game.
I read where the gun dealer appears later with Mike, and is the one Walter bought the M60 from.
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Shame on me......I wish there was a third person we were following. I don't want to lose some of the 'specialness' of Mike by having him on too much (if that makes sense).
I hadn't thought that, but I get it (I think). Sometimes you want an enigma to keep some of their mystery? A 3rd person would mean 33% less screen time for Mike (assuming they split it evenly). Personally, I like that Mike's path is similar but different to Saul's (and Walt's). So far Saul is the closest to retaining his "sainthood" (even for a hitman).
Would have preferred him keeping that last comment to himself, just for his own sake.
This I'm not positive which comment you mean. I'm going to assume the "that's all ya got?" or whatever it exactly was comment? I thought that was to have Tuco assault him in plain view of the police (thereby not requiring him to testify to get a conviction).
Jimmy becoming Saul is now resting on him. Works a bit better when the obstacles are created by others (such as last season). But it's still early in the game.
It is very similar to Walt's journey into the abyss. Life screwed him (cancer). He tried to do it the *right* way, but it became clear very quickly the right way was the wrong way (he'd probably die of cancer (first go round) and leave nothing but financial ruin.)
But when the cancer went away and he had *enough* money, he lost the sympathy. But the writing really left us with what people always tend to say about somebody "broke bad". "You just don't know him like we did. He used to be a good man. Things went south and he got caught up in it and was down the path never to return before he even realized how he got there." In this case, it is the viewer somewhat saying that.
Jimmy tried to do it right and wasn't getting anywhere. So he got *creative*. His work paid off and we find him basically set up in the job one would assume somebody in that position would want. He had to get it to realize it isn't just about the prestige of accepted success (to him). He needs the rush. He's doing it because he likes it. And it is a sociopath journey because others around him are paying for his rush.
Despite all that, it is hardly a reboot of Breaking Bad. Love the show. And love talking about it with others. I don't make much of an effort to spot the cameos, so it is nice coming here to see some I may have missed. A google search is more effective, but that takes all the fun out of it.
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I don't make a point to look for cameos or nods to BB, but I usually catch them.
Crazy-8 the other day, for example.
And I recognized the arms dealer immediately as the guy Walt bought a gun from (twice).
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Just caught up with this show, I saw most of season 1 when it aired but for some reason just stopped. Found myself re-watching Breaking Bad 2 years later and ending up with BCS again. I was surprised to see we're only 4 episodes into the new season, a 2 year break is pretty damn long (it might've been announced but I didn't know about it).
Loved Breaking Bad when I first saw it, and re-watching the entire thing for the second time surprisingly made it even better. I don't like this show just as much but it's very enjoyable and stands on its own pretty well. Though I gotta say, it's fun to spot out the many references made to BB, and I loved seeing Krazy-8 again in the latest episode.
I guess since not everyone who watches this show has seen Breaking Bad, we gotta be careful when making comparisons between the show to prevent spoilers right?
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I guess since not everyone who watches this show has seen Breaking Bad,
Not I. And I've enjoyed the show greatly.
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Gary, you should watch Breaking Bad. Knock it out in two weeks and report back. ;)
BB SPOILER BELOW
Also, and this isn't too much of a spoiler, but the first BB episode with Saul, in the scene where Walt and Jesse kidnap Saul, when he is on his knees at the start, Saul is yelling that it was Ignacio, not him, and we all know that Ignacio is Nacho's real first name (Mike said that to "Pryce" after the first buy in the Pimento episode), so we'll see where we go with that. We already know that Mike and Saul will be tight later on in the sense of working together, and Nacho will still be involved for the duration, so it ought to be interesting to see where they go with that.
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Gary, you should watch Breaking Bad. Knock it out in two weeks and report back. ;)
I fully intend to. I'm trying to time it just right though. I know myself, I won't sleep until I get through it so I need to make sure I'm ready to put myself through that :lol
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Mild Spoiler:
Evidently when Nacho is telling Mike about the former associate who Tuco murdered, it ties back exactly to something that Hank says Tuco is suspected of having done when Hank's giving his colleagues the rundown on Tuco in an early BB episode. Love the little continuity touches like that.
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This I'm not positive which comment you mean. I'm going to assume the "that's all ya got?" or whatever it exactly was comment? I thought that was to have Tuco assault him in plain view of the police (thereby not requiring him to testify to get a conviction).
What did Mike say before the final blow by Tuco. I listened twice, but could not make it out. It could have been what is above, but I thought that was earlier in the fight.
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A slower, more 'foundational' episode tonight. Maybe Kim will heed Jimmy's advice, considering how she was hosed.
Surprising appearance by someone whose name escapes me, but the face rings a bell.
[rim shot]
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I agree it was a slower paced episode tonight. But this is the stuff I love. It is like if a psychology class made a supplemental TV show. The dynamics were so many that you could write a serious paper on this episode alone.
First, the role reversals for Saul and Kim were great. Not only because it happened, because they were both similar and very different. Kim created his situation and Saul created hers.
Next, the family dynamic. And it was done as a great bookend. Starting it showing the weakness of Chuck. Chuck is very accomplished, but his people skills are lacking. Even before the trauma. And he is smart enough to see it, but emotional enough to not want to accept it. At the end, Chuck encapsulated the problem with Saul and in a way, broke down more of his "bad guy" exterior. Saul could be thought of as the black sheep, but that can hint that he doesn't necessarily have redeeming qualities or that their actions are premeditated and/or mean spirited. Saul is the perfect character of the guy that gets bailed out by others no matter how many times they screw others over. The answer to the question "why do you keep helping him/her." And also why the final break seems like an overreaction to those on the outside. The ending of "look. I love ya, but I've got to stop this."
The Saul bathroom meeting where perhaps he got to see what "the best case scenario" of walking away from what he currently has really means. And the best part, you aren't even sure if an a ha moment happened for Saul. He's had quite a few. Going by his character, it probably did not. Or if it did, it will be superficial and fleeting. He's basically a messed up mix of heart and sociopath. And it is a very realistic trait. Better, it had the reverse dynamic of "if you only knew that I am in fact not living the high life."
The Howard pose at the business meeting. It was a call back to Saul copying Howard's pose (and clothes and ...) And again, not quite the same. In fact, it can almost show why a person like Saul is better at Howard (the company image) than Howard. Howard had some game with the small talk, but you could tell it was all fake on both ends. Howard and the "mark" were somewhat job interviewing each other and they knew it. Saul would have made it feel more natural. That's why he gets the senior citizens like a pied piper.
And this is surface level discussion. Why it might be "slower" paced (action wise), but was really a deeply enthralling episode. Exciting even.
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I was trying to keep it short, but the episode was so awesome it feels totally ignoring other very important parts.
The Kim is Jimmy section. Where she is in the doghouse and burning the midnight oil to get out of it. Jimmy working the public criminal cases would be the mirror. He eventually had the "screw this" moment (and yet at the same time did not by bringing in the big class action lawsuit).
What makes this really dig deep into my involvement while watching is knowing exactly what Kim was going through. For many, it might be a job interview. Or the big break to get a promotion. But I watched it as a salesperson/employer knowing that not only do you have to put yourself through what she did, but you get to do it all again. And there really isn't time to say "I did it. That was grueling. Time to relax a bit."
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Surprising appearance by someone whose name escapes me, but the face rings a bell.
[rim shot]
Tio!
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Just watched the latest episode. That final scene could definitely be a game-changer here. I'm saying Tuco sent his uncle himself. Whatever Mike decides he's gonna be screwed in some way, either pissing off Nacho or Tuco. This will be interesting for sure. I'm thinking Jimmy/Saul will have a part in this little 'side-story' at some point. Remeber the second episode of season 1? That's probably going to repeat itself in one way or another.
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Considering Tuco is not locked up and all these major players are alive in a few years on BB, we can rule out Tuco or his familia killing Mike. ;)
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And Mike eventually works for Gus, who hates the cartel, but still works with them nonetheless.
I can't wait to see how Hector ends up in that wheelchair.
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And Mike eventually works for Gus, who hates the cartel, but still works with them nonetheless.
I can't wait to see how Hector ends up in that wheelchair.
There is a good chance they will show this, but I hope they don't feel the need to explain everything.
One thing that has been gnawing at me is the Saul and Walt separation scene where Saul lectures Walt the way others lecture Saul.
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Mike has to take the deal and he knows it. As someone who just did this two episodes ago, he is foreseeing the stick coming swiftly if he refuses the carrot. It's uncanny (albeit intentional) how much Mike's journey parallel's Walt's. He tries to get some extra cash to help his family and gets pulled in too deep.
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Absolutely. The breaking bad journey of each of them is unique yet similar.
Will we have a pre-pre-series? Tuco and Tio. Tuco just used to be a sweet little dude and .... :lol Nope. That series might just be called Born Bad. Gus (chicken man) might be interesting however. When all is said and done, he was much better at the drug trade than Walt.
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"How many lawyers does it take to fix a lightbulb?"
Which takes you back to the opening scene of Chuck actually doing it himself (and putting on an album, and...)
Kim was superb. The slow, foundational .....can work so well with Saul (and BB). The scenes in the stairway, in the 'dungeon', looking down at her from the flagpole......
Saul referring to his shadow as a 'Stasi'. One doesn't hear that often.
After reading a review, I was lucky to catch the end again. The subtleties of this show that so often go unnoticed on the first viewing, because they are simple, everyday occurrences. Mike at his table in the diner, viewed from the kitchen. An order is ready, placed on the ledge, and .....'Ding!'
No big deal.
Yeah, it IS a big deal.
frickin' brilliant!!!!!!!
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The waitress in the diner was the same one from the BB episode where Mike met Lydia once. I think her name was Fran. It was when Lydia tried to act all non-suspicious by calling him Dwayne, and the waitress, already knowing Mike because he was obviously a regular, called him by his real name, making Lydia lower her head in shame. :lol :lol
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Considering Tuco is not locked up and all these major players are alive in a few years on BB, we can rule out Tuco or his familia killing Mike. ;)
Of course, but we don't know how many years there are between BCS and BB. Tuco could still be locked up for some time in between. His appearance isn't that of the drug lord he's portrayed as in BB, so he still has some sort of development to go through as well. That doesn't mean stuff can happen.
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Considering Tuco is not locked up and all these major players are alive in a few years on BB, we can rule out Tuco or his familia killing Mike. ;)
Of course, but we don't know how many years there are between BCS and BB. Tuco could still be locked up for some time in between. His appearance isn't that of the drug lord he's portrayed as in BB, so he still has some sort of development to go through as well. That doesn't mean stuff can happen.
It isn't 8+ years, so we can assume something happens to make it less. And unless there is a huge twist, that something would be the deal in some form.
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^ No, it's probably only around 1-2 years, since Kayleigh will still be a child in BB.
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I thought we were told at some point that it's five years? Unless I'm mistaken.
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Makes you wonder how much prep before even the first episode of BCS was penned so they don't paint themselves into a corner that forces them to resolve poorly.
Has Vince set up a paranoia style room with pictures and string on a wall that will eventually drive him to insanity? ;D
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I thought we were told at some point that it's five years? Unless I'm mistaken.
I think it was stated at some point. But we don't have to hunt it down. It absolutely was not 8+ years.
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I believe it is 2002. And BB began in 2008 and only took place over the span of two years exactly (with the first year taking four seasons plus - Walt's 50th was in Season 1, episode; his 51st was in Season 5, episode 4 or 5).
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How do they explain Kayleigh barely getting older then?
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She looked around 10 or 11 in BB. I'll have to look again to see how old she looks in BCS.
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(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/breakingbad/images/8/85/F49b5c3f175ac891a8e6b1918cc733b5.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/505?cb=20150411044049)
(https://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/breakingbad/images/5/5c/3ecf52b1ddbbbdb21ef1bc99d54f912e.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/274?cb=20150411044452)
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I'm loving season 2.
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The waitress in the diner was the same one from the BB episode where Mike met Lydia once. I think her name was Fran. It was when Lydia tried to act all non-suspicious by calling him Dwayne, and the waitress, already knowing Mike because he was obviously a regular, called him by his real name, making Lydia lower her head in shame. :lol :lol
And I remembered Jimmy's Staci's name as Amy, not Erin. Kudos, Kev.
Episode 6: the return of a couple of 'old friends'. All of Mike/Hector/Nacho was superb. For Jimmy, the round peg doesn't fit into the round hole, so he makes his own. A light hearted ending for once.
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Didn't love last night's episode. It felt very filler. The only part I was fully engaged was when Mike came home to find the two visitors.
Wasn't really digging Kim's path either.
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I thought last night's 'Inflatable' was the slowest of the season.
And yet.......we saw the split-screens of Jimmy and that car lot blowup (how did they get 'it' to move with the music?), Kim making a huuuge decision, and Mike having to contemplate doing more evil deeds for his nutty/demanding daughter-in-law.
Was her house the same as we saw in BB?
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Kim's character is losing it a bit for me. She has gone from being the voice of reason to making one rash decision after another. She DID mess up. And the idea that one act of stepping up should put her back in good standing is a bit entitled of her. She should feel lucky to have the opportunity to *jump ship* with essentially a promotion and financial reward to boot. She was hardly being held down by *the man*.
I loved the colorful suit / inflatable dancer section. Not that I thought it was a good decision by Jimmy, but seeing Saul come out was fun.
The opening scene with the grifter was good and I think realistic. That is the exact age area where events like that can make a lasting impression on your personality.
Mike was kind of an ass to Saul as well.
Still enjoyed the episode. Perhaps it is a detriment knowing where Saul will end up.
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The thing I am noticing about Kim is that she has almost no personality, except when she is faking it with a client or during one of her and Jimmy's scams.
The montage and the scene where Jimmy was fired were all great, but the rest all dragged for me again. I like the show, but I cannot say I love it.
"For what it's worth, Cliff, I think you're a nice guy."
"For what it's worth, I think you're an asshole."
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
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"For what it's worth, Cliff, I think you're a nice guy."
"For what it's worth, I think you're an asshole."
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
YESSSS. Probably the best part of the entire episode.
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Perhaps it is a detriment knowing where Saul will end up.
This is a really good point, I always remind myself of this when I'm watching the show. It's still intriguing to think about what will happen to Kim, HHM, Chuck, etc. This season has been awesome so far :tup
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Definitely interested in what happens to those around Saul.
Will Kim become successful in the traditional way and grow tired of Saul's antics?
Will she struggle and penniless and blame Saul realizing her prior path was pretty sweet and it was stupid to take this risk and never talk to him again.
Did she get hurt or lose her life as a result of Saul's schemes?
Will we find out she was down the hall of Saul Goodman the entire BB series? Maybe Walter saw her first and she said "oh. You're a scumbag. I refer scumbags to my unofficial partner down the hall." (I know this has problems, just having fun)
But Breaking Bad has led me to conclude certain things with strong confidence like the Mike deal with Tio based almost entirely off my BB knowledge. And BB is already a blur to me.
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Perhaps it is a detriment knowing where Saul will end up.
This is a really good point, I always remind myself of this when I'm watching the show. It's still intriguing to think about what will happen to Kim, HHM, Chuck, etc. This season has been awesome so far :tup
I don't see anything dramatic happening with HHM. They are a law firm that will carry on as is long after Jimmy becomes Saul.
Chuck is already pretty much out of Jimmy's life, especially now that the Sandpiper connection is severed because of Jimmy going on his own again, but I am sure we haven't heard the last of him.
Kim is too much a big part of Jimmy's life for her to just disappear from his life without plenty of drama, but I doubt it is too awful since Saul never struck me as a guy who had remorse for where he was or what he did, and I think genuine remorse would have been there had Kim taken a big fall or something. Granted, BB was written first, and likely without the thought of BCS eventually being written as a prequel, but Vince Gilligan is too brilliant in his writing to not connect most or all of the dots somehow, someway.
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Saul never struck me as a guy who had remorse for where he was or what he did, and I think genuine remorse would have been there had Kim taken a big fall or something.
BB Saul seems infinitely more aware of how his actions affect others than BCS Jimmy. Jimmy seems completely clueless. But Saul sounds like he is speaking from experience when he lectures Walt. It is the equivalent of handing down "I've been there" knowledge. Perhaps Kim is that experience since it is the only thing he truly cares about. She might have to hit rock bottom before he might actually come to the conclusion that "Wow. I might have had a huge part in this."
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Guess (but fun) at this point.
The flashes of Saul post BB scenes. Do you think the series will eventually make that the present scene? Will he have some type of epiphany and make his way back to Kim? BB ended in (relative) tragedy. BCS doesn't have to end in tragedy. Saul is more likeable, so his redemption (no matter how small) might be worth pursuing. Or it could go to the present where he tries to get things in order to end in tragedy. Possibly even him coming to Kim with "I've changed" only to end with her closing the door with a nice "fuck off".
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I'm hoping that the prequel at some point becomes a sequel.
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I doubt they'd be showing flash forwards of Saul if they weren't going to show us something later on regarding his life post-Walter White.
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Just realized. Those flash forwards (or flash presents) are pretty destructive and probably confusing to those that started with BCS but haven't watched BB (or all of it). Great for those that watched BB, but bad for those that haven't.
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For the hell of it........does Kim become Wendy?
Yeah, I know, different actresses........
BTW.....the details of this show always frickin' amaze me. I found out that the same actress that played the realtor for the house that Mike bought his DIL, was the same as the one that caught Marie stealing the spoons at a house she was showing on BB.
Their attention to detail just baffles me!
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For the hell of it........does Kim become Wendy?
For reference, Wendy is the *crack* whore
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/breakingbad/images/2/2e/Wendy_smoking_-_Half_Measures.png)
Damn that is dark. And also interesting.
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Hate to say it, but Saul's moves tonight were pretty damned scummy.
I was fine with Kim taking the client even though it is borderline. She expected too much for bringing in the one client. So her Saul like move was a bit of her problem. That said, HHM also took the risk of such a move by not giving even an inch, so it was right in that grey area. Also thought HHM's counter move was perfectly acceptable and really well done. People take lawsuits against a business for compromising their name (even when it is true). So Chuck was smooth.
Saul's reaction was where it got bad. And of course, that is the point, but it borderlines on losing all sympathy for him too soon. The reaction to Chuck's problem seemed just way too cruel. I have somebody in my family that both has serious medical issues and also has faked serious problems just to get attention. And they fake so much that when they start faking those around him have to take a "you better not be faking" stance. But despite all that crap, we still are worried and start making the call and getting the car ready for help. It just seems like human nature to worry that no matter how many false alarms you've witnessed, you don't want to risk it. Not saying Chuck was faking, but it puts in perspective the possible Saul reaction that Chuck was never in danger. It really made me look at Saul as inhuman.
I wonder if anybody thought to tell Vince that Saul's copy store was too old school even for that time period.
Mike was a slow burn, so not much to say there.
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The take-out joint at the start of the latest episode, is that the place Jesse was at when he bought a gun in Breaking Bad?
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Yes, believe it was the same joint.
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Last week, I said this:
The thing I am noticing about Kim is that she has almost no personality, except when she is faking it with a client or during one of her and Jimmy's scams.
And I kinda still think that, which is why Rhea Seehorn should get mad props; she is doing a fantastic job in portraying that character. Because those of us who watched BB kind of know the direction Mike and Jimmy are both going in, Kim's ultimate fate is the most intriguing right now; I can't wait to see what happens to her.
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Loved this episode! The scene with Chuck, Jimmy and Kim was brilliant. I felt so uncomfortable when Chuck revealed what Jimmy did yet it felt good when Kim defended Jimmy, so weird.
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I'll just leave this here
Fifi
Rebecca
Inflatable
Nailed
Gloves Off
Switch
Bali Ha'i
Amarillo
Cobbler
Klick
Coincidence?
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Great episode. The ending really put Jimmy in the ultimate test of humanity.
Kind of sad that Kim defended Jimmy knowing he did it (as shown in the bed scene later). Chuck isn't a saint, but people don't deserve what Jimmy did. If anything, this is kind of the Chuck redemption season.
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I'll just leave this here
Fifi
Rebecca
Inflatable
Nailed
Gloves Off
Switch
Bali Ha'i
Amarillo
Cobbler
Klick
Coincidence?
Quite possibly, given that isn't the episode order. If it's intentional, that's a damn obscure clue. :lol
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Great episode. The ending really put Jimmy in the ultimate test of humanity.
Yeah seriously, really great stuff.
Kind of sad that Kim defended Jimmy knowing he did it (as shown in the bed scene later). Chuck isn't a saint, but people don't deserve what Jimmy did. If anything, this is kind of the Chuck redemption season.
Don't agree at all. I mean obviously what Jimmy did was wrong and illegal, but Chuck is still a dick and I have little sympathy for him.
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I mean obviously what Jimmy did was wrong and illegal, but Chuck is still a dick and I have little sympathy for him.
Chuck's biggest flaw is an inferiority-superiority complex (they tend to go hand-in-hand). But his biggest problem with Jimmy is he doesn't think he's a real lawyer. And Jimmy proved him right this season. He's a salesman, not a lawyer.
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I mean obviously what Jimmy did was wrong and illegal, but Chuck is still a dick and I have little sympathy for him.
Chuck's biggest flaw is an inferiority-superiority complex (they tend to go hand-in-hand). But his biggest problem with Jimmy is he doesn't think he's a real lawyer. And Jimmy proved him right this season. He's a salesman, not a lawyer.
But how much of that is Chuck's fault? If he hadn't deliberately tried to sabotage Jimmy's career, things would probably have gone very differently.
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I believe that was addressed in the beginning of the season when Jimmy was somewhat handed the perfect scenario, and he managed to find a problem (the cupholder).
It is important to note that his "handler" came only after he did his commercial sleight of hand.
Jimmy seems to think that going on his own is the only way somebody can truly thrive, yet at the same time he keeps sticking his nose in Kim's business (yeah, I see it).
Chuck isn't the problem. He's Jimmy's latest excuse. Why do *I* scam people? Because you are either scamming or being scammed as per his early life "teachable moment". Although there is something to that, it assumes only two options.
Kim's arc illustrated Chuck's possible arc. When they asked Chuck "is Jimmy read to be a lawyer?", Chuck thought ahead and wisely answered "no." Kim answered yes, and now she can't believe that Jimmy can't connect how his actions were the root of the problem. His intent doesn't matter as much as his results.
I know what it is like to *cover* for a relation/friend in the workplace (as most probably do to different degrees). You don't go out to sabotage their career. If they have a problem showing up on time or completing a project, if asked you might kind of sugar coat the problem. You usually don't burst out "they're a fuck up" or "they're on drugs and will probably always will be stoned in a haze on the couch instead of showing up at the proper time." But if it happens again and again and again and you cover and cover and cover, at some point you are being taken less and less at your word.
Chuck isn't perfect, but I hardly blame him for Jimmy's life choices unless the show ends up showing us something radically different in the future.
And it is cool that the show is presenting stuff that doesn't have an obvious "that is bad. that is good." character/plot development.
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The fact remains that pretty much everything Chuck has said about Jimmy is right.
That said, Kim defending Jimmy to Chuck was awesome.
I really hope Chuck isn't dead; his character adds so much to the show.
Overall, terrific episode.
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Now the ending of the show is pretty tough. I can get that Jimmy is hoping the others do the right thing and call 911. But if they don't and it leaves Chuck dead or just permanently damaged, then Jimmy has gone too far. He's almost irredeemable.
His actions prior created a situation where calling 911 has other consequences. What is sad is he won't even realize this (according to past a ha moments gone over his head), but will instead blame others.
It is all interesting because of his final scene with Walt where he seems to have a new attitude. Either a) he hit a serious bottom and had an epiphany or b) can only see faults in others, but not himself.
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That said, Kim defending Jimmy to Chuck was awesome.
It is interesting. Although not the same, I had a similar dilemma a few years ago.
Party A - the wronged (Chuck)
Party B - possibly tied up in the wrong, but not the direct cause - I cared about Party B. (Office store employee)
Party C - the wrongdoer. Not only do I not care about them, I despise them. (Jimmy)
Party D - Another person pitted against Party A via Party B (Kim)
Me - The other Kim, different reaction.
Party A shows up to discuss what Party C did and brought up the Party B connection. I felt empathy for Party A, but didn't want to just take down Party C unless Party B could be taken out of the equation. For the most part, I remained neutral and as quiet as the discussion would allow.
Party D pulled the Kim and instead started to attack Party A with the "really, this is your own fault." The entire time D and A started yelling at each other all I could do is think quietly on the side was "shut up D. This is literally two wrongs trying to make a right." It was not a fun experience and I didn't think "you go girl" with Party D's actions. Now if Party D truly was deceived, that's a different story. But they made it clear Kim was never confused as to whether Party Jimmy was guilty or not.
It would have been better if she stuck to "Well. There is no definitive proof here, so I'm withholding judgment of either party for the time being."
Bad TV though, because this is all a part of Kim's journey as well. She definitely stopped being the moral yet understanding anchor a few episodes ago. Right now, she's young Jimmy in his dad's liquor store with Jimmy being the scammer seducing her. She didn't just "break bad" immediately like impressionable young Jimmy, but she's started down that path.
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Jimmy is doing the wrong things for the right reasons. Chuck is doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. I empathize with Jimmy and think Chuck is an ass hole who has gone out of the way to sabotage Jimmy several times.
Regardless, this has surpassed Breaking Bad for me.
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Jimmy is doing the wrong things for the right reasons. Chuck is doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. I empathize with Jimmy and think Chuck is an ass hole who has gone out of the way to sabotage Jimmy several times.
Regardless, this has surpassed Breaking Bad for me.
I agree with all of this.
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I'll just leave this here
Fifi
Rebecca
Inflatable
Nailed
Gloves Off
Switch
Bali Ha'i
Amarillo
Cobbler
Klick
Coincidence?
Quite possibly, given that isn't the episode order. If it's intentional, that's a damn obscure clue. :lol
Oh I definitely think it's intentional. The odds alone that the first episode title would contain one out of those ten letters is just worse than a coin flip. I don't have time to work out all the permutations for the actual odds that this is a coincidence, but they're quite small.
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The chance of it being that specific combination of letters, sure, that'd be small, but until we see Fring we have no reason to think that the combination of letters means anything. The odds of having a combination of letters that could be an anagram for something from BB wouldn't be that long.
EDIT: That said, I understand that Gilligan has always liked to play around with episode titles, including anagrams (e.g. Felina = Finale) so that probably makes it less likely that it's just coincidence.
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Yeah, I can't think the titles starting with this combination of letters is a coincidence, and I can't see why Gilligan would do that unless the chicken man is showing up next week.
I'm going to be seriously mad now if he's not there next week :lol
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Jimmy is doing the wrong things for the right reasons. Chuck is doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. I empathize with Jimmy and think Chuck is an ass hole who has gone out of the way to sabotage Jimmy several times.
Regardless, this has surpassed Breaking Bad for me.
The bolded is a great way to put it.
No way it is surpassing BB, in my eyes.
BTW, I loved the Abbey Road look of Jimmy and his crew when they crossed the street on the way to that school to take the picture. :lol :lol :lol
Also, I am not worried about Jimmy being irredeemable if Chuck dies or is a shell of what he has already become. I have faith that the writers will find a way to make Jimmy likable as heck again, regardless. To compare (BB spoiler below):
BB spoiler: for those of us who watched that, Walt should have been irredeemable after he watched Jane die, but many of us still rooted for him after that, even as he kept doing far worse things (poisoning Brock, for example).
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Jimmy is doing the wrong things for the right reasons. Chuck is doing the right thing for the wrong reasons.
I'm not getting this. The only reasons I'm seeing is he wanted to impress Chuck and Kim. Now he wants to do it to "gloat" over Chuck and impress Kim. By impress, I mean set the conditions to *get some*.
Sandpiper: This wasn't about the clients so much as it was to impress Chuck and Kim. Didn't work with Chuck and when it didn't guarantee Kim nookie, he didn't care and refused the Davis & Main offer. He didn't reconsider until Kim slept with him again. Did commercial using the short-sighted process. When all is said and done, he stops caring about Sandpiper and forces his firing. Not to save Sandpiper, but for his own needs.
Mesa Verde: He doesn't care about this client's best interest. In fact, causes a 6 week hardship just so they go back to Kim. Hardly the right reason - impress Kim, get some, make sure she has a client to help pay their overhead.
I'm just not seeing these "right reasons". I am for Chuck, however. Nothing is black and white so I can find it both ways for both characters, but on the average, I don't see Jimmy doing things for the right reasons. Care to share some right reason decisions?
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The right reasons is that Jimmy is looking out for Jimmy because no one else will (mainly because of his own doing though). He is a wolf, not a sheep.
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The right reasons is that Jimmy is looking out for Jimmy because no one else will (mainly because of his own doing though). He is a wolf, not a sheep.
I'm not really seeing that though.
Chuck did look out for him. Just because Jimmy shouldn't be a lawyer doesn't mean Chuck has blocked every path.
Kim looks out for him. She encourages and helps him pass the bar.
Howard helped Jimmy.
Davis and Main helped Jimmy.
The dude is getting help left and right. They only stop helping him because he craps all over them. It was all summed up with
"For what it's worth, Cliff, I think you're a nice guy."
"For what it's worth, I think you're an asshole."
This show is kind of a rorschach test
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Finally caught up with this season and I can't believe how awesome it's been so far. This is like Fargo season 2 and I've loved every second of it. I can't compare this show to BB, I think both as very different kind of shows and both are awesome. I'm just very glad they've given a lot more character depth to Mike, Kim and Nacho. I think Vince Gilligan really nailed it in telling a simple story with such great depth and an excellent compelling visual style.
Can't wait for the season finale on Monday.
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This is like Fargo season 2 and I've loved every second of it.
Maybe I should find some time to watch that show.
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This is like Fargo season 2 and I've loved every second of it.
Maybe I should find some time to watch that show.
You should.
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^ What he said. Fantastic show.
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I watched the first episode of Fargo, it really annoyed me pretty much all the way through so I didn't continue. I've been meaning to try again at some point though.
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Chuck did look out for him. Just because Jimmy shouldn't be a lawyer doesn't mean Chuck has blocked every path.
Strongly disagree, and I don't see why "Jimmy shouldn't be a lawyer", other than because Chuck doesn't want him to be.
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One could easily make the argument that anyone who does what Jimmy just did - intentionally sabotaging the client of a major law firm, a client who is now screwed, simply because Jimmy wanted to impress his lawyer girlfriend - should not be a lawyer. In fact, had Kim did what Chuck wanted her to, outing what Jimmy did to the higher-ups, it is more than likely that, if proven, Jimmy would be disbarred.
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This is like Fargo season 2 and I've loved every second of it.
Maybe I should find some time to watch that show.
You should.
Yes you should.
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What kind of annoyed me about the whole thing is that Chuck described exactly what happened down to the last detail even though he was highly incapacitated during the entire thing. I understand the show is demonstrating how sharp of a lawyer he is but I kind of rolled my eyes when the three of them met because it just felt too convenient and the audience was robbed of something. I hope Chuck doesn't recover from the end of the last episode and is just offed from the show because I can't stand his character.
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I'll try never to put an episode slightly down for seeming 'slow', because the development of the characters and story lines pop one hell of a wallop the following week. An understatement in describing Episode 9.
I thought of 'Abbey Road' during the walk. I want you......to watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sLHKWNKY50
Wish there were 13 episodes per season.
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Saw Chuck's 'moment' from a mile away. But, it was still quite an ending. He has 'Slippin' Jimmy' in his blood as well, but with hate and malice.
Mike's note was the big unexpected moment of the show.
Only 42 weeks til season 3.......
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Great episode, I loved it. As for the note on Mike's car I believe there's a clue in the episode titles with some creative rearrangement :biggrin:
Fifi
Rebecca
Inflatable
Nailed
Gloves off
Switch
Bali Hai'i
Amarillo
Cobbler
Klick
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Interesting ending.
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Great episode, I loved it. As for the note on Mike's car I believe there's a clue in the episode titles with some creative rearrangement :biggrin:
Fifi
Rebecca
Inflatable
Nailed
Gloves off
Switch
Bali Hai'i
Amarillo
Cobbler
Klick
could be Brick Fangs. Or Frick Bangs.
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Saw Chuck's 'moment' from a mile away. But, it was still quite an ending. He has 'Slippin' Jimmy' in his blood as well, but with hate and malice.
Mike's note was the big unexpected moment of the show.
Yeah, I actually thought to myself when he was digging through the trunk with chop sticks that he was looking for a recorder....then once he started in the way he did on Jimmy it was pretty obvious he was playing to Jimmy's weakness to always 'protect' and care for him.
and that note to Mike....I've never watched BB so I don't know if that'd had been from a character from that show that is to come or not....still pretty chilling being that Mike seemingly always has the upper hand.
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I really like how they are setting up a plausible foundation for what seemed like an odd dual role for Mike in Breaking Bad.
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I think Gus had one of his guys put the note on Mike's car. We still might not see Gus for a while, but we all know that Gus always kept tabs on Hector, and therefore is keeping tabs on Mike already. It's just a matter of time before we see him.
Last night did a great job of already showing Jimmy as a sympathetic character, after they took him the other way last week...saying to hell with the plan and rushing in to help Chuck at the copy place, staying by his side at the hospital, refusing to commit him because he knew it was the wrong thing to do, admitting to what he did when he saw Chuck in pain over his "mistake" (even though it was staged by Chuck), etc.
I kind of saw Chuck recording it coming, since it seemed out of character for him suddenly to be so down on himself.
Overall, a good finale. Not great, but good.
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I know Jimmy did a really crappy thing but I fucking hate Chuck and want nothing but the worst for him. I think it has more to do with really disliking someone who is confounded by the idea of making a mistake.
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I'd say Jimmy did more than a crappy thing; he did an illegal thing, one that could land him in prison (although we know that won't happen). He is well on his way to becoming the criminal lawyer we all know and enjoy. :coolio
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I really like how they are setting up a plausible foundation for what seemed like an odd dual role for Mike in Breaking Bad.
What about his role seems oddly dual? It seems like they're setting up and have shown his dislike for the Salamanca clan which would then align right into joining Fring. Doesn't seem like anything oddly dual to me. Unless I'm missing something.
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What about his role seems oddly dual?
In Breaking Bad, he worked for both Gus and Saul. It was talked about quite a bit as it became more developed. Better Call Saul is really filling in how this dynamic evolved.
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I know Jimmy did a really crappy thing but I fucking hate Chuck and want nothing but the worst for him. I think it has more to do with really disliking someone who is confounded by the idea of making a mistake.
Consider that last night was a taste of Jimmy getting a taste of his own medicine. Being a Slippin' Jimmy can sometimes be mistaken for just a guy being smart about life. And in some ways it is. But the more important ingredient is having the ability to not give a shit about the consequences one causes. In Jimmy's case, it is even beyond that. He isn't just not giving a shit, they've established he is completely unaware.
So if you hate Chuck for what he did, then you essentially hate Jimmy.
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What about his role seems oddly dual?
In Breaking Bad, he worked for both Gus and Saul. It was talked about quite a bit as it became more developed. Better Call Saul is really filling in how this dynamic evolved.
Ah I misread your initial comment. I thought you meant Gus and Salamanca for some reason.
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Interesting poll. How many know a Jimmy in their lives (past or present)? How many know a Chuck? With the caveat that TV does tend to show more extreme cases, so they don't necessarily have to be as far gone as Chuck or Jimmy, but in the ballpark.
If you think about it, they have the same problem, but just with two different solutions.
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I know Jimmy did a really crappy thing but I fucking hate Chuck and want nothing but the worst for him. I think it has more to do with really disliking someone who is confounded by the idea of making a mistake.
Consider that last night was a taste of Jimmy getting a taste of his own medicine. Being a Slippin' Jimmy can sometimes be mistaken for just a guy being smart about life. And in some ways it is. But the more important ingredient is having the ability to not give a shit about the consequences one causes. In Jimmy's case, it is even beyond that. He isn't just not giving a shit, they've established he is completely unaware.
So if you hate Chuck for what he did, then you essentially hate Jimmy.
This makes absolutely no sense to me. I don't understand how you can assert that Jimmy doesn't care when he was so focussed on his brother's wellbeing that 1. he rushed to help him, and 2. he fell for Chuck's trap and confessed.
This episode solidified Chuck's status as a total bastard. :lol We now know that it's not just that he doesn't care - he has had a grudge against Jimmy for a while, and one that Jimmy is entirely unaware of. And he also knows full well that Jimmy cares about him, but abuses that knowledge to get him to confess.
Anyway, great episode.
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This makes absolutely no sense to me. I don't understand how you can assert that Jimmy doesn't care when he was so focussed on his brother's wellbeing that 1. he rushed to help him, and 2. he fell for Chuck's trap and confessed.
1. His brother's wellbeing was put in harm's way by Jimmy himself. When Chuck helped Jimmy, it was not because Chuck put him in that situation. Chuck is far from perfect. In fact, as I said earlier, they are a lot alike. They just go about tearing the other down in different ways.
2. He got Jimmy'd. And the first time he gets Jimmy'd, he suddenly is worse than Jimmy's lifetime of Jimmy scams?
Jimmy had so many opportunities to come clean, but he literally lied to Chuck's face as Chuck came out of his catatonic state in a hospital bed. That's low.
On top of all of this, Jimmy's scan was not for the right reason. Why did Kim deserve the client more than HHM? The client was secured while Kim was an employee. They serviced the client well, whereas Jimmy hurt the client.
And why should Chuck just "admit he made a mistake and move on" when he didn't create the mistake. Jimmy lecturing Chuck on that was vomit inducing. Mesa Verde couldn't just move on. HHM's reputation couldn't just move on. Chuck is making a return to work and this puts his *faculties* in question.
Jimmy isn't entirely unaware of Chuck's grudge. In fact, he blames everything on Chuck, even when Chuck is not the culprit (Kim's doghouse). Kim even talks about Jimmy gloating over Chuck on multiple occasions. Jimmy's grudge with Chuck is every bit as bad as Chuck's. Except Chuck has quite a few legitimate reasons for the grudge. Jimmy's grudge is that Chuck doesn't think Jimmy would be a good lawyer. He's right. There's a trail of proof a mile wide.
What if proof of sabotage can help Mesa Verde recover. That the proven circumstances allow that provisional path. Would that not be actually the right thing to do? And unfortunately for Kim, her relationship to Jimmy will hurt her in this case. She might immediately become persona non grata. That is all on Jimmy.
As far as Jimmy and Kim, he isn't looking out for her best interest. Her best interest was to take that other job. It was a great opportunity. But that would mean she's even further from his social circle, which reduces his chance to end up with her long term. Let's not even get into the fact that he also derailed her at HHM.
This episode solidified Chuck's status as a total bastard. :lol We now know that it's not just that he doesn't care - he has had a grudge against Jimmy for a while, and one that Jimmy is entirely unaware of. And he also knows full well that Jimmy cares about him, but abuses that knowledge to get him to confess.
Kind of like when Jimmy sent Ernesto away so he could sabotage Chuck, even leaving him alone unattended. Jimmy put Chuck's life in danger on multiple occasions. Chuck is just making Jimmy answer to his own actions.
And this is why the series is so great, like Breaking Bad. All the characters have flaws as well as impressive traits. And a lot of it is not based off one moment, but a series of forks in the road. Where a lie is needed to cover another lie and so on. And although some events/characteristics might be exaggerated, most seem quite relatable and plausible.
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I disagree with pretty much everything you just said, so I guess let's agree to disagree. :lol The only specific point I'll make is that nothing Jimmy has done could reasonably be seen as putting Chuck's life in danger.
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I'm not really looking for agreement anyway. I think the TV show is cool because it creates a lot of grey. So the viewers will have different takes. It is fun to talk about.
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Chucks an asshole who is obviously crazy and envious of jimmy.
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Didn't love the finale. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't the best episode of the season. And I stand by my post above that Chuck is an asshole and is acting like a little bitch. I read IGN's review of the episode and I agree with their statement that Chuck is the most despicable villain in the Breaking Bad/BCS universe.
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Saw Chuck's 'moment' from a mile away. But, it was still quite an ending. He has 'Slippin' Jimmy' in his blood as well, but with hate and malice.
Mike's note was the big unexpected moment of the show.
Yeah, I actually thought to myself when he was digging through the trunk with chop sticks that he was looking for a recorder....then once he started in the way he did on Jimmy it was pretty obvious he was playing to Jimmy's weakness to always 'protect' and care for him.
and that note to Mike....I've never watched BB so I don't know if that'd had been from a character from that show that is to come or not....still pretty chilling being that Mike seemingly always has the upper hand.
You have 41+ weeks to watch BB until Season 3 of BCS ;)
Seriously: we had a friend who pushed that show on us, and am so glad she did.
As to Jimmy and Chuck: Jimmy sees people who are wronged, feels it in his heart, and tries to right it.
Chuck: all cold, calculated ego and business, with a vendetta. So what if he knows that Kim was wronged, treated like dirt (he was cold to her as well, but got her out of the dungeon).....it was all about ego and sticking it to his brother's friend when he helped take back Mesa Verda.
The Walter White moment: take a job with Grey Matter, have insurance for treatments......show is over.
Chuck: let Kim have Mesa Verda, and move on.
And yet, one of the most sympathetic 'villians' ever created. We winced while he was in the ER and during the CATscan.
As to the finale: The penultimate episodes tend to be the 'best', with the last one more of a next season opener. But always with a twist.
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I read IGN's review of the episode and I agree with their statement that Chuck is the most despicable villain in the Breaking Bad/BCS universe.
They didn't say villain, they just said "character", which I disagree wholeheartedly with. Marie was a thousand times more annoying than Chuck has ever been.
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The Walter White moment: take a job with Grey Matter, have insurance for treatments......show is over.
Chuck: let Kim have Mesa Verda, and move on.
Are you suggesting that Chuck is the Walter White role and Jimmy is the Jesse role? Interesting.
But I have another moment for you:
Jimmy: let Kim take new position at Schweikart & Cokely. Mesa Verde stays at HHM and gets properly serviced. Kim takes a huge leap in her career and becomes the attorney she was meant to be. The ugly events thereafter never happen.
But that is drama. If people didn't make bad decisions, there would be no drama.
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Didn't love the finale. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't the best episode of the season. And I stand by my post above that Chuck is an asshole and is acting like a little bitch. I read IGN's review of the episode and I agree with their statement that Chuck is the most despicable villain in the Breaking Bad/BCS universe.
Sounds to me like some are you are caught up in the moment. ;)
Chuck is worse than Gus?
Worse than Jack?
Worst than Todd??
No freaking way.
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I loved the season through and through. Great final episode. It wasn't overly overdramatic and one of those now typical "we gotta have flare and explosions and fuck everything up because FINALE" episodes but it shot the story forward and set up for some amazing things in the future, which is what a good finale should do. I'll just echo the statements made on Chuck with one amendment in that the only reason he's a wee bit more despicable than Jimmy is that he is deluded in thinking he is "better", by that I mean morally, emotionally, intellectually. They're brothers in every sense of the word going beyond blood; they're the same, it's just that Chuck plays the system from within and with the parameters of the law in mind instead of saying fuck it.
But I loved everything. Once again though, my absolute favorite facet of the season was Mike's story and the characters surrounding him. Ignacio is really something and is very interesting as the bad guy with a smidgen of good ("good" might be pushing it, more like "leniency/mercy/logic"). But overall it was just a super sweet cherry on top of an already fantastic peach cobbler (cause fuck cake). Can't wait for the next season!
Oh and the homages and nods to BB were just fucking beautifully done and really satisfying as a BB addict. They were quick, to the point, weren't thrown in our faces or done without reason and were just totally great.
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Didn't love the finale. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't the best episode of the season. And I stand by my post above that Chuck is an asshole and is acting like a little bitch. I read IGN's review of the episode and I agree with their statement that Chuck is the most despicable villain in the Breaking Bad/BCS universe.
Sounds to me like some are you are caught up in the moment. ;)
Chuck is worse than Gus?
Worse than Jack?
Worst than Todd??
No freaking way.
Those characters are different. Maybe "most despicable" isn't the right phrase, but all those characters are brutal, heartless killers, but for business reasons. What they do is illegal and wrong, but there's a simple logic to it as they do it for their own benefit. Whereas Chuck's actions are personal - treating Jimmy like shit doesn't benefit him or anyone else. He just does it because he doesn't like Jimmy and has an unreasonable grudge against him.
So while those you listed are worse people, they're far more likeable. Chuck is just all-round awful.
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The Walter White moment: take a job with Grey Matter, have insurance for treatments......show is over.
Chuck: let Kim have Mesa Verda, and move on.
Are you suggesting that Chuck is the Walter White role and Jimmy is the Jesse role? Interesting.
But I have another moment for you:
Jimmy: let Kim take new position at Schweikart & Cokely. Mesa Verde stays at HHM and gets properly serviced. Kim takes a huge leap in her career and becomes the attorney she was meant to be. The ugly events thereafter never happen.
But that is drama. If people didn't make bad decisions, there would be no drama.
That would work as well. I kept hoping that Jimmy becoming Saul was from being backed into a corner, or just saying 'eff it'...due to events beyond his control,....not from things he had a hand in to a certain degree.
btw...I never thought of Chuck as the 'Walter White', but now that you mentioned it, it does kinda fit. Good point!
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bump.
Season 3 Premiere Monday April 10th
https://www.tvguide.com/news/better-call-saul-season-3-premiere-date-amc/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtkiCGzv3Zw
Gus!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8vfckXAPJ8
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While marketing-wise it makes sense to tease Gus' return, I would have preferred for him to appear unannounced and out of the blue.
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The first letters from last season's episodes spelled out 'Fring's Back', so this just confirmed it....and the ad gave me and my wife such a huge smile. We're starting our rewatch of Season 2 in a couple of weeks. This will add to the enjoyment. Thanks for sharing.
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Yeah, I don't know that they would have been able to keep his return a secret even if they wanted to. Very much looking forward to season 3 though.
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In season two there were many hints to Gus' presence and I think it was inevitable given that Mike works for him in Breaking Bad so I don't know if it was really a surprise but more of an eventuality.
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Yeah there was zero surprise potential, the creators and producers were talking about this before the show even started. Super excited to see it becoming a reality and I am way overdue for more Saul. I'm absolutely going to rewatch the first two seasons though, I've only had one go at both of them and need to refresh myself and dive into the world again.
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Well, he's back!
Thoroughly enjoyed the episode, the after show 'forum', and then the episode again.
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Finally got around to seeing this. I liked it, and am looking forward to the rest of the season.
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Saw it yesterday, nice to have the show back.
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I loved the whole scene of Jimmy bursting into Chucks house literally seconds after Chuck promised Howard he would do it. :lol
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Why the fuck is Chuck such an insane, despicable asshole?
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Why the fuck is Chuck such an insane, despicable asshole?
I think it boils down to the fact that he knows Jimmie is smarter than him and is a better person than he is.
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I think there has to be more to it than simply jealousy, although lots of stuff portrayed in the series (flashbacks as well) really do make it seem as such. But often I just really feel like Chuck is a bad person, despite (or beyond) being jealous. The scene in which their mother died (flashback, season 2?) comes to mind, but also the scene in which Saul/Jimmy goes out for dinner at Chuck's place when he was still married. He's just an asshole all the way.
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Why the fuck is Chuck such an insane, despicable asshole?
I think it boils down to the fact that he knows Jimmie is smarter than him and is a better person than he is.
I am not sure I agree with either of those.
If you watch BB, you will see that Jimmy/Saul is not a better person than Chuck (unless Chuck at some point has no problem recommending prison shankings :lol).
As for who is smarter, that is hard to say. Chuck is obviously brilliant, and for all of his behavior directed towards Jimmy, he is mostly right about him. Jimmy is just much more likable, not to mention being the show's protagonist, so we are basically programmed to like Jimmy and hate Chuck.
All that aside, terrific episode last night. Howard sneaking through the backyard was hysterical, it was good to see some new/old faces (Gus, Victor, Francesca), and since we know Kim and Chuck do not make it to BB, I can't wait to see what their character arcs are.
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The first two episodes have been fantastic so far. I'm getting really spoiled with the TV shows on so far, The Leftovers, Veep, Fargo & Better Call Saul all have been stellar so far. With Silicon Valley returning this sunday I can't wait.
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Did anyone see Episode 3 yet? I won't go into details (because, you know, spoilers), but some interesting things are set in motion. While the first two episodes were slightly slow (even for BCS standards), there's a bunch of stuff happening in this one.
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Yeah, really enjoyed this week's episode. Funny seeing how the pre-credits scene tied back into what happened later in the episode.
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Yeah, really enjoyed this week's episode. Funny seeing how the pre-credits scene tied back into what happened later in the episode.
As soon as I saw the shoes I knew it was a setup like how they would do in breaking bad. Awesome episode as always. I love the Gus & Mike scenes and can't wait for the eventual working together arrangement. I really wonder what Vince and company have in store for the show and the part that's set in the present, l really wonder if they'll explore more breaking bad territory post Walter White. I'm guessing they'll want to do 3, maybe 4, more seasons and call it quits so I'm curious how it goes.
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Actually the more I think of it, that opening scene might be set in the breaking bad timeline after Mike is in a shootout in the Los pollos truck since that's what drives by. Plus the color grading is different in the opening scene, the shot up Alto sign, the faded shoes.
And even more that I think about that episode, the more stuff I find that references breaking bad, the cigarettes that Jimmy smokes are what Jesse used in BB. I keep reading and thinking of cool stuff in that episode.
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I think the opening scene is set in a pretty distant future (respective to the rest of the episode). The shoes are all worn down and coloured differently. I don't know whether the truck is the same as in Breaking Bad, since Gus used his Pollos trucks pretty much all the time.
the part that's set in the present, l really wonder if they'll explore more breaking bad territory post Walter White.
What part that's set in the present? So far we only got some random Cinnabon scenes with 'Gene'.
I'm guessing they'll want to do 3, maybe 4, more seasons and call it quits so I'm curious how it goes.
Really? That seems like much, but all the better for us I suppose :D
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the part that's set in the present, l really wonder if they'll explore more breaking bad territory post Walter White.
What part that's set in the present? So far we only got some random Cinnabon scenes with 'Gene'.
Yeah that's what I'm wondering, if they'll ever decide to show more of Gene's life.
And come to think of it 3-4 more seasons might be stretching it. I can see 2 more being realistically done, I guess it depends on what more Vince and company feel they can offer to the Saul story.
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We'll probably see something of merit actually happen in the 'Gene' timline, otherwise I don't think they'd take the time to show it to us. It may not be something huge, since it's not the focus of the show, but something.
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Yeah, really enjoyed this week's episode. Funny seeing how the pre-credits scene tied back into what happened later in the episode.
Vince Gilligan is the master of foreshadowing, especially in those cold openings. Geez, I cannot even count how many BB episodes had a cold opening that foreshadowed something later that episode, that season, or even later in the series.
As for this week's episode, I thought it was fantastic. I think Jimmy is finally ready to cut the emotional ties to Chuck loose and burn him down. Chuck does want to go to court, hence him suggesting the deal to the PA, which Jimmy knows. Jimmy will take it to court and will know exactly what to do to make Chuck look like a crazy person in front of a judge and jury.
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What an amazing few weeks it's been to be watching all this awesome TV. This episode of BCS could easily have been a Breaking Bad episode, the writers on this show are fantastic and know how to keep the tension going. They're tying the two shows so effortlessly without missing a beat on the main character.
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
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^
The very first scene of last night's episode...man in the pool.....yet another 'Easter Egg' for us BB fans. Along with the tequila (?) bottle on the table. As well as the ending of the first scene, with Hector standing alone, and.....wind chimes 'dinging' in the background (mentioned on the avclub websites comments, so we watched that scene over again).
Interesting to read all comments, those tired of this, tired of that. I tell ya, two weeks ago was boring, and then Jimmy flies off the handle and heads over to Chuck's to confront him. Last week's buildups and glorious visual ending, this week's EVERYTHING.
Ab so lute lee superb!!!
Only six more episodes left this season (frick)
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
No, no, it's not just "a really good show"; it's the best show ever. :coolio
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BCS continues to deliver. Three amazing episodes thus far, with a fourth waiting for me tonight.
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Best episode of the season so far. Great stuff.
Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Yeah I'm really getting that feeling now too.
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
Bold move watching BCS not having seen BB. While I guess you strictly don't need to watch BB to enjoy BCS, you'll really appreciate all the nuances of the characters you keep seeing in BCS. They're starting to really merge the two worlds now with lots more events, places and characters from BB being included in BCS. I'm sure you'll enjoy BB just as much if not more.
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
Just for balance, I found BB good but not that great. BCS is vastly superior in my opinion.
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I think both are about as good in general, but Breaking Bad reached such incredible highs in certain places that I'm not sure BCS could reach.
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Well, we likely haven't seen those heights within BCS yet. Everything up to Episode 3 is certainly leading up to some.
I haven't seen Episode 4 yet, and I will do so tonight :) looking forward to that.
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
Bold move watching BCS not having seen BB. While I guess you strictly don't need to watch BB to enjoy BCS, you'll really appreciate all the nuances of the characters you keep seeing in BCS. They're starting to really merge the two worlds now with lots more events, places and characters from BB being included in BCS. I'm sure you'll enjoy BB just as much if not more.
I gotta say, there are certain things in life some of us will never experience, and getting to watch BCS first and then BB is one of those things for me and a lot of others. I think it'll end up being really cool to do things that way, and give him a whole different perspective on a lot of things.
And as with BB Mike continues to be my favorite character.
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Yeah, Mike is awesome.
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Fantastic episode. It feels now that it's gone from a show about Jimmy McGill to a full blown BB prequel. :tup :tup
Guess I really need to watch BB. I love BCS a ton and apparently judging from the insistence from you, my brother and everyone else who's watched BB....BB is a really good show :lol
Bold move watching BCS not having seen BB. While I guess you strictly don't need to watch BB to enjoy BCS, you'll really appreciate all the nuances of the characters you keep seeing in BCS. They're starting to really merge the two worlds now with lots more events, places and characters from BB being included in BCS. I'm sure you'll enjoy BB just as much if not more.
I gotta say, there are certain things in life some of us will never experience, and getting to watch BCS first and then BB is one of those things for me and a lot of others. I think it'll end up being really cool to do things that way, and give him a whole different perspective on a lot of things.
And as with BB Mike continues to be my favorite character.
I'm 'scared' to start BB only because I know that once I do I won't stop until I'm done....not sure if I'm ready for that type of sacrifice yet :lol That's a lot of lost sleep being that the only time I could possibly watch due to 'real life' responsibilities would be starting after 9:00-9:30.....and we all know that you don't just watch one or two episodes when you have them ALL right there!
I'm looking forward to watching as this last episode more than any before I could really sense there was a lot of BB 'easter eggs' going on. But I will say this...having not watched BB has not tainted how great this show is. I think they've done a great job of appeasing the BB fans with the subtle connections yet making this show an awesome stand alone show on its own.
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I just watched the latest episode and here's a couple of thoughts (SPOILERS):
- The episode started off surprisingly well in not even showing Jimmy for the first 25 minutes :lol
- Great opening scene!
- First thought after the last scene: Kim taped Chuck confessing that he made a duplicate, using his own trick on him.
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I don't think that last scenario would help Jimmy in preventing him from being disbarred. If anything, it might get Chuck disbarred, too, since the Bar is not big on lawyers being involved in such shenanigans, but Jimmy's end goal is not to take Chuck down with him; it's to do whatever he can to keep his license to practice law.
Given Gilligan's history with BB, I am sure whatever happens will be something none of us see coming, will be awesome, and will make us all think, "Wow, that seemed so obvious and natural."
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'Bingo' was key.
fwiw....my wife and I did not see an episode of BBad until three years ago. We finished after the first season of Saul. We then started on BCS, and have been weekly viewers since the beginning of Season 2. One appreciates the nuances and writing and cinematography more when a week elapses instead of binge watching.
Had someone only watched BCS, one can certainly appreciate and enjoy this series......because it stands on its own. They would certainly miss out on the 'greedy' little fun the rest have when those Easter Eggs appear.
Wish there were 15 episodes per season...............
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One Huell of a great episode!!!!
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Yep, stellar episode.
The irony for Chuck is that he was outsmarting Jimmy at every turn when on the witness stand...until Jimmy played his wild card. Then he melted down.
Jimmy won't get out of this without a scrape, however. The bar will smack his hands hard for the chicanery he pulled.
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Yep, stellar episode.
The irony for Chuck is that he was outsmarting Jimmy at every turn when on the witness stand...until Jimmy played his wild card. Then he melted down.
Jimmy won't get out of this without a scrape, however. The bar will smack his hands hard for the chicanery he pulled.
Ehh. I don't think Chuck as outsmarting him at all. I think Jimmy knew every response Chuck would give and led him right down the path to his self destruction
Great Episode.
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The Saul Goodman team is almost there! What an episode.
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This episode was freakin' fantastic. Probably the best of the show so far!
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Damn, just watched that. It was insane!
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IIRC, we didn't see Huell till Season 4 of BB, so where was he before then? :P
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Damn, just watched that. It was insane!
I posted this yesterday, because these were basically my first thoughts after watching that episode, but since then, I have been replaying the events in this episode in my head. I'm completely overwhelmed really, this was some absolutely outstanding television and without a doubt the best episode in the entire series so far.
What made this episode so great for me, was that it plays out in just three scenes (of which two very short ones) and the entire courtroom scenes was so meticolously detailed. There was so much stuff going on there and I believe the location for that scene was of vital importance. We already knew that the brothers' relationship was beyond saving, but to have the final nail in the coffin occur in that space in front of the people Chuck values most? Fantastic. He outsmarted Jimmy with every move, but Jimmy broke him down. Many, many kudos for the acting qualities of both Jimmy (you could see he did not like what he was doing to his brother, knowing he would break him eventually) and if Chuck's acting in the entire episode wasn't some of the best in the series, I don't know what was.
Wow.
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And I just watched those final 10 minutes again. Some more things I thought of:
- Howard Hamlin was afraid of the bad PR this could give his firm; leaving legal documents at Chuck's house. The outcome of the episode is definitely going to leave a bad reputation mark on his firm. Howard will be pissed.
- Jimmy's response to Chuck's fallout is stunning. You can see him on the verge of breaking down himself, for having to expose his brother like this before his peers.
- We know where Jimmy is going to end up, but how much further does Kim want to go with his 'chicanery'? There has to come a point in there series where she breaks ties with him. The question is when, or at what point she decides it is not in her own best interest to follow through on Jimmy's stuff. Up until now she's basically sacrificed herself for Jimmy, but in the process she lost a good job and this court case probably isn't going to help her reputation.
- The final shot of the episode, looking at Chuck in that witness booth, alone, gazing up at the exit sign; brilliant!
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This show has caught up, finally. I thought it began kinda slow, but now it's on a rampage. The BB comparisons are so on spot, and I couldn't agree more with what you folks are saying! I love how they're handling Gustavo Fring and his relationship with Hector, which feels more like an intense rivalry more than ever. In Breaking Bad we obviously saw and experienced the meltdown between those two, but from the very beginning of that series Gus had the upper hand in almost everything; but here it feels more like two kingpins struggling for the ultimate power.
Also, old meme but new for me. It made me happy.
(https://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Look+at+me+hector_4757cb_3988431.jpg)
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^ that is so wrong :lol
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Just watched the most recent episode last night, so good. I think Chuck obviously outsmarted him in making the tape and baiting him to break into the house for it, but I think Jimmy was in control the whole way for the hearing (minus having to stall because Rebecca was late). The episode was well shot and paced, and just fantastic acting all around.
Not gonna lie, I got super excited when the vet asked Jimmy if the guy he was looking for had to fit into small spaces because I knew who that meant would be showing up :lol Huell ftw.
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Was the pick pocket guy in this last episode Sauls security in his law office in breaking bad?
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that was indeed Huell
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Was the pick pocket guy in this last episode Sauls security in his law office in breaking bad?
Yes. His level of expertise is clearly frisking/planting something on someone, as we saw twice on BB (I won't say where for those who are still going to watch it).
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Almost wish last week would be 'the end'.....just because it was so immensely gratifying. As we've learned, there are no happy endings in this BB/Saul universe.
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Man what an amazing episode, this merging of worlds with Breaking Bad is getting better and better with each episode and I'm almost afraid of the inevitable consequences.
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Lydia, Tyrus, the laundry! The BB nods just keep coming!!
That said, I thought the episode was just okay overall. Quite a letdown after last week's awesomeness.
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
:tup :tup
Expect many late nights now, as you won't be able to stop watching. :coolio
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
My wife once watched 14 episodes in one day of breaking bad when she started the binge. You're in for an amazing ride and in my humble opinion, I personally feel every season gets better than the previous. That's why I rank the final season as my absolute favorite with the last three episodes possibly one of the best in TV history.
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
:tup :tup
Expect many late nights now, as you won't be able to stop watching. :coolio
Late night #1......it's 1:00am......got through the first three episodes and had to force myself to stop.
I can already see why Brian Cranston won so many Awards just three episodes in. Can't wait to watch that character grow.
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
:tup :tup
Expect many late nights now, as you won't be able to stop watching. :coolio
Late night #1......it's 1:00am......got through the first three episodes and had to force myself to stop.
I can already see why Brian Cranston won so many Awards just three episodes in. Can't wait to watch that character grow.
You ain't see nothin' yet. :hat
Although the first three episodes sucked me in immediately. The way the Crazy-8 storyline played out over those episodes was magnificent.
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Back to BCS......there was no way that the recent episode could match the buildup and intensity for 'Conspiracy'. But I think we all needed some fun and change of pace.
That said, it involved so many scenes, many characters, tons of building blocks and 'fan service' moments (Crazy 8, Lydia, the playground, the laundromat...). We learn more about yet another character (Nacho), something Gilligan is so good at. There was comic relief with Odenkirk shining while calling clients. I especially love how Chuck and Howard get two sheets to the wind, and then the wonderfully filmed segment of Chuck in his Jiffy Pop hoodie on the streets of ABQ. I always enjoy the appearances of the 'Abbey Road Gang'.
Oh, and the character people have been waiting for finally appears, but with a twist.
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Those who have only see BCS, but not BB, haven't really seen the "circus clown" act of Jimmy/Saul yet, but the commercial, for them, was the first glimpse into that.
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Welp....I've taken the plunge. As i type Walter has just collapsed at the car wash, got a scan and just been told he has lung cancer.
There's a bit in an episode of Freaks and Geeks where a Deadhead is talking to one of the main characters and says that she wishes she had never heard American Beauty so she could hear it again for the first time. Breaking Bad is a show I feel that way about, enjoy the ride :tup
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Those who have only see BCS, but not BB, haven't really seen the "circus clown" act of Jimmy/Saul yet, but the commercial, for them, was the first glimpse into that.
I was talking to my brother (who has seen BB) and the 'birth' of Saul Goodman seemed a bit anti climactic. Very subdued and nonchalant which seems very appropriate. It's great that it wasn't some huge deal but just an off the cuff shoot from the hip moment from Jimmy
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'It's just a name.'
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I really enjoyed the introduction of Saul being such a "subtle" moment.
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Honestly, that last episode didn't do a whole lot for me. It left the viewer hanging on quite a lot of things, namely:
- the cold-open was pretty disgusting, with Hector forcing Nacho to beat up Krazy-8 and then Nacho hrting himself with the sowing machine. I was having dinner while watching that; not a great combination.
- alright, we got to see the laundry (what was Lydia doing there?), but the rest of that scene was rather pointless
- Chuck and Howard want to 'move on', but Chuck walking around the city with his tinfoil suit doesn't exactly make him look smart. He's clearly distraught about the outcome of the court case and is probably questioning his own sanity. The end of the scene - him calling his former doctor - is again an unresolved plotline
- the fuck is Nacho going to do with that pill? Obviously he's not going to drag his father into Hector's drug business, but Nacho was not featured in Breaking Bad. Something is bound to go wrong between him and 'Don' Hector. I found Hector's personality not very convincing here - why would he want to have innocent civilians (ie Nacho's father) operating for him?
- the first airing of 'Saul Goodman' was pretty funny, but I wonder how Jimmy is going to spend his time for the next 12 months.
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I think most episodes leave the viewer hanging on some things. That's why there are new episodes and new seasons and that's why the story moves forward and things are explained. If everything was so obvious and all the answers were there, there wouldn't be any reason to make a new episode or to keep watching the show.
The point of the first scene was actually to show how stressful Nacho's job is becoming and what sort of things he has to do. It shows the pressure is growing and the scene with the sewing machine shows just that. The stress, the pressure. I don't think it was disgusting. They didn't even show him beating the guy. Tuco's scene beating Mike was much more violent and they showed everything. The directors and creators of the show are innocent that you were having dinner while you were watching or that you were digusted, because it is completely subjective. That scene was surely not done with the purpose of causing disgust to the viewer.
but the rest of that scene was rather pointless
The fact that you (or anyone) don't understand the point of a scene, doesn't make it pointless. There are so many (apparently) pointless scene in Game of Thrones, for example, that the viewer will only understand the purpose of them seasons later.
Like I said, if the series was over right now, then yea, that scene with Lydia and other scenes would have been pointless, but I think you want answers too fast. If you don't understand something or if you are asking questions, isn't it a good sign? Isn't it better than the show and the story being too obvious?
why would he want to have innocent civilians (ie Nacho's father) operating for him?
I think it is pretty clear why, if you have been watching the show. Mike sabotaged his trucks, he lost people, Gus is doing better than him, he is in a desperate situation. Do you really think people in that kind of business give a shit about their employers' father, specially when they are in such a situation and when a lot of money is involved? He just wants a new way to get his drugs into the country and that's it.
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5/22 episode....for the first time I'm ticked with the show. The 'characters' are that.....'characters'. Bringing in the Sklar brothers ruined that for us. Other than that....another very good episode.
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I don't even know who the Sklar brothers are, but that was a really good episode.
Fantastic put-on by Jimmy at the end there to try and take down Chuck.
Great to see the return of that dope who loves his baseball cards. :lol :lol
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I love that Jimmy has no remorse towards Chuck while Kim is feeling the opposite and has the guilt of trying to put on a show to convince Chuck is evil. All in all I'm also thinking the journey to a full fledged Saul Goodman is going to be less dramatic than I thought and will be over money or some other trivial reason rather than something abrupt. Just 3 more episodes left and the other storyline with Gus/Salamanca/Nacho/Mike is getting super interesting.
And that Richie Blackmore part was hilarious.
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Jimmy's film crew is hysterical. That little scramble they did to get in the car after putting the wheelchair in the trunk had my stomach hurting with laughter. It was like a 3 second shot of them all trying not to trip over one another. :rollin :rollin :rollin
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Also the scene with Nacho waiting in the darkness after pharma boy takes forever to enter was so hilariously setup. The show is great with those kind of gags.
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And that Richie Blackmore part was hilarious.
"I weep for the future generations." :D
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Fantastic put-on by Jimmy at the end there to try and take down Chuck.
Indeed! At first I had no idea what was happening, but then it dawned on me.
Overall, this was another weird episode with lots of stuff happening simultaneously (and Gus, nor Chuck receiving any air-time).
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I think that was a legitimate breakdown by Jimmy, who was wore down over the course of the episode by how much of a struggle every thing has become, but he managed to still manipulate the situation by slipping in the stuff about Chuck to make the insurance company raise their eyebrows. Brilliant.
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I think that was a legitimate breakdown by Jimmy, who was wore down over the course of the episode by how much of a struggle every thing has become, but he managed to still manipulate the situation by slipping in the stuff about Chuck to make the insurance company raise their eyebrows. Brilliant.
Yep. This. I think he lost it for a moment but then steered it to his benefit.
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I actually thought the same thing, because the first moments in the sobbing scene looked so sincere - and then came slippin' Jimmy, when he realised that insurance employee was too hellbent on rules. He could actually use her persistence to deal more damage to his brother.
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I thought the entire thing was a setup. Giving his name at the beginning simply as McGill so that he could correct the woman when she asked "Charles?" seemed intentional, so that she would already know his brother was a lawyer with their company when he later started to mention his problems. Much more discreet than later saying "My brother has mental issues, oh by the way he's also a lawyer insured by you".
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I just found out there was no new episode this week. Why could that be?
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It was memorial day weekend which is probably why there was no episode. I was bummed as well.
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Glad we had a break, since there's only two left this year.
I stay up and watch the repeat every week. Yet another top notch episode.
btw, if I'm a basketball coach, and the game's on the line in the final seconds, I want Nacho shooting the free throws. Mr. Clutch.
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Haha yeah Nacho was clutch at crunch time. Another great episode again, Jimmy morphing towards Saul, Mike and Gus aligning with each other. Chuck is beginning to turn a new leaf I suppose. Just two more episodes left and I'm sure they'll be great.
Jimmy playing Smoke on the water while on his back was gold.
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Feeling really bad for Kim right now. I was confused about the significance of the scene of her getting stuck then almost hitting the oil rig, but now realize it was foreshadowing of her getting in an accident.
Loved Jimmy's 'game' to get pressure on the old lady to settle....and am curious about Chuck v Hamlin.
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Jimmy was really slimy towards Irene and man is he becoming for of his old con man self and easily delving into Saul Goodman territory. The last scene with Kim was brilliantly edited, I knew something was definitely going to happen but it being so sudden was such an accurate description of micro sleeps. What an awesome episode and just one more to go for the season. The show hasn't been renewed yet and I'm hoping this wont be the last. I can't imagine them not getting renewals but it not having happened already is a little concerning.
I don't think this will be the last season, if anything it may come back with an even shorter run of episodes to tie up the series.
It would be a crying shame if it were to end, the 3 seasons so far have been some absolutely amazing TV.
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I can't imagine they wouldn't at least give them a chance to tie the series up....at minimum (6) episodes but certainly for what that team has done for AMC with BB they 'deserve' to get the chance to tell the full story.
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If their goal was to make us not like Jimmy anymore, they succeeded admirably. What he did to Irene was absolutely despicable, possibly worse than anything Walt ever did on BB.
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I agree that the way to portray Kim's accident was a great choice. Probably the best way to make us feel as much as her as possible.
I'm pretty nervous about next week's episode. It feels like a whole bunch of things are right on the verge of going really wrong for people.
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I read that next week's episode (the season finale) is the first time that an episode was not given to critics ahead of time for them to review, so it makes me think a lot of shit is going to hit the fan.
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If their goal was to make us not like Jimmy anymore, they succeeded admirably. What he did to Irene was absolutely despicable, possibly worse than anything Walt ever did on BB.
Despicable yeah, but not worse than the orchestrated murder of 10 inmates or whatever it was. Looking forward to the season finale!
-J
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If their goal was to make us not like Jimmy anymore, they succeeded admirably. What he did to Irene was absolutely despicable, possibly worse than anything Walt ever did on BB.
Really? What he did was despicable, sure, but it didn't affect me nearly as much as some of the stuff that happened on BB.
I'm pretty nervous about next week's episode. It feels like a whole bunch of things are right on the verge of going really wrong for people.
Yup, a lot of stuff to happen (and to go wrong as well). Especially Howard seems to get a lot of shit over him lately, while I've never viewed him as a 'bad' person. If anything, he's probably the most honest and integer character on the show.
There's a couple of things that need to be exlained or happen still:
- what the hell was that body Mike found in Episode 8 (and what was he looking for)? (nvm, just realised that he was probably looking for the innocent guy that got killed)
- Hector has to end up in a wheelchair
- Nacho is probably going to end up dead (as he had no role in BB)
And with all the other stuff leading up to Jimmy becoming Saul, there's no way that can all be fit into one episode. There has to be another season. (Please?)
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^
I was going to say the exact same thing, but was at a hotel computer that did not allow me to log in.
Walt's killings of the most loyal group that Mike had surrounded himself with was .....well, the worst. THAT was the moment I totally lost any 'cheering' for Mr. White.
As to Jimmy....was it weak writing or something else regarding Irene? Surely, he could have had Ernesto or the nerdy prosecutor friend go to her, with a fellow elderly person to convince her to ask for something NOW?
The scene with Kim: there are so many lawyer ads that have that same view from the passenger seat, that I was semi screaming 'NO! NO! NO!' she can't frickin die. And then the aftermath. That was well done x10.
Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy....why can't you help Kim staple for eff sake? Howard: said all we have wanted to say for all three seasons, but you let Erin hog all the settlement stuff, hoping the benefactors would croak before receiving their well deserved benefits.
'Lantern' is next. And is it for another season.
Loved all of the background music. Listened to 'Baby Blue' as I wrote this.
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The body that Mike found in the desert was [spoiler alert]
the Good Samaritan that found the driver that Mike had hogtied and duct taped when he cut the tires and found the money inside the one wheel well (he was going to shoot Hector later on when they shot and buried the truck driver)
This was the first episode I did not get to see for a repeat after its original airing.
As to the episode, as Franshesca would chokingly say ....(gasp) "Smooth."
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If their goal was to make us not like Jimmy anymore, they succeeded admirably. What he did to Irene was absolutely despicable, possibly worse than anything Walt ever did on BB.
Despicable yeah, but not worse than the orchestrated murder of 10 inmates or whatever it was.
I am looking at it in relative terms. Killing people is worse than conning an elderly woman and making her lose her friends, yes, but Mike's guys in prison that Walt had taken out were all bad guys/criminals. Not that that makes it okay, but I am just saying, what Jimmy did to was at the expense of an elderly woman who appears to be a very nice lady, and might have to spend the rest of her days alone because Jimmy turned all of her friends against her. There is no way to sugarcoat how awful that is.
Walt's killings of the most loyal group that Mike had surrounded himself with was .....well, the worst. THAT was the moment I totally lost any 'cheering' for Mr. White.
You are kidding with the loyal group comment, right?
First off, Chris was taking Lydia's money to kill everyone else on the list PLUS Mike. Yep, real loyal.
Second, Dan the lawyer was flipping on all of them in the Say My Name episode. Again, real loyal.
Lastly, Dennis (from the laundry) was ready to flip on all of them as well, before Hank blew him off to go "rattle some cages." Again, real loyal.
So yeah, let's not romanticize a bunch of criminals and act like there was all of this honor among thieves. The second anything went bad for any of them, they were ready to turn on everyone else.
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deleted because I was an a-hole
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From a viewer's perspective, neither of those two incidents really did a lot to me. The murdering of those people in jail had no impact on me whatsoever, because they were minor characters anyway. What Saul did to Irene felt worse though, because she really is an innocent woman. You could by the way 'Jimmy' handled it that he did not like his own actions.
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^
Yes, it felt worse, because, after all, we like Jimmy.
Or, I should say, we used to like Jimmy up until this episode.
This whole thing somewhat speaks for society, does it not? A thousand people die in a distant corner of the land in a foreign country, and we are 'damn, that's a pity.' A dog that was a great companion to a neighbor or nearby friend that is horribly beaten and/or killed, and we are up in arms.
such is life
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Having a bunch of people murdered is definetely so very much worse, but I also agree that the Irene thing felt worse. Probably because I think few people can actually grasp the concept of a murder fully. Of course we know it's bad, but it's so foreign and almost mythical to most of us that it's difficult to comprehend. The fear of losing your friends and the affirmation you get through them though, I imagine that hits real close to home for almost everyone. That's probably why it feels worse.
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You are always so quick to cut down others opinions to shreds, whether it is music or TV shows, aren't you?
:facepalm:
I was not cutting your opinion down; I was disagreeing with it, and explained why. Sorry for going into detail on a discussion forum and trying to inspire more discussion. ;)
From a viewer's perspective, neither of those two incidents really did a lot to me. The murdering of those people in jail had no impact on me whatsoever, because they were minor characters anyway. What Saul did to Irene felt worse though, because she really is an innocent woman. You could by the way 'Jimmy' handled it that he did not like his own actions.
Well said.
Having a bunch of people murdered is definetely so very much worse, but I also agree that the Irene thing felt worse. Probably because I think few people can actually grasp the concept of a murder fully. Of course we know it's bad, but it's so foreign and almost mythical to most of us that it's difficult to comprehend. The fear of losing your friends and the affirmation you get through them though, I imagine that hits real close to home for almost everyone. That's probably why it feels worse.
Great post. :tup :tup
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You could by the way 'Jimmy' handled it that he did not like his own actions.
Indeed, and that's also what makes it so interesting and emotionally difficult. Jimmy wants to do right, but has reached the point where he's no longer willing to be pushed around. And so though he hates doing it, he's willing to hurt others to protect himself. The way the show has been exploring his journey is brilliant.
Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
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Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
Totally agree with this. I really loved how great a job Cranston did portraying Walt....but as a character I never felt any sort of 'sympathy' towards him or the trials he faced because.....as the first line of the song in the last scene very accurately states......he indeed got what he deserved. Not only in the end but in every instance of that show.
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Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
Totally agree with this. I really loved how great a job Cranston did portraying Walt....but as a character I never felt any sort of 'sympathy' towards him or the trials he faced because.....as the first line of the song in the last scene very accurately states......he indeed got what he deserved. Not only in the end but in every instance of that show.
Hang on, didn't you only start watching it like a week ago? :lol
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Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
Totally agree with this. I really loved how great a job Cranston did portraying Walt....but as a character I never felt any sort of 'sympathy' towards him or the trials he faced because.....as the first line of the song in the last scene very accurately states......he indeed got what he deserved. Not only in the end but in every instance of that show.
Hang on, didn't you only start watching it like a week ago? :lol
Watched all (62) episodes in 13 days :omg: It took some effort and a TON of lost sleep.
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Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
Totally agree with this. I really loved how great a job Cranston did portraying Walt....but as a character I never felt any sort of 'sympathy' towards him or the trials he faced because.....as the first line of the song in the last scene very accurately states......he indeed got what he deserved. Not only in the end but in every instance of that show.
Hang on, didn't you only start watching it like a week ago? :lol
Watched all (62) episodes in 13 days :omg: It took some effort and a TON of lost sleep.
I thought about your post while watching the Hotels.com commercial about binge watching tv shows
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Whereas Walt was kind of a dick from season 1, so while some things were shocking (like trying to have the little kid killed) it didn't have much emotional impact as I never liked him in the first place.
Totally agree with this. I really loved how great a job Cranston did portraying Walt....but as a character I never felt any sort of 'sympathy' towards him or the trials he faced because.....as the first line of the song in the last scene very accurately states......he indeed got what he deserved. Not only in the end but in every instance of that show.
Hang on, didn't you only start watching it like a week ago? :lol
Watched all (62) episodes in 13 days :omg: It took some effort and a TON of lost sleep.
I thought about your post while watching the Hotels.com commercial about binge watching tv shows
The 'negative' about binge watching a series as good as BB is that although I enjoyed it immensely I feel like there are moments/areas that I just didn't appreciate fully...parts of the story that were just incredible tend to blend all together when it's watched like that. I think had I a bit more time between episodes it'd have been even greater a show. But all in all I loved it...such a well written/acted show.
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With Walt, I feel that Gilligan held back a little when it came to how far he had his character go, when you think of what his original intentions were (Mr Chips into Scarface). I think he realized at some point that Walt was still pretty likable to a lot of fans and never really had him go over the edge to where he was completely unlikable. For example, had he, I don't think we would have seen Walt go out of his way to try and save Hank's life like he did and then show genuine remorse over his death. For all he did wrong, Walt did plenty right as well, and we often saw the very human side of Walter White. Plus, his motivation was made clear from the start: a guy who felt he had wasted his life, gets diagnosed with cancer, and then acts out. Walt's biggest deadly seven was always pride.
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Wow. What an ending :omg:
Really hope season three is picked up.
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Excellent finale and even if the show doesn't comeback I think it would make for a decent stopping point. Have to give props again to the editors of this show, they way they unfold events and peel off the layers on each episode is fantastic.
I will be super sad if the show doesn't come back for a 4th season but keeping my fingers crossed.
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Got my hopes up big time. Trying to avoid spoiler, for I won't be able to watch it until the end of the week.
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I think as far as finales go, it's a typical BCS finale where it's less about being a dramatic finale and more tying up storylines of the season. Though I think I'd have to say this season finale is probably the most dramatic among the three.
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It's gonna be some beautiful irony when Jimmy gets most or all of that 3 million dollars that Howard gave Chuck (if Chuck dies, and assuming he cashed the check).
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Excellent finale and even if the show doesn't comeback I think it would make for a decent stopping point. Have to give props again to the editors of this show, they way they unfold events and peel off the layers on each episode is fantastic.
Yeah. I mean, they set up the 'reason' why Jimmy goes 'all in' on Saul Goodman with the brutal conversation that he and Chuck had. We saw Hector have his stroke....Mike is 'in' with Gus now....the only thing really left would be to show what happened between Jimmy and Kim.
It's gonna be some beautiful irony when Jimmy gets most or all of that 3 million dollars that Howard gave Chuck (if Chuck dies, and assuming he cashed the check).
It's certainly set up that way...
BTW...did anyone else feel extremely bad for Chuck as they showed him just fall off the deep end? I know the dude was a grade A D-Bag and all, especially after what he said to Jimmy but that was brutal to watch him go insane basically. It was like all that craziness he'd been holding back to try and prove he was fine just unleashed and he finally went off the deep end.
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BTW...did anyone else feel extremely bad for Chuck as they showed him just fall off the deep end? I know the dude was a grade A D-Bag and all, especially after what he said to Jimmy but that was brutal to watch him go insane basically. It was like all that craziness he'd been holding back to try and prove he was fine just unleashed and he finally went off the deep end.
Although there are times where it was tough, I've always felt a little bad for Chuck. Let's face it, the guy is mentally ill.
That doesn't mean I didn't enjoy seeing Howard stick it to him last night.
And Jimmy redeemed himself well with the Irene situation, making them all hate him just so she gets her friends back.
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Forgot to mention also the actor they cast to play a young Chuck that read that story to a young Jimmy freaking NAILED Michael McKeans speech pattern as the 'old' Chuck. It was uncanny.
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I think the creative team that Vince surrounds himself is truly gifted and always bring out some amazing performances and excellent character arcs. I appreciate and notice it a lot more on repeated viewings. Every episode is a joy to rewatch, be it BCS or BB.
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That was some stellar writing there in that final episode, with an absolute highlight in Michael McKean's performance. The way he portrays Chuck I always found great, but there were moments in this last season where he really excelled, this episode being one of them.
BTW...did anyone else feel extremely bad for Chuck as they showed him just fall off the deep end?
Yes, I did indeed, though I saw it coming the moment he began tearing down the house.
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I'm bummed we didn't get to see wheelchair Hector yet, but Nacho is going to be in some big trouble. There's no way the hospital won't find out that Hector's been poisoned.
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Jimmy's act of redemption literally made my eyes water (though I'm ridiculously tired as well) - great stuff from him to act up on his own mistakes.
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At the end of the episode I realised the beginning might have been in some way significant to the rest of the episode. It felt so disjointed, but there's a lantern in that tent. I'll have to rewatch to see if the dialogue in that scene is of any special meaning.
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Season 4 please! Renew that stuff, you can't end it here :(
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I'm bummed we didn't get to see wheelchair Hector yet, but Nacho is going to be in some big trouble. There's no way the hospital won't find out that Hector's been poisoned.
I thought that the Nacho switched out the actual medicine for placebos, so that he just wouldn't have his medicine when the next attack came along. And then Nacho got the opportunity to switch the pills back in the aftermath of the episode and Hector dropping the bottle in the dirt. I think Nacho should be free and clear.
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People are talking as though season 4 might be canned. Is that really even remotely likely?
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People are talking as though season 4 might be canned. Is that really even remotely likely?
Nope, read an interview with Gilligan and Peter Gould yesterday where they basically say that the delay is just due to some recent turnover at Sony, but they fully anticipate getting another season.
edit: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/fien-print/better-call-saul-season-3-finale-explained-1015384
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Glad to read that Vince Gilligan is confident of a renewal (https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/fien-print/better-call-saul-season-3-finale-explained-1015384)
We know you're not ending the series here. We know the show does well for AMC. What is the holdup on the official renewal for a fourth season?
Gilligan: Honestly, it's obviously not a secret that Zack Van Amburg and Jamie Erlicht left Sony TV and there's just a little bit of reorganizing going at Sony, but the ship, there's still folks at the tiller and and it's just a matter of … Who the f— knows? (Laughs.) It's gonna be fine. The timing was a bit unfortunate in that there's a little bit of stuff up in the air over at Sony, but it'll all get worked out. A couple of good guys left Sony, but there's a lot of good people still at Sony and it'll all get worked out. We're going forward with the certainty that there is gonna be more and it's just a matter of logistics as to when, exactly, it gets going. We're not worried. I say that having absolutely been worried in the past. I'm [not] worried at all right now. We're gonna forward. There will be a season four. The only question is when will it go on air.
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I'm bummed we didn't get to see wheelchair Hector yet, but Nacho is going to be in some big trouble. There's no way the hospital won't find out that Hector's been poisoned.
I thought that the Nacho switched out the actual medicine for placebos, so that he just wouldn't have his medicine when the next attack came along. And then Nacho got the opportunity to switch the pills back in the aftermath of the episode and Hector dropping the bottle in the dirt. I think Nacho should be free and clear.
Of course, but those doctors will find out that Hector has been poisoned regardless. Somebody is going to point fingers in some direction, though it could go either way.
Never mind, it just occurred to me that he didn't need to have been poisoned. Merely remove the working component of his heart medicine would of course be enough.
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I'm bummed we didn't get to see wheelchair Hector yet, but Nacho is going to be in some big trouble. There's no way the hospital won't find out that Hector's been poisoned.
I thought that the Nacho switched out the actual medicine for placebos, so that he just wouldn't have his medicine when the next attack came along. And then Nacho got the opportunity to switch the pills back in the aftermath of the episode and Hector dropping the bottle in the dirt. I think Nacho should be free and clear.
Yeah. They were placebos and he made the switch. But, it looked like Gus was on to him....at least thrnlook Gus gave him gave me that impression.
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Glad to read that Vince Gilligan is confident of a renewal (https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/fien-print/better-call-saul-season-3-finale-explained-1015384)
We know you're not ending the series here. We know the show does well for AMC. What is the holdup on the official renewal for a fourth season?
Gilligan: Honestly, it's obviously not a secret that Zack Van Amburg and Jamie Erlicht left Sony TV and there's just a little bit of reorganizing going at Sony, but the ship, there's still folks at the tiller and and it's just a matter of … Who the f— knows? (Laughs.) It's gonna be fine. The timing was a bit unfortunate in that there's a little bit of stuff up in the air over at Sony, but it'll all get worked out. A couple of good guys left Sony, but there's a lot of good people still at Sony and it'll all get worked out. We're going forward with the certainty that there is gonna be more and it's just a matter of logistics as to when, exactly, it gets going. We're not worried. I say that having absolutely been worried in the past. I'm [not] worried at all right now. We're gonna forward. There will be a season four. The only question is when will it go on air.
They had best start shooting right away, before Jonathan Banks looks even older. :lol :lol
If Season 4 does end up being the last scene, I hope the storyline has a little more urgency. I was bored to tears at times these last few episodes.
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Wow, I think the slow pace is actually one of BCS's biggest charms.
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Yup I understand that not everyone likes the slow pace, I personally am fine with it.
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The slow pace is alright but sometimes it really gets waaaaaay too slow. The episode after Chicanery was an example imo, was bored to tears during that one.
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I don't think the pace is slow at all. Watch the show for what it is, don't think about the pace.
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I've never found BCS slow at all, the character stories are all so engaging.
I found BB a bit slow sometimes, but not too often. As I've said before the reason I much prefer BCS is how interested and invested I am in the characters, rather than the pace of the respective shows.
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Yeah...the pacing for BCS has never bothered me. The story and character development have been spot on IMO
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Finally found time to watch the finale, and I loved it. I felt bad for Chuck too as he started tearing down the house. Heavy stuff.
Forgot to mention also the actor they cast to play a young Chuck that read that story to a young Jimmy freaking NAILED Michael McKeans speech pattern as the 'old' Chuck. It was uncanny.
Agreed. You could immediately tell who it was supposed to be.
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Not sure the credibility of the source or if it's just speculation, according to this (https://www.spoilertv.com/2017/06/better-call-saul-renewed-for-4th-season.html), shooting,etc.. is scheduled to start in November this year.
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That would make sense, they could continue the show in Spring 2018 then.
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A terrific season finale.
We watched the very first BCS episode again Thurs night. Amazing to go back and see how it all ties in with Chuck and Jimmy and this episode.
[spoiler I guess]
Terrific performance by Michael McKean. Just when you think he can't top the courtroom scene, he pulls off his manic search. I kept waiting for a different view of the exterior of his home on the final shot. He never did pull a main breaker, or go into the garage. We'll probably find out that a yard post or garage ceiling light were on.....or the spinning meter was all in his mind. I'm also guessing his Jiffy Pop outfit might temporarily save what is left of him, if the smoke didn't kill him first.
Just happened to notice this in today's Baltimore Sun classifieds:
EDUCATION
The Baltimore Curriculum Project seeks Maryland State Certified Elementary Teachers to join an exciting new school venture for the forthcoming school year. Please send resumes and cover letter to jmmcgill@baltimorexxx.org
Jimmy lives!!!!! :D
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It's been officially announced that it's renewed :metal
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:tup
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Sweet. More Gus, Mike, Jimmy, Howard and Chuck!! :tup :tup
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I'm thinking they realistically will do maybe only two more seasons. With things in the storyline getting close to the BB world they should be able to wrap everything up in 2 seasons. I wonder if Vince and company have any idea how long they want this show to play out. I can't see it going past a sixth season for sure.
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I'm thinking they realistically will do maybe only two more seasons. With things in the storyline getting close to the BB world they should be able to wrap everything up in 2 seasons. I wonder if Vince and company have any idea how long they want this show to play out. I can't see it going past a sixth season for sure.
They've said they had a (5) Season story to tell. I can't image they won't get to tell it. BCS is the third highest rated show on AMC behind the two Walking Dead shows.
Sweet. More Gus, Mike, Jimmy, Howard and Chuck!! :tup :tup
Ummm.....no Chuck Kev. He done burnt up.
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We will still see plenty of him in flashbacks. I guarantee it. :)
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Watched the first couple of episodes last night and really enjoyed it. I always love it when people blunder into terrifying misunderstandings, it's a wonderful comedy trope, and inadvertently crossing Tuco's abuela was gold. I always enjoyed the black humor in BB, and while I don't know if it'll hold out for long, this show seems to be more geared towards that angle.
And Nacho seems like he'll be an interesting character.
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Watched the first couple of episodes last night and really enjoyed it. I always love it when people blunder into terrifying misunderstandings, it's a wonderful comedy trope, and inadvertently crossing Tuco's abuela was gold. I always enjoyed the black humor in BB, and while I don't know if it'll hold out for long, this show seems to be more geared towards that angle.
And Nacho seems like he'll be an interesting character.
It only continues to get better. It really starts to find its footing.....especially in season 2. Season 3 was really good as well. I recall reading somewhere that they have a (5) season 'plan' in place that would pretty much take them up to when we meet 'Saul' in BB.
I actually started BCS prior to seeing BB and enjoyed it even without the callbacks and references. It stood on its own pretty good. Only after I binged BB did I realize that I missed some references here and there....but all in all I think it does stand well as its own show.
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No spoilers below.
Jesus fucking christ Season 3 IS SO GOOOOOOOD. I am enjoying some aspects and parts of this show more than Breaking Bad. The writing and insanely tense scenes coupled with the few dark comedic aspects left are truly miraculous. Gilligan and Co. are true masterminds. I didn't think this would be anything more than a coattail ride when it began and I really enjoyed it at first. Then Season 2 upped my hopes that it would not only not fail or ride coattails but might shine. And now I'm honest to goodness weighing my love for BB with this show. Every single moment of Season 3 has been void of filler, filled with moments of intrigue, sweaty palms and wonder at what will happen next coupled with awesome callbacks and little hidden homages for those paying attention (and some they make obvious, but not so much that it's gross).
Truly...this is so fucking awesome; even better is that it came out of nowhere (for me at least). Just another facet of proof to me that hype is a true killer and does nothing but damper the final experience. I not only didn't hype season 3 up but didn't see or watch anything beforehand and I am loving every second of this. Now, that's probably a bit of the aforementioned but the show itself is just top notch writing, directing and has that awesome soundtrack to back it (the Mike Private Eye Jazz Jams (TM) are so great).
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Does anyone know when Season 4 premieres?
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The grapevine has the date anywhere from May-ish to Fall so it's up in the air as far as I can tell.
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These waits between seasons are getting insane. 1.5 years between Westworld and Better Call Saul. :censored
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Hell, if it's going to equate to quality like this, I'll gladly wait years.
I couldn't give less of a shit how quick the turnout is, if the show is shit, it's all for naught.
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I mean, I agree. I just wish they could do it in, you know, a year. I don't have as much of a problem with Game of Thrones considering it's their final season and the episodes will be long as hell, but...
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Well yeah, the best of the best right now is always the best option. :P
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Does anyone know when Season 4 premieres?
I googled it a week ago and found some sites that said it will premiere in September.
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Does anyone know when Season 4 premieres?
I googled it a week ago and found some sites that said it will premiere in September.
Yeah....they're currently in the middle of filming it.
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I'm about 2/3 through with the second season and really digging the shit out of this. I honestly like it better than BB, as it's generally not as dark and intense. While I certainly liked that in BB it could at times be overwhelming. There were a couple of episodes that made me stop and take a break from watching it for a few weeks. I wouldn't call BCS light-hearted, but it does tend to focus more on humor than intensity. Simply a difference between having Walt and Jimmy as protagonists.
In any case, Jimmy is relatable, interesting, and fucking brilliant. I always love watching Mike do his thing. It's got all of the touches we love from VG, from the nuanced to the grandiose. Lisa Wexler kind of does something for me. The secondary characters are all excellent. Particularly Lenny and Ed Begley Jr. It's fun to see them in serious roles. All the way around good stuff. Not sure if I'll start the third season yet or wait until after 4.
Jimmy getting himself fired from the firm was priceless. "I never thought I'd have to make an announcement like this, but. . . "
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Damn you. I thought there was already a release date announced for season 4. :'(
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Damn you. I thought there was already a release date announced for season 4. :'(
LOL. To be honest, I thought there had already been 4 seasons before I started watching. I was disappointed to learn that 4 hasn't happened.
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I'm about 2/3 through with the second season and really digging the shit out of this. I honestly like it better than BB, as it's generally not as dark and intense. While I certainly liked that in BB it could at times be overwhelming. There were a couple of episodes that made me stop and take a break from watching it for a few weeks. I wouldn't call BCS light-hearted, but it does tend to focus more on humor than intensity. Simply a difference between having Walt and Jimmy as protagonists.
In any case, Jimmy is relatable, interesting, and fucking brilliant. I always love watching Mike do his thing. It's got all of the touches we love from VG, from the nuanced to the grandiose. Lisa Wexler kind of does something for me. The secondary characters are all excellent. Particularly Lenny and Ed Begley Jr. It's fun to see them in serious roles. All the way around good stuff. Not sure if I'll start the third season yet or wait until after 4.
Jimmy getting himself fired from the firm was priceless. "I never thought I'd have to make an announcement like this, but. . . "
Agree EB. It’s just as good and if not better than BB. I started with BCS then ended up watching BB......but BCS can stand on its own two feet without BB. The connection makes it ‘cool’ but BCS is very well written and the characters/actors are awesome.
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Well, the world of Breaking Bad was built from scratch so to speak, they had to create it, find out what was good and what was not. By the time they came to BCS they were well into the machine, with all the added experience of making Breaking Bad, so yeah, in a sense, to have Better Call Saul "better" than BB should be the least that can be expected.
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I want to watch the whole series again leading up to season 4. The wait's been very long and I hope there are some real big events in this season especially given how season 3 ended. It's going to be a roller coaster for Jimmy, and SPOILERS I think this is the season we'll finally start to see Saul Goodman. I hope. And I think Kim is going to bite it this season, someway, somehow. Maybe not til season 5 though...
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The end of season 2 was pretty good. The Jimmy cliffhanger didn't do much for me as he should have seen the setup a mile away. It certainly does reinforce what a dick Chuck is, though. I'd really like to know how Gilligan goes about casting. This is a guy that turns Hal and Lenny into genuinely bad people. How does that happen?
The Mike side of the episode was great. Up until now the show stood on its own just fine and the understanding of BB wasn't all that important. The "DON'T" note with the stick in the horn was chilling, though, and all the more brilliant given the understanding that there's only one person that could make that happen. Absolutely fantastic foreshadowing, but only with the story of BB already told. Without that foreknowledge it's just another cliffhanger--oh, I wonder what new character is going to come up.
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Wrapped up S3 so I read through this thread. Fascinating to see much debate over whether or not Chuck was evil. Calvin made some decent arguments on hs behalf, but he really struck me as reprehensible. Waking up in the hospital his first instinct was to use the fact that Jimmy just saved his life to try to nail him. That was pretty much the final nail in Chuck's coffin for me (and it was already pretty tightly sealed). And yet, the amazingness of Vince Gilligan, I took no joy in watching him self-destruct, despite really wanting it to happen.
Chuck was the perfect bad guy. Maybe the best I've ever seen. He had all the hallmarks. He did awful things to his brother, but from his own warped perspective he was doing them for Jimmy's own good. He made you hate him, yet he was so terribly flawed you also had to sympathize. In the end the flaws, both innate and chosen, led to his demise.
And saddest of all is that his final words were telling Jimmy "the truth is you've never mattered all that much to me." I'm not sure how truthful it actually was, but that's where he left things.
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Wrapped up S3 so I read through this thread. Fascinating to see much debate over whether or not Chuck was evil. Calvin made some decent arguments on hs behalf, but he really struck me as reprehensible. Waking up in the hospital his first instinct was to use the fact that Jimmy just saved his life to try to nail him. That was pretty much the final nail in Chuck's coffin for me (and it was already pretty tightly sealed). And yet, the amazingness of Vince Gilligan, I took no joy in watching him self-destruct, despite really wanting it to happen.
Chuck was the perfect bad guy. Maybe the best I've ever seen. He had all the hallmarks. He did awful things to his brother, but from his own warped perspective he was doing them for Jimmy's own good. He made you hate him, yet he was so terribly flawed you also had to sympathize. In the end the flaws, both innate and chosen, led to his demise.
And saddest of all is that his final words were telling Jimmy "the truth is you've never mattered all that much to me." I'm not sure how truthful it actually was, but that's where he left things.
This is a great post/observation. Friggin spot on
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Michael McKean not even getting an Emmy nomination for Season 3 was such a farce.
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From BCS FB page
You asked, we answered! Season 4 of #BetterCallSaul returns to AMC on August 6th at 9/8c. HUGE thank you to all who put together the social scavenger hunt yesterday! Stay tuned to our social pages, more exciting news and announcements on the way! #SalamancaTwins
There’s a photo with the announcement and the Salamanca twins are there
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YES!! Finally!
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Nice.
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Great news indeed!!
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After every season people post here hoping there's another, and then celebrate when they find out there will be. Is there really any question about it? At this point I reckon they're going to give Gilligan as many episodes as he wants to make, which they know will only be five or six seasons. Are the ratings bad or something?
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After every season people post here hoping there's another, and then celebrate when they find out there will be. Is there really any question about it? At this point I reckon they're going to give Gilligan as many episodes as he wants to make, which they know will only be five or six seasons. Are the ratings bad or something?
In my case (and I assume for many others) it's just excitement over finally having a release date. We're verging on almost a year and a half after the first season, so it's just really nice to finally have a premiere date.
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Sweeet! :tup
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In my case (and I assume for many others) it's just excitement over finally having a release date. We're verging on almost a year and a half after the first season, so it's just really nice to finally have a premiere date.
Same.
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Trailer time:
https://youtu.be/bqkDZG1LVlc
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Nice, can't wait!!
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This link might or might not contain spoilers
https://ew.com/tv/2018/07/17/better-call-saul-breaking-bad-scene-season-4/
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https://www.facebook.com/BetterCallSaulAMC/videos/1819427784760846/
Full trailer, I can’t fucking wait
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Yesssssssss this is going to be amazing. I never, ever thought I'd like the show as much as I do. Written off as a cash grab, and now I'm debating on whether or not I might end up liking it more than BB.
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Yeah I was nervous at first but BCS has really turned into something special. It's just quality all around and this season looks like it'll keep that going. Looks like a certain someone is back from BB in that trailer, too, if my eyes don't deceive me.
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Can't wait to see where they go with this now. Still a bummer to see Chuck go, but his departure sets the stage for the storyline to really start moving towards Jimmy becoming Saul.
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7 f*cking days!!!
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Season 5 already picked up. I recall reading a while back that the original planned run they envisioned was a 5 season run? I wonder if that has changed?
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https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/20/590x/secondary/Better-Call-Saul-season-4-Bob-Odenkirk-reveals-his-tattoo-1438755.jpg
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Season 5 already picked up. I recall reading a while back that the original planned run they envisioned was a 5 season run? I wonder if that has changed?
I think Season 5 will be it. Now that Chuck is dead, I think 4 will speed things up as we see Jimmy start moving towards becoming Saul, with 5 focusing on his complete changeover combined with the current state of his life in Omaha.
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Season 5 already picked up. I recall reading a while back that the original planned run they envisioned was a 5 season run? I wonder if that has changed?
I think Season 5 will be it. Now that Chuck is dead, I think 4 will speed things up as we see Jimmy start moving towards becoming Saul, with 5 focusing on his complete changeover combined with the current state of his life in Omaha.
This is what everybody is looking to see. I don't get it. What more does he need to do to become Saul? Seems to me he's a tacky office, hot girlfriend, and quick name change away from being the same character he always was. The reality is that he's been a criminal lawyer since day one.
Speaking of the hot girlfriend, there are clues throughout that Kim Wexler is originally from Omaha.
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Honestly, I am very interested to see what happens with Saul's post-BB life. We have just seen tidbits so far, but you know they will give us plenty more before it all ends.
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This is what everybody is looking to see. I don't get it. What more does he need to do to become Saul? Seems to me he's a tacky office, hot girlfriend, and quick name change away from being the same character he always was. The reality is that he's been a criminal lawyer since day one.
While I agree with what you’re saying....Jimmy still has the tendency to try or want to do the ‘right’ thing at the end of the day. You can sense some remorse in his character. I think Kev’s just talking about him getting to the full blown Saul point of not giving a crap about any of it.
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Honestly, I am very interested to see what happens with Saul's post-BB life. We have just seen tidbits so far, but you know they will give us plenty more before it all ends.
This kinda offers some interesting way to look back at his character.
In Breaking Bad Walter White was the protagonist, we followed his journey and while of course some deaths greatly mattered (For anyone living under a rock and still following this thread I'll just name the Ozymandias one), some others were random goons.
Saul was the comic relief, he was there from time to time to do his job, and then he got shipped away to Omaha with a new identity. Ok, Saul at least's gonna get out of there alive, bye bye, now let's focus on the final two episodes ever!
....and then you watch Better Call Saul, and that ending hits you hard. You watch good hearted Jimmy, that for all his mistakes could get his life straight if he'd believe more in his good side, and you know that it's all gonna be in vain and that he's going to hide away from everyone he ever knew to live a life under cover in Omaha. That's quite a terrible fate, even if he got away with his life.
This could be expanded to every other character I guess, for example that chubby dude in the white dress that got shot and killed early in the series, Jesse's friend.... see, I don't even remember his name but in that universe he had a family, friends, people who suffered greatly for his untimely and violent death.
This happens anyway in real life, we concentrate on our friends and family because we cannot grieve for any random kid that gets killed in a faraway country or for a celebrity that passes away, but if we'd get to see the good sides of everyone in the Breaking Bad universe, we'd get the full extent and enormity of all the pain Walter caused more or less indirectly with his actions.
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Honestly, I am very interested to see what happens with Saul's post-BB life. We have just seen tidbits so far, but you know they will give us plenty more before it all ends.
Well, there's every possibility Wexler is involved, the Omaha thing. There's also a preview clip (which I've been unable to see) of the intro that shows Gene being asked for his driver's license and SS number in the ER, which might be problematic for him. Seems to me that for what they paid they should have been provided proper documentation, but as a plot device it might not be the case.
Perhaps Gene's collapse is the beginning of his own Walter White style breaking bad.
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Very true.
What was great about Saul on BB was that while, yes, he was comic relief, he could also be very serious and pragmatic when the situation called for it.
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As someone who just finished season 3 and watched the 3 seasons in 2 weeks, I think the whole Chuck/Jimmy sibling relationship is just so fascinating. What makes it great is you can see it from both their sides and completely understand their motivations and actions. Chuck is sort of the Skyler of the show - the "normal" person close to the protagonist making their shady decisions fire back and so you're inclined to dislike them, yet if you try to see it from their side i think their decisions make sense. I think that's something Gilligan does really well is very human characters with flaws who has good sides and bad sides.
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As someone who just finished season 3 and watched the 3 seasons in 2 weeks, I think the whole Chuck/Jimmy sibling relationship is just so fascinating. What makes it great is you can see it from both their sides and completely understand their motivations and actions. Chuck is sort of the Skyler of the show - the "normal" person close to the protagonist making their shady decisions fire back and so you're inclined to dislike them, yet if you try to see it from their side i think their decisions make sense. I think that's something Gilligan does really well is very human characters with flaws who has good sides and bad sides.
I haven't seen you here in ages. You been around all this time, or did you disappear and return at some point? Maybe it's just the new avatar.
Being able to understand Chuck's point of view, as well as understanding his illness, is what made his character such a phenomenal antagonist. You really hated him for what he did. You really felt bad for him for being nuts. You really understood why he did what he did. This is a Shakespearean level antagonist with a pathos that lays on you like a ton of bricks. I really wanted him to die. I understood why he needed to die. I took zero satisfaction from his death, though. That's some high quality writing and some even better acting.
I watched bits of the final S3 episode the other night, and I've decided that Howard killed Chuck. Mania and Jimmy are both things Chuck had adapted to. Nothing there is going to push him over the edge. Howard shelling out 9 million of his own dollars just to get rid of him was a gut punch that really flattened him, though. You could see him dying as it happened, and while Howard delivered his farewell speech. He was crumbling inside. It was also a remarkable failure on Chuck's part. His reading of the situation with Howard couldn't have been more wrong, and his standard technique for dealing with things like this blew up in his face. He really thought he was going to talk his way out of his trouble and never could have foreseen what actually happened. This was an existential shot to the gut that he was simply not in a position to cope with given the other things in his life.
Howard's been a remarkably understated character. There's a whole lot more going on inside his head that what we've seen. I'm guessing he's a major antagonist going forward, which will be all the more interesting because I think he's sincere when he expresses fondness for Jimmy. It's really the exact opposite of what we've seen up until now. Jimmy looked up to Chuck, who was spiteful and resentful towards him. Howard actually likes Jimmy, yet represents everything that Jimmy aspires not to be.
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That's a great point about Howard and his role in Chuck's downfall and death. The law firm was all he had left, and once that was gone, his will to live seeped out of him. Good call!
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It's also interesting to see how Howard was perceived through the series: annoying asshole, suddenly the good guy, then back to asshol-ish again, and then good guy again.
He's another fleshed out character, fondamentally a good person with some flaws and with a huge weight on his shoulder and he tries to deal with adversities the best way he can.
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It's also interesting to see how Howard was perceived through the series: annoying asshole, suddenly the good guy, then back to asshol-ish again, and then good guy again.
He's another fleshed out character, fondamentally a good person with some flaws and with a huge weight on his shoulder and he tries to deal with adversities the best way he can.
And when he was an asshole to Jimmy it was always because he was being the bad cop for Chuck. At the same time he was also often an asshole to Kim, and there's no basis for that. I really have no idea at all what makes Howard tick. What I do know is that there's six million bucks that will come into play in the next season. Chuck would never have left any part of his estate to Jimmy, that much is for sure, so I'm not sure what Jimmy's involvement in that will be, but there has to be some thorny issue that arises because of it.
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Really enjoyed reading all of these comments.
Watched the final three episodes of Season 3 again this morning. One of the many things I love about the show is the pace, somewhat like savoring the aromas of a long prepared meal, and then having your patience overwhelmingly rewarded with the results, as opposed to microwaved or McDonald's offerings.
From the previews, I am bracing myself for a much more BB type of violent season. Not sure how I feel about that, but it was inevitable. We'll just have to follow the 'In Vince We Trust' mantra.
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AN ACTUALLY USEFUL 'BETTER CALL SAUL' TIMELINE (AND WHERE 'BREAKING BAD' FITS IN)
https://www.thrillist.com/entertainment/nation/better-call-saul-breaking-bad-timeline-connections?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=thrillist
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Great return! And that last scene.....wow. Talk about a change in demeanor.
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It's nice to finally have the show back. I thought that was a good opener. I loved how Jimmy handled the situation with Chuck... especially when he walked away from the phone call with Howard. Great to see Gus and Nacho in the first episode, my guess is that this season will heat up fast. Mike was great as he always is :biggrin:
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It's nice to finally have the show back. I thought that was a good opener. I loved how Jimmy handled the situation with Chuck... especially when he walked away from the phone call with Howard. Great to see Gus and Nacho in the first episode, my guess is that this season will heat up fast. Mike was great as he always is :biggrin:
Took me a bit to figure out what he was doing. Then I realized that he's the type of guy who can't accept $$$ without 'earning' it. After that it was neat to watch him do what he was doing.
and I've decided that Howard killed Chuck.
EB nailed it and the season opening episode solidified it. What was eerie was just how quickly Jimmy turned the page after the revelation/realization was made that it WAS Howard who ultimately pushed Chuck over the edge.
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^^ As soon as he said, "Well Howard, that's your cross to bear" and got up and fed the fish, got some coffee etc. with a whistle, I said to myself, "That right there is him becoming Saul." I could see it in his mannerisms and attitude. Letting someone else take all the blame for something and not letting it bother him, because Howard was convinced it was his fault anyway. I could be wrong, but I think we'll see a big shift in Jimmy this season, possibly finally adopting the 'Saul' moniker?
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Bob Odenkirk talks Jimmy's reaction to Chucks death......pretty insightful as to how he was 'playing' it.
https://ew.com/tv/2018/08/06/better-call-saul-bob-odenkirk-season-4-premiere-smoke/
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Very good episode
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Good episode.
I was howling watching Mike act like such a boss in the Madrigal warehouse. :lol :lol :lol
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(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/08235566-3B7C-4E40-879E-0DEF37890431_zps4ilkwzx5.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/08235566-3B7C-4E40-879E-0DEF37890431_zps4ilkwzx5.jpg.html)
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Possible spoilers for the new season, but also a nice interview with Bob Odenkirk:
https://ew.com/tv/2018/08/06/better-call-saul-bob-odenkirk-breaking-bad-season-4/2/
I watched the first episode just now and enjoyed it a lot. I'm glad this series is back :)
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Stellar episode tonight...with a brutal ending. :eek :eek
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Stellar episode tonight...with a brutal ending. :eek :eek
No kidding. The Kim/Howard scene was awesome. And the Copy Machine interview was classic. This show is great....in fact, I think its better than Breaking Bad.
I know there are a lot of BB die hards who will scoff at such a claim.....but, I’ve seen them both and pound for pound BCS is better IMO. Better ensemble of actors....the writing is top level....I just think it’s surpassed BB.
:flame:
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Yes indeed, I will scoff at that claim. ;)
A better ensemble of actors? Well, in the sense that Better Call Saul is more of an ensemble than a show with a true lead character (Odenkirk is a far better supporting actor than lead), it could be debatable, but pound for pound, BB wins easily, IMO. Not counting the characters who were on both shows (since that can be considered a wash), BB had Bryan Cranston, who gave what some, including both Anthony Hopkins and myself, would call the greatest acting performance ever. His performance alone elevates it. And then of course there is Aaron Paul, who was brilliant as well; I would say he was the 2nd best from either show, so already BB has, IMO, by far the top 2 performances from either show. Moving forward, I would say Anna Gunn and Rhea Seehorn were equally good, although I suspect many who disliked Skylar for some bizarre reason would not give Gunn props for her performance as a result. And let's not forget Dean Norris, who turned what could have been a stereotypical tough guy cop/DEA agent character into a complex one. Michael McKean was awesome as Chuck, and Michael Mando and Patrick Fabian are really good in their roles, but Breaking Bad just seemed filled with once in a lifetime performances in a once in a lifetime show.
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Totally get your points Kev, there is no arguing how incredible the BB crew was. I loved the show as well.
I think I put BCS above BB because of Jimmy/Saul......Bob Odenkirk. I am just captivated by that character.
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I'm with you Gary. BB was good but BCS is easily better.
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I think I put BCS above BB because of Jimmy/Saul......Bob Odenkirk. I am just captivated by that character.
Understand. :hat
Don't get me wrong, I like the show a lot, but it just doesn't have that "I can't wait to watch it" pull that Breaking Bad had for me.
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BB had 'zest'....BCS has that nice, easy simmer. BB was better, but I treasure Jimmy and Kim, and enjoy this show more (and eventually admired everything about the writing and character that went into Chuck....McKean, you deserved an Emmy nomination at the least).
How lucky that we are in Season 4, when there were worries that this would succumb to other prequel/sequel failures and crash and burn during its first year.
'Give 'em a badge'
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Really enjoying the start to this season. Breaking Bad is still "better" for me, but BCS has to be a serious contender for best spin-off of all time.
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Why did Jimmy turned off the photocopier job? I still can’t make it
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It wasn't about 'getting a job'; Jimmy needs a challenge and this was way too easy. He probably realised that he could use his talents for other things than being 'just' a salesman for a photocopy machine. And the people in that company weren't exactly his type either.
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It wasn't about 'getting a job'; Jimmy needs a challenge and this was way too easy. He probably realised that he could use his talents for other things than being 'just' a salesman for a photocopy machine. And the people in that company weren't exactly his type either.
Really? I didn't understand it this way. For me it has something to do with Chuck. After you read that interview with Bob Odenkirk about Chuck's death you get a different perspective. He has completely supressed his feelings, but the death of his brother affected him deeply. It is just unconscious.
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It wasn't about 'getting a job'; Jimmy needs a challenge and this was way too easy. He probably realised that he could use his talents for other things than being 'just' a salesman for a photocopy machine. And the people in that company weren't exactly his type either.
Really? I didn't understand it this way. For me it has something to do with Chuck. After you read that interview with Bob Odenkirk about Chuck's death you get a different perspective. He has completely supressed his feelings, but the death of his brother affected him deeply. It is just unconscious.
I think the moment he noticed the Hummels in the cabinet he had made his mind up to steal them.....and his subsequent antics/push to get hired was just his way of feeling them out to see what he'd be able to get away with. He realized they were push overs and that he'd be able to steal the valuable collectible(s) without an issue.
That was such a cool scene.
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But, will Jimmy try to steal the hummels from them or from the old lady we saw in season 3?
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But, will Jimmy try to steal the hummels from them or from the old lady we saw in season 3?
If I had to guess it'd be them because I don't think those guys would notice right away. The old lady would probably notice instantly.
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I caught an old episode of Hunter on cable last night (from 1985) and was stunned when I realized who the guest star was...
(https://78.media.tumblr.com/41bfa35d9d8390dcad6a775f0080f67e/tumblr_inline_mueb60rEK71s8g9qk.jpg)
(https://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Mike-Ehrmantraut-600x339.jpg)
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Gale!!
Oh, and something tells me that Nacho's suffering has just begun.
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Gale!!
Oh, and something tells me that Nacho's suffering has just begun.
Talk about reprising your old role in an epic re-introduction scene......What kind of song was that? :lol Can you imagine trying to memorize that?
And yeah....considering we never even saw Nacho in BB (but his name was mentioned) I'm thinking that he is in for some major bummer times....
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The actor said it was a bitch learning the song to sing :lol:
https://ew.com/tv/2018/08/21/better-call-saul-breaking-bad-david-costabile/
Also, it seems like many think that the Chuck letter Jimmy read at the end was a forged one by Kim, but I do not. That doesn't seem like her style.
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Hmmm, I didn't even notice that the guy Jimmy used to do the B&E in this last episode was Ira from Breaking Bad. Ira was part of the tenting team in S5:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzGHxDjkrx8 (the one sitting down in this scene)
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also, it seems like many think that the Chuck letter Jimmy read at the end was a forged one by Kim, but I do not. That doesn't seem like her style.
I don't think so either, but there's more going on with Kim, by the looks of it. Either that, or she's really stricken with guilt for Chuck's death. I got a hint of that with the Mesa Verde scene. Also, we've yet to find out what she went to the courthouse for afterwards. Her breaking down at Jimmy reading the letter aloud was maybe because she expected the worst with the letter, only to find that it wasn't all that bad - and she feels bad for having hurt Chuck (and possibly Howard too), though I'm just grasping at straws at this point.
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For some reason it never clicked with me until BCS this week that the actor who plays Gale also plays Wags on Billions (the latter being in production at the same time as his scene is BCS being filmed is why Gale had facial hair). Makes me enjoy both characters more :lol
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(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/022CBE75-DEF8-4B3C-9FF2-085F2D1A1B3A_zpswfpo3851.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/022CBE75-DEF8-4B3C-9FF2-085F2D1A1B3A_zpswfpo3851.jpg.html)
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Last week's episode was so good - best of this season. Love the Breaking Bad vibes, the whole set-up with the car was wild. Thought the thief stuck in the office while the guy was having a marital crisis was hilarious, too. Hope tonight's is just as good - I'm rooting for Nacho to pull through and get well ASAP.
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Thought the thief stuck in the office while the guy was having a marital crisis was hilarious, too.
Yeah....that was great :lol Given that Jimmy sold it twice as the 'easiest' $4k you'd ever make you had a feeling there'd be a hitch to it.....and that scenario was the last thing anyone could have imagined. So random....yet so perfect. Just another example of the great writing that accompanies this show every week.
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Thought the thief stuck in the office while the guy was having a marital crisis was hilarious, too.
Yeah....that was great :lol Given that Jimmy sold it twice as the 'easiest' $4k you'd ever make you had a feeling there'd be a hitch to it.....and that scenario was the last thing anyone could have imagined. So random....yet so perfect. Just another example of the great writing that accompanies this show every week.
When he ordered the pizza and the thief looked like he wanted to cry... omg :rollin
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Excellent job by 'Neelix' as the judge. :tup
We're seeing the slow change of Kim questioning herself regarding Chuck, Jimmy's reaction (or lack of) to the letter, and whether she wants to be anchored down with that Mesa Verde expansion. One never knows if she is also suffering effects of her accident. At least it doesn't appear she's getting addicted to any pain medication ('only the good stuff' was kinda worrisome in that regards).
Nice job of the 'Hummel' guy, by paying Jimmy his full share. 'Honor among thieves'.
We're finding all that involves Nacho to be more than fascinating. Glad the twin 'sharks' are gone for now. Still waiting for Gomez to appear (just speculating)
We are missing the humor and silliness and cleverness that would always pop up in every episode of previous seasons to help break up the serious situations. Even just a smiling Gus with a customer would be a nice to change of pace in such a heavy year.
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Last episode was SOOOOO good!
I would like to know now what Mike is up to as per Gus request
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I'm really enjoying this season.
What was the flashback at the beginning? First thoughts it was Mike digging a hole for a deceased pet of his son's.
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https://tvline.com/2018/08/31/better-call-saul-season-4-chuck-letter-kim-jimmy-bob-odenkirk/
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What I thought all along. I didn’t buy into the ‘Kim wrote it’ speculation.
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Me neither. That kind of cliche is something the BB/BCS writers totally avoid.
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Wow, what a great episode.
I wonder why Howard was that bad looking in the bath scene. I don’t think it is related to Chucks dead isn’t ?
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Howard showed obvious pain and guilt when talking to Jimmy and Kim about his death. It was his final action of removing Chuck that helped reignite the (final) spiral Kim ripping him a new one at the office afterwards added to it.
Rewatched episode 4 (FFing through commercials) before episode 5. These were two terrific shows. Made no sense to make it so uncomfortable to the lab 'riders'. Cushy seats, seat belts, low volume music, and A/C would have helped hide some of the 'mysteries'. Plus, had to p*ss Mike off to spend 18 hours back there.
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I hate to say it, but I have went from excited about this show to bored as hell with it. I am still in it till the end, but it feels like I am forcing myself to watch it at this point. If this weren't a BB prequel, I'd be jumping ship.
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My dad is still into the show so that's a good sign to me, I missed the last 2 episodes but hopefully will catch up this weekend. I loved this season through the first four episodes so hope it's kept up.
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Yeah, I really don't understand you Kev. :lol
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My dad is still into the show so that's a good sign to me, I missed the last 2 episodes but hopefully will catch up this weekend. I loved this season through the first four episodes so hope it's kept up.
Thanks for the clarification, as I was a bit stunned because these last two episodes are easily the best of the season. A lot of 'fan service', two terrific flashbacks, and some brilliant story telling with their tie ins. I don't think you'll be disappointed.
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Loving this season just like I did the others, and, for me, it is much better than Breaking Bad.
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Yeah, I really don't understand you Kev. :lol
What's not to understand?
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Yeah, I really don't understand you Kev. :lol
What's not to understand?
I phrased that wrong, should have said can't relate rather than don't understand. For me, everything about BCS is superior to BB, and the quality has remained consistently high throughout. But tastes, of course!
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My dad is still into the show so that's a good sign to me, I missed the last 2 episodes but hopefully will catch up this weekend. I loved this season through the first four episodes so hope it's kept up.
Thanks for the clarification, as I was a bit stunned because these last two episodes are easily the best of the season. A lot of 'fan service', two terrific flashbacks, and some brilliant story telling with their tie ins. I don't think you'll be disappointed.
I just finished episode 5 a couple minutes ago, and had to respond to this. Nope, not disappointed in the slightest. I'm about to start episode 6 but want to share fresh thoughts before seeing what happens next.
Starting off with a 'behind the scenes' opening with Saul in his office during the end of Breaking Bad (that would be during what episode... Granite State, probably?) was awesome. Possibly my favorite opening of all BCS's seasons, because I knew the significance of that scene. Bob Odenkirk just melts back into the role of Saul there and it's easy to see it happen during the episode as he slings burner phones on the streets. Also, those kids who mugged him are assholes, I was so mad when that happened.
Seeing Gus and Mike lay the foundations for Gus's hidden lab - YES! I loved that this was a thing. I always wondered during BB how the hell that came to be and when it started, and BCS has been doing a great job giving some backstory on BB while being its own thing (bringing in Gus, the Cousins, Gale at his old job, the building of the lab).
Kim is a great lawyer and person in general and I kind of liked that she hung up on Mesa Verde to help her client but she definitely earned that scolding when she got back. I don't want anything bad to happen to her but of course I can't shake the feeling something is gonna go down.
Howard looked like a total mess at the end, too. Did Kim scolding him mess him up that badly? Wow.
Here goes episode 6. I love this show so much.
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Okay, episode 6. Not too much to say there, actually. Enjoyable episode as usual, but the one before it was much more exciting. I really liked Gus's monologue to Hector, and I loved Jimmy getting revenge on those bastard kids. For a moment I was convinced he got in over his head and they were really gonna beat the kids to a pulp, that was tense.
Good to see Howard get his balls back for a minute - "fuck you, Jimmy" - "That's it, use that!" - yes! :biggrin:
Kind of glad I waited until today, because now I only have 2 more days to wait for a new ep!
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Last night's episode was a good one. It's sad to watch Kim and Jimmy becoming more distant as their lives go in different directions.
I'm loving all these characters from Breaking Bad having a role in this show finally; Huell being a central character of the episode was enjoyable and it was interesting to watch Kim process Jimmy's explanation for selling drop phones on the street for months on end. And then coming up with a plan at the end - didn't expect her to do that, but I feel like Kim's getting herself into some real hot water which makes me sad, I really like her and don't want anything bad to happen to her.
Gus pulling the plug on Hector's treatment - oooh, that's cruel. The backstory on Hector Salamanca is great after watching him through all of BB and it'll be so fun to watch Breaking Bad yet again after this show wraps.
Only a few more episodes already... sigh. Hope next season doesn't take a year and a half to make!
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After being bored with the last few episodes, last night's was excellent! That opening montage was awesome, showing the divide that is happening between Kim and Jimmy.
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Great episode.
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Yeah, I really don't understand you Kev. :lol
What's not to understand?
I phrased that wrong, should have said can't relate rather than don't understand. For me, everything about BCS is superior to BB, and the quality has remained consistently high throughout. But tastes, of course!
It's not just me, though! Several co-workers are totally bored with the show, to the point where one has all but given up on it, and the other takes the "I guess I'll watch it since I'm already invested" attitude. A friend texted me yesterday, "Wow, Saul kinda sucks now." And my cousin texted me the other day saying he and his wife finally started watching this season and are not liking it either. At this point, literally every single person I talk to on a somewhat regularly basis (at least) who watches the show is incredibly disappointed with it it.
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Why are they disappointed? I'm curious to hear the reasons. My old man doesn't watch much TV like this show and he's absolutely hooked even when it slows down. The character development is excellent, the editing and cinematography is clever and high quality, the overall plot is going places and the connections to Breaking Bad are significant and offer some interesting backstory. I can kind of understand why some wouldn't be entertained but the show hasn't really changed much since its first season, when it was much slower with less going on than it has now. So I'm just curious.
Not saying anyone's wrong, of course, absolutely not. But it reminds me of two of my best friends who gave up on Westworld season 2 like 3 episodes in and started trashing the series even though nothing really changed.
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Why are they disappointed? I'm curious to hear the reasons.
"It's boring."
"It moves too slow."
"Not enough happens in every episode."
That is the gist of it.
And I generally agree. With only 10 48-minute (roughly) episodes a season, they should be packing as much as they can into one episode, but it feels like so much time is slowly building up to something that inevitably has an unsatisfying payoff.
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That's... interesting. It's a show about a guy trying to be a lawyer and scrape by through other means, not really sure what they're expecting, too much of the Salamancas or Gus stuff turns it into a Breaking Bad wannabe. Oh well, that's a shame.
Stoked for the new episode in 10 minutes.
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HAHA! Me when I saw that Jimmy's brilliant scheme had paid off when Kim kissed him in the stairwell:
(https://i.imgur.com/RtRzIog.gif)
JIMMYYYY!!!
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It really helps to watch the previous episode On Demand just prior to the new episode (FFing thru the commercials). Really helped for tonight.
And, my review of the new episode
:tup :tup :tup :tup :tup
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The whole Huell thing portraying him as a hero was hilarious.
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"It's boring."
"It moves too slow."
"Not enough happens in every episode."
That is the gist of it.
To that I say: the instant gratification generation. What? No explosions? No car chases? No special effects? No constant action? No way!
A lot happens every second of every episode if you are really watching. If you are watching while expecting something, then you are not really watching.
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"It's boring."
"It moves too slow."
"Not enough happens in every episode."
That is the gist of it.
To that I say: the instant gratification generation. What? No explosions? No car chases? No special effects? No constant action? No way!
A lot happens every second of every episode if you are really watching. If you are watching while expecting something, then you are not really watching.
Agreed.
And Guillermo del Toro says it better than me:
(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/E9E80B35-8EFB-402C-89D6-4172B3870DC7_zpsdaokoovv.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/E9E80B35-8EFB-402C-89D6-4172B3870DC7_zpsdaokoovv.jpg.html)
(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/B1508EC4-EB52-4E34-AAA4-54740FB0D00D_zpsuryji2jt.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/B1508EC4-EB52-4E34-AAA4-54740FB0D00D_zpsuryji2jt.jpg.html)
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"It's boring."
"It moves too slow."
"Not enough happens in every episode."
That is the gist of it.
To that I say: the instant gratification generation. What? No explosions? No car chases? No special effects? No constant action? No way!
A lot happens every second of every episode if you are really watching. If you are watching while expecting something, then you are not really watching.
Nah, that's not it. It's just not that great.
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I disagree with the comparison he makes between Walter and Jimmy. I think there is A LOT of good in Jimmy, even as Saul Goodman. It is only the facade that he has learned to maintain to deal with the system. Underneath it there is a really good guy.
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A really good guy, and one who's envious of his brother's success as a lawyer. Look back at that last episode when there's a flashback to him and Kim (then an intern, Jimmy a mailroom clerk) and he's staring with envy at Chuck as he's being congratulated on his recent big win. Jimmy just wants to prove he's as good and worthy as Chuck, ever since he was a mailroom clerk, but he's been struggling along the way, going so far as to deceive his own brother at the end. There's definitely a good core to Jimmy, but on the exterior there grows an ever-thickening shell of deception and cunning. I adore the way this show tells that story.
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Damn, episodes 7 and 8 were sooooo good.
I do find it weird that some people don't like BCS because it's "too slow" or whatever but love BB which is also a very slow paced show. That's not a criticism, it's just the style that these two shows have.
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I just watched Episode 8, after watching #7 last night (I was a bit behind).
Just when I was wondering when Nacho would show up again (last time we saw him he was sobbing in his father's house), he did show up. And it looks like he's changed - and he seems to be (going to be) in trouble yet again with that random dude in the restaurant at the very end of the episode.
The Babineaux thing was...quite funny, but very improbable. Why would Kim even want to start helping Jimmy for keeping Huell out of jil? She has basically no interest whatsoever. Huell is a minor character and pretty much a nobody at best, so for her to get into serious trouble over this makes no sense at all to me. The stint they (Kim & Jimmy) pulled was pretty good though, but Kim saying 'Let's do it again' at the end has me worried for her. Saul's going to drag her down with him, which is not what I would like to see.
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I just watched Episode 8, after watching #7 last night (I was a bit behind).
Just when I was wondering when Nacho would show up again (last time we saw him he was sobbing in his father's house), he did show up. And it looks like he's changed - and he seems to be (going to be) in trouble yet again with that random dude in the restaurant at the very end of the episode.
The Babineaux thing was...quite funny, but very improbable. Why would Kim even want to start helping Jimmy for keeping Huell out of jil? She has basically no interest whatsoever. Huell is a minor character and pretty much a nobody at best, so for her to get into serious trouble over this makes no sense at all to me. The stint they (Kim & Jimmy) pulled was pretty good though, but Kim saying 'Let's do it again' at the end has me worried for her. Saul's going to drag her down with him, which is not what I would like to see.
I've been trying to find a good explanation for Kim's behavior too, since I haven't rewatched the series yet, and came across an article that seems to give a good explanation.
https://www.theringer.com/tv/2018/9/24/17894970/better-call-saul-episode-8-season-4-recap-coushatta-kim-wexler-jimmy-mcgill
She probably won’t, but there is a heightened aura of tragic inevitability surrounding Kim, akin to Chuck’s waning moments in Better Call Saul’s third season. The catalyst for Kim agreeing to help Jimmy pull the scam in “Something Stupid” came when the prosecuting attorney said that Huell’s only witness was a “scumbag disbarred lawyer who peddles drop phones to criminals.” Kim’s anguish conveyed an array of emotions: shock, befuddlement, defensiveness, and tacit acknowledgment. She needs to reorient her moral compass before she fully breaks bad alongside Jimmy. But like Heisenberg’s blue meth, now that she’s got a taste for it, there might not be any going back.
There's also a reminder about how she helped Jimmy con the douchey business guy earlier in the series, the loudmouth at the bar - another good scene.
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The Babineaux thing was...quite funny, but very improbable. Why would Kim even want to start helping Jimmy for keeping Huell out of jil? She has basically no interest whatsoever. Huell is a minor character and pretty much a nobody at best, so for her to get into serious trouble over this makes no sense at all to me. The stint they (Kim & Jimmy) pulled was pretty good though, but Kim saying 'Let's do it again' at the end has me worried for her. Saul's going to drag her down with him, which is not what I would like to see.
Improbable in what sense? Do you mean in terms of her motivation? Because actually, although it comes as a surprise (as over the last couple of seasons she's been more serious and focused on her legal career), it's at the same time not that surprising that she loves the challenge, the drama and the one-upmanship of it like when the two of them would scam guys in bars. I honestly loved how they played this, and as others have now suggested, it suddenly seems quite likely that it'll be Kim who ultimately is the bad influence that pushes Jimmy to fully become Saul.
I was also chatting to a friend about it today, who speculated that the person who Saul calls for extraction at the end of BB could actually be Kim. I'm not sure about that, although it'd be a clever twist.
EDIT: ninja'd by Katt o/
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Yeah, but you formulated a good response, I went looking for one :lol I definitely need to watch the series again, the long breaks between seasons have made everything fuzzy.
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I do find it weird that some people don't like BCS because it's "too slow" or whatever but love BB which is also a very slow paced show. That's not a criticism, it's just the style that these two shows have.
It being slow doesn't bother me.
It being boring and uninteresting does.
I know people hated Chuck, but the Jimmy/Chuck dynamic was what drove the show, and with Chuck gone, it's like they are floundering and filling in pre-BB gaps that don't need to be filled. For example, I find the whole "let's see what went into building the super lab" storyline a total waste of time.
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Last episode was SOOOO good.
I feel bad for Kim, but also for Jimmy the guy it’s tired to be under Chucks shadow
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I can do without the Mike's storyline with the German, but the Jimmy/Kim stuff was really good. It was great to finally see them have it out a bit. Should be interesting to see how he gets reinstated now (since we know he does).
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Completely forgot to watch Monday night, had to catch it last night. Might watch it again tonight. That was a really good episode. I personally enjoy the Mike/Werner scenes, particularly in last night's episode. That sneaky son of a bitch. He's gonna end up dead now, and Gus is gonna have Mike's ass in the finale.
I thought it was really cathartic for Kim to lay into Jimmy and frankly it didn't surprise me she let it all out at him. It's hard to disagree with her either, although I still feel terrible for both of them, almost as much for Jimmy as I do for Kim.
That opening scam was fantastic. Kim sold the part of a cunning scammer well while also showing her nerves for the audience to pick up on. Really entertaining.
Lalo Salamanca - not sure what to make of him. I can't tell if he's dangerous or naive, the actor is really good at his role and I can't get a read on him, if he actually does trust Gus or not. He's not like any of the other Salamancas other than his loyalty to Hector.
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Lalo definitely does not trust or like Gus. We saw how close he is to Hector, and I am sure Lalo is on board the same anti-Gus train that Hector is on. His casual toss of the Pollos Hermanos cup out of the car window on to the parking lot illustrated that quite clearly.
At this point, I will be shocked if we do not see Kim in Jimmy's post-BB life. Heck, she could have been in his life the whole time during BB; it's not like they ever showed any aspect of Saul's personal life.
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:facepalm: I forgot about that re: Lalo's behavior after leaving the office. Gonna watch the episode again when I get home soon.
I think it would be awesome if she lived through BB. There's no reason she has to get whacked, after all...
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Right, all of this is definitely setting up a possible season 5.
I think we're getting Gene's life again in the final episode, because we haven't see the rest of that yet and it would feel strange if they don't show us anything there. Also, something's bound to happen with Jimmy getting reinstated anyway, because there's no way this is going to take on another season. It really can go either way in the last episode between Jimmy and Kim, but I think they will make up.
Ramble.
Lalo will probably turn out to be quite literally insane. He might actually go out and kill Nacho for all we know, for 'poisoning' Hector. Also Werner is an idiot and I can't help but think there's more to his escape than just him missing his wife. Perhaps he's secretly working for another group as well? Too much stuff to think about and the final episode is never going to answer all of this at once.
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Man, season finale was SOOOO good, no question why Jimmy feels no remorse for Chuck at all. That Karaoke scene was so perfect, Chuck stealing the spotlight and that song fit really well with the message they were trying to convey.
After watching the episode it got me thinking that Kim was the one who wrote that “perfect” letter to Jimmy and no Chuck.
And last lines of Jimmy at the end of the episode were there ones I anticipated. This show it’s PERFECT. Sadly I will have to wait for next season.
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It was a great episode. And that shot of Mike and Werner in the desert, that was cinematic beauty. And their dialogue just prior to that, it was great. You could see it in both their faces that neither of them wanted that outcome but it had to be done. I loved how Jimmy conned everyone, even the viewers (at least me and my dad), into believing he was genuine in that room, and then... bam, suckered. Slippin' Jimmy. "S'all good, man!" Hah. Season 5 is gonna rock. Hope it comes sooner than later.
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Moral of the story: everything Chuck said about his brother was dead accurate.
Very good finale to a somewhat choppy season, IMO.
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Yeah, it didn't seem to get its legs until around Episode 5. We watched 6-9 last night before the finale.
There was so much to digest. It was well done on every count, painful as it was. Good to see the Abbey Road Gang again, and Howard, and the opener was superb and a brilliant twist for the ending.
'one thousand and one, one thousand and two'
'watermelon pickles'
Biggest disappointment: not getting to hear Jimmy and Kim have a go at 'Bohemian Rhapsody' :tdwn
Biggest sigh of relief: not having to hear Jimmy and Kim sing 'Bohemian Rhapsody'. ;)
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I was waiting for Chuck to start singing Stonehenge. :metal :metal
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At a volume of 11 :D
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I was waiting for Chuck to start singing Stonehenge. :metal :metal
OMG...I was thinking the exact same thing as I was watching that part. :tup :tup
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Dman, that was an awesome episode indeed!
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That ending was brilliant. Kim played the game with Jimmy and in the end she truly thought he meant what he said when he went off script. He deserves a nomination for the emmy.
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Alright.. now that the dust has settled a bit; I really enjoy Better Call Saul and as it's the only Series I watch, you can guess that I'm already eagerly awaiting Season 5 (which should arrive sometime, given the ending of this one). However, I can't help but feel that the creators went a little off-track with this season, and that's mostly to do with the bunch of semi-/not intertwined plot-lines throughout the series.
I don't think I can voice all of my gripes accurately, but I think the following sums it up: the series throws a lot of stuff at you and some of that stuff is brilliant and actually helps to further the plot, other scenes leave me wondering what the hell happened and we're left to fill in the blanks ourselves. Prime example: the latest scenes with Nacho. We last saw him on his father's couch, in very bad shape. The next scene he shows up is in his own(?) house, with random girls in his living room, putting stuff in a safe. What the hell is happening here? Next up, in Ep. 9 he tours around with Lalo, who asks him to show the farm. The in Ep. 10, he's nowhere to be found. Strange.
Then the stuff with the Germans. The bar scene had no impact on the story at all (even Werner drawing the secret lab to random people ultimately didn't do anything). Building the super hideout served nothing other than to show how insanely dedicated Gus is to set up his own operations. The whole 'Werner goes missing' does absolutely nothing for the character development of the main characters and actually didn't further the plot either. I also find it highly unlikely (but that aside) that Werner would actively choose to run away. And was killing him really necessary? I mean, what does it accomplish? (in the grand scheme of things).
Earlier in the series, the Gus/Mike/Nacho stuff was at least closely tied to the Jimmy/Kim stuff, even though it was only through Mike being the parking attendant and him helping Jimmy occasionally. Now it's really two separate stories developing and not all of it is exactly clear (the Nacho stuff for example, but also whatever Lalo is doing). Another thing is the therapy session where Mike ousted that one guy. I mean, the scene was good, but what was the point in showing it? Oh, I haven't even started on the post-BB 'Gene' life. That's really going nowhere either.
Now, typing this up makes it all sound really negative, which isn't my intention, because I'm enjoying the show immensely and perhaps I'm bad at seeing te bigger picture, or the meaning behind some of these seemingly random scenes. To me it's as if the makers themselves don't have a particularly clear direction and they just keep throwing stuff at us to make things more complicated, while detracting from what was originally going to be the main story: how Jimmy got to be Saul. This season had us watching the Twin Brother Deathsquad gun down an entire drug operation out of nowhere.
At least with BB I got the feeling there was more focus; the main story was clear and everything helped propel the story forward. There were no real distractions and everything that was shown mattered to some extent. With BCS, I feel like they could leave out a bunch of the scenes without really damaging the story whatsoever, which ultimately drags down the show a tiny bit.
Again - I enjoyed the season and will eagerly wait for the next. I hope the makers have a good idea of how they're going to tie everything together.
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While I wasn't overly enamored with the Germans/super lab story, I totally disagree with a few things you said, Elite.
Then the stuff with the Germans. The bar scene had no impact on the story at all (even Werner drawing the secret lab to random people ultimately didn't do anything).
Running his mouth to a bunch of strangers showed that Werner could not be trusted, which was reaffirmed later when he bolted in the middle of the night.
The whole 'Werner goes missing' does absolutely nothing for the character development of the main characters and actually didn't further the plot either.
It was a plot device to demonstrate where Mike's unyielding loyalty to Gus, which we saw in Breaking Bad, came from.
I also find it highly unlikely (but that aside) that Werner would actively choose to run away. And was killing him really necessary? I mean, what does it accomplish? (in the grand scheme of things).
Was killing him necessary? Considering their world and leaving the morality of normal people like us out of the equation, yes.
He had already given away some info to Lalo on the phone.
He could not be trusted.
If you are Gus, how can you trust this guy to a) come back and finish the job without going off the reservation again, and b) keep his mouth shut once it was finished.
Now, it's clear that Werner didn't know the full scope of who and what he was dealing with, otherwise Mike's original warning (after he shot his mouth off in the bar) would have sunk in and stuck.
Mike choosing to do it himself was his way of letting Werner go out with a quick death, instead of Gus' guys doing it (and that would not have been quick).
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The whole 'Werner goes missing' does absolutely nothing for the character development of the main characters and actually didn't further the plot either.
It was a plot device to demonstrate where Mike's unyielding loyalty to Gus, which we saw in Breaking Bad, came from.
And also, crucially, why in BB he's so inflexible. I thought the way this story with the Germans developed and set up Mike's character development turned out brilliant in the end.
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Okay, maybe that part of my retort wasn't very well thought out, because now that both of you are saying that, it actually makes sense.
The last couple of scenes with Nacho still leave me wondering what the hell happened though and the fact the series at this point is essentially 2 or 3 stories running together, instead of one bigger story has gone unanswered, so I'm assuming you guys agree with me on that part.
Maybe I'm just not very good at looking further into a tv series.
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TV series viewing.........we had BCS, we watch 'Game of Thrones', and we watch a couple of 'The Sopranos' a month (we'd seen 20% of the episodes during the initial run, we know most of the story lines, the ending, etc....we just want to experience and savor all of it), and...we watch an occasional 'Big Bang'.....but that's it these days.
So, yeah.....we be missing Victor and Giselle.
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I finally blew threw the 3 seasons of this show that are available on Netflix. I freaking love it.
Chuck :(
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:he’d add
I finally blew threw the 3 seasons of this show that are available on Netflix. I freaking love it.
Chuck :(
There are 4 on Netflix
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:he’d add I finally blew threw the 3 seasons of this show that are available on Netflix. I freaking love it.
Chuck :(
There are 4 on Netflix
In the US? They must have just added season 4 then because I wrapped up season 3 last week and there were no other episodes.
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:he’d add I finally blew threw the 3 seasons of this show that are available on Netflix. I freaking love it.
Chuck :(
There are 4 on Netflix
In the US? They must have just added season 4 then because I wrapped up season 3 last week and there were no other episodes.
Oh, no, sorry.
In LATAM. I forgot in the US it airs on AMC
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Finally started watching, I'm four episodes in. I guess it was a good thing to wait for the series to be over, otherwise waiting for a week each time would have felt so sloooooow, given the equally slow pace of the episodes.
I don't mind it at all, they've built a world that was already grounded in the BB universe, so they've earned the right to take their time in telling the stories, but I can see how some people may not be patient and consider it all a slow drag.
Also, I'm happy to see all the BB characters, but at times it feels they're sidelining Jimmy's story. There's more stuff going on at times with Gus and Nacho than with Jimmy and Kim.
Some short considerations so far...
Episode 1, Smoke: Damn, that cold opening! the feeling of paranoia was so intense. Also very heavy scenes with Jimmy finding out, and then shrugging it off as soon as Howard took blame for that.
Episode 2, Breathe: Some good dark comedy moments for Jimmy winning the job and then refusing it because the guys are gullible. Also, HOLY FRACKING FRACK Gus enlisting Nacho!!! and Kim tearing a new one to Howard... very intense scene.
Episode 3, Something Beautiful: Very BB-esque opening with the setup for the "ambush" in the desert. Poor Nacho.
Episode 4, Talk: "Fucking Salamancas" :lol as Nacho said when he suggested they'd return to the hideout of the rivals, and then the cousins went full Terminator and killed the entire compound all by themselves.
Now I'm looking forward to see what Mike will do with Gus, his scenes of taking way too seriously than anyone would have ever expected his fake job as security consultant were priceless.
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Okay, maybe that part of my retort wasn't very well thought out, because now that both of you are saying that, it actually makes sense.
The last couple of scenes with Nacho still leave me wondering what the hell happened though and the fact the series at this point is essentially 2 or 3 stories running together, instead of one bigger story has gone unanswered, so I'm assuming you guys agree with me on that part.
Maybe I'm just not very good at looking further into a tv series.
Just going back to this, I agree that Nacho's change seems to have been quite sudden and, unlike with other changes, I don't feel like I've understood it. But then it happened during the montage that covered a number of months, so it wasn't sudden in character terms, we just don't (yet) know what happened during that period. There's another season where they may explore that a bit more, so I'm not jumping to judgement.
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Catching up, I'm at the 8th episode, the one with the road trip to Louisiana to deliver all the fake letters for Huell.
Damn, this was one of the best episodes of the season! it was surprising to see Kim in the end "breaking bad", you figure that Jimmy takes the Saul antics too far and Kim dumps him but no.... Jimmy wants to stop and Kim says "Let's do it again". It's the dark side of her that she always managed to keep at bay, but that is actually there, and literally turns her on.
I'm afraid this is now will be her undoing, not something Jimmy does - it's from the early episodes of the fiest season that one realizes that Kim isn't anywhere in Breaking Bad and that SOMETHING must happen, now I'm afraid she'll bring ruin unto herself.
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Aaaand I finally watched it all. Man, what a finale!
I'm glad I waited for the season to be over to watch it, because it slowed down considerably in the middle episodes (as pointed out previously) and only the excellent performances kept it from actually draggining. I hope also the storylines will converge because by now the show is basically 50% Better Call Saul and 50% Breaking Bad prequel, Jimmy and Mike had a single scene together in the whole season!
I never imagined I could feel so bad for the german engineer. Poor guy. His final scene was beautifully shot, with the New Mexico stars at night, it was almost poetic, he got a beautiful sendoff. And what a badass was Mike as he was dealing with Lalo, losing him in the parking spot (only for Lalo to brutally push away the car in front of him, lol).
As for Jimmy, I thought the "I start to read the letter and then I stop" was a stunt he pre-arranged with Kim, but it was actually him going off on his own. Kim had the "who is this person I'm talking to?" look on her face as he Saul Goodman-ed his way into the attorneys' office.
And for the comments about Better Call Saul being better than Breaking Bad... well, they're both great shows so it's glad that people love BCS that much, but I think that BCS is this great BECAUSE it came off Breaking Bad.
BB had to create its world, conquer his fans, find his way through unpredictable situations (Jesse was meant to be killed in season 1 and the writers strike prevented that, along with the writers falling in love with Aaron Paul's performance). Better Call Saul builds on the world Breaking Bad created, re-uses its characters and has the wisdom and knowledge of what works and what doesn't that BB couldn't afford.
In short, I think that calling BCS better than BB is not too much dissimilar from a situation when someone calls a cover song better than the original. Sure, there might be cover songs which are played tighter, better, with a more modern production if the original is old, and maybe the singer is even better than the original (basically any Black Sabbath cover :biggrin: ), but still, the original song is what was actually created and composed. It's easier to make a nice version of a great song someone else wrote than write it yourself. I will never be annoyed at any praise that BCS deservingly gets, and it's not a "cover" of BB, but it can exist BECAUSE of Breaking Bad. A new show about a sleazy lawyer starting from scratch with no one of the BB cast AND writing team would not go this far.
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^
Since there are no 'Like' buttons, I'm just commenting here to say that I really enjoyed reading the above.
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Watch Mike from ‘Better Call Saul’ in a bizarre 1980s motivational video https://dangerousminds.net/comments/watch_mike_from_better_call_saul_in_a_bizarre_1980s_motivational_video
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That was ... rather strange. I obviously did not watch all of it, but the few minutes I did see were very weird indeed.
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yeah the Mike and Gus Web Series videos are a hoot.
which btw, I was watching an episode of Deep Space 9 last night and who was in the guest cast, none other than Jonathan Banks. A few weeks back, I saw another episode with the actor who plays Tuco.
Breaking Deep Space Saul
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I certainly enjoyed the season, and it's still a top notch series, but I agree with Kev that this season was something of a letdown. I don't think it was really the absence of Chuck, though. They just took a different approach, I think. Lalo is an interesting guy, and I think he's going to be fantastic in season 5. My kind of badguy.
Yes indeed, I will scoff at that claim. ;)
A better ensemble of actors? Well, in the sense that Better Call Saul is more of an ensemble than a show with a true lead character (Odenkirk is a far better supporting actor than lead), it could be debatable, but pound for pound, BB wins easily, IMO. Not counting the characters who were on both shows (since that can be considered a wash), BB had Bryan Cranston, who gave what some, including both Anthony Hopkins and myself, would call the greatest acting performance ever. His performance alone elevates it. And then of course there is Aaron Paul, who was brilliant as well; I would say he was the 2nd best from either show, so already BB has, IMO, by far the top 2 performances from either show. Moving forward, I would say Anna Gunn and Rhea Seehorn were equally good, although I suspect many who disliked Skylar for some bizarre reason would not give Gunn props for her performance as a result. And let's not forget Dean Norris, who turned what could have been a stereotypical tough guy cop/DEA agent character into a complex one. Michael McKean was awesome as Chuck, and Michael Mando and Patrick Fabian are really good in their roles, but Breaking Bad just seemed filled with once in a lifetime performances in a once in a lifetime show.
I'm one of those people who hated Skylar, but that wouldn't have been the case if Gunn didn't do such a fine job with the character. I really dig Wexler, but not really because of Seehorn's portrayal (tight-fitting lawyer pants excepted). I generally agree with your assessment here, but I think McKean's performance is right up there with Walt and Jesse. I never felt particularly emotionally involved with Walt. Every week NcKean had me alternatively despising and empathizing with Chuck. Culminating with his death that hammered home that duality in a big, big way.
Howard looked like a total mess at the end, too. Did Kim scolding him mess him up that badly? Wow.
I was figuring on "wracked with guilt." He certainly blamed himself for Howard's death (as did I), and he handled the whole thing pretty poorly after the fact. I also gather he'd turned into a hapless drunk.
It's not just me, though! Several co-workers are totally bored with the show, to the point where one has all but given up on it, and the other takes the "I guess I'll watch it since I'm already invested" attitude. A friend texted me yesterday, "Wow, Saul kinda sucks now." And my cousin texted me the other day saying he and his wife finally started watching this season and are not liking it either. At this point, literally every single person I talk to on a somewhat regularly basis (at least) who watches the show is incredibly disappointed with it it.
Not just you. I was never bored with the show, but this season was definitely less than the previous 3. It wasn't bad, and it had scenes that rivaled any from the series, but overall it was slower and had less actual content. Even the ending was a letdown for me. I know everybody has been waiting for the "Transformation," and there you got it. To me it was nothing more than the DBA he requested from the woman.
The Babineaux thing was...quite funny, but very improbable. Why would Kim even want to start helping Jimmy for keeping Huell out of jil? She has basically no interest whatsoever. Huell is a minor character and pretty much a nobody at best, so for her to get into serious trouble over this makes no sense at all to me. The stint they (Kim & Jimmy) pulled was pretty good though, but Kim saying 'Let's do it again' at the end has me worried for her. Saul's going to drag her down with him, which is not what I would like to see.
The girl's an adrenaline junky and never knew it. Danger turns her on (literally). I never really had much question about her motivation, which started as soon as she became Giselle. We see it reflected in her growing boredom with the law. As Judge Neelix pointed out she's looking for something to restore her passion in it. Working PD certainly helps, but working the system has a better payoff.
It hadn't occurred to me until now, but Giselle is Saul. While people have been clamoring for some mystical transformation from Jimmy to Saul, it's Kim who's undergoing the transformation from good girl to criminal lawyer.
At this point, I will be shocked if we do not see Kim in Jimmy's post-BB life. Heck, she could have been in his life the whole time during BB; it's not like they ever showed any aspect of Saul's personal life.
This was my prediction from the get-go. There's a reason he went to Omaha. I'm hoping she just randomly decides she wants a cinnamon roll. He'd have one helluva story to tell her.
Now, it's clear that Werner didn't know the full scope of who and what he was dealing with, otherwise Mike's original warning (after he shot his mouth off in the bar) would have sunk in and stuck.
Yep. I felt bad for Werner, as in the end he was simply naive. He really didn't understand who he was dealing with.
Mike choosing to do it himself was his way of letting Werner go out with a quick death, instead of Gus' guys doing it (and that would not have been quick).
That was part of it. I think Mike was accepting responsibility. He liked Werner, he was a good guy, so while giving him a quick out was certainly one aspect, penance was another, and being the responsible party was a third.
yeah the Mike and Gus Web Series videos are a hoot.
which btw, I was watching an episode of Deep Space 9 last night and who was in the guest cast, none other than Jonathan Banks. A few weeks back, I saw another episode with the actor who plays Tuco.
Breaking Deep Space Saul
Never made either of those connections. With Banks I just don't recall the episode well. Not one I've seen in ages. As for Tuco, I never made the connection, but as soon as you mentioned it I thought there was really only one episode he would have fit into, and I was right.
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Bump!
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/better-call-saul-end-season-6-star-says-1203797
Looks like BCS is going to end after season 6. I expected season 5 to be the last season (just my gut feeling) so this is pleasant news. Assuming season 5 airs early 2020, we could be looking at the show wrapping up at the end of 2021.
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As long as that's what the writers realize the story needs to be properly and organically told, I'm all for it.
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As long as that's what the writers realize the story needs to be properly and organically told, I'm all for it.
Yeah....I’ll trust them. They’ve done nothing to make me doubt their vision for the story.
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Same here, all 4 seasons of the show has been amazing so far and in fact get better each year. I think season 4 was probably my favorite so far. The world of Gus & Mike along with Saul has been a concoction of awesomeness.
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bump.
Season 5 Premieres Sunday 2/23/20
https://twitter.com/ltsSaulGoodman/status/1197319170251264000
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Shit! That's great!!!
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Jimmy finally makes the decision that changes everything — to practice law as "Saul Goodman." And this decision will soon create unexpected and profound waves of change for everyone in his world.
@BetterCallSaul
Season 5 returns for a 2-night premiere 2/23 & 2/24
https://twitter.com/ltsSaulGoodman/status/1197374950899888128
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BTW, if you are in the US, call to the phone number that's on Saul biz card.
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Teaser
https://twitter.com/BreakingBad/status/1215040131163459585
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Hank comes back for Season 5, as well as Ed (the late Robert Forster)
https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/16/better-call-saul-season-5-robert-forster-dean-norris/?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=social-button-sharing
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Is there talks about season 5 being the last one?
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Is there talks about season 5 being the last one?
Off the top of my head I remember reading somewhere and sometime that they knew they were gonna finish with season 6.
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Yep, it was confirmed that there will be a Season 6 and that it will be the final season.
I find it strange that they announced that Dean Norris and Robert Forster would be making appearances in Season 5. Would have been a lot cooler to see them show up suddenly, to where as now we know we are going to see them at some point, so the surprise factor is gone. Maybe they are trying to get some buzz going given that it's been like 8 years since the last season. :lol :lol
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Yeah I'm kind of bummed that was spoiled for me, and I have gone out of my way not to read up details on the season. Oh well.
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Indeed. It's not that the show sucks and they need to desperately convince people to give it another shot by name-dropping BB actors.
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Perhaps, but I am sure by now they are aware that the buzz around the show isn't nearly what they hoped it would be. Coming off of the success of Breaking Bad, it's like coming out at halftime in football with a 21-0 lead, and while I can't say they fumbled the lead away, they sure haven't taken advantage of it. I have no idea what the ratings are, but of the dozen or so people I know (family, friends, co-workers) who were all-in on it at the start, about half have given up watching it because they were so bored by it, and the other half have the stance I do, in that it isn't that great, but we are too invested to stop now. With only two seasons left, might as well watch till the end.
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BCS is as every bit as good as BB.....just as well written......personally I like it better than BB as I’m more impressed by this casts acting than the whole of BB’s
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I dunno what the general consensus on this show is 'cause at least online the reviews and buzz are pretty good... I personally think it's just as good as BB in a lot of ways. It's a different animal, though. It's much more of a slow burn. Regardless of how much the masses enjoy it, I think it's fantastic.
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Is there talks about season 5 being the last one?
https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/16/better-call-saul-renewed-sixth-final-season/
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quC2GkURViU
So fucking excited!!!
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mqo1nuDee0
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So, I'm a couple episodes into season 4. This show has gotten better with each passing season. I love how it's kind of transitioned into a Breaking Bad prequel. I mean, I guess it was like that being Saul and all, but seeing the early stuff with Gus and the Salamancas has been awesome. I didn't think we'd get so deep into that story. I have no complaints.
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So, I'm a couple episodes into season 4. This show has gotten better with each passing season. I love how it's kind of transitioned into a Breaking Bad prequel. I mean, I guess it was like that being Saul and all, but seeing the early stuff with Gus and the Salamancas has been awesome. I didn't think we'd get so deep into that story. I have no complaints.
I need to brush up on season 4 before season 5 starts. Has it hit Netflix yet?
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Yeah, that's how I've been watching it.
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Awesome, about time... tonight just got a little more fun
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TOMORROW!!!
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I finished season 4 last night. What an awesome show. I loved the whole meth lab arch. Is there a streaming service that will have the newest episodes?
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I finished season 4 last night. What an awesome show. I loved the whole meth lab arch. Is there a streaming service that will have the newest episodes?
From Google:
"HOW TO WATCH BETTER CALL SAUL SEASON 5 ONLINE: If you're looking to watch Better Call Saul live, you can find an AMC live stream with a valid subscription to fuboTV, Philo, YouTube TV, and Sling TV. New episodes will also be available for next-day streaming on AMC's website and the AMC app"
So unfortunately it's still a pain in the ass. Netflix probably won't get season 5 for another year and a half til season 6 gets ready to start which is absurd. I used AMC's live feature on their website to watch when they premiered, until they disabled it about 2 episodes before the end of season 4.
Guess I'll be watching the premiere tomorrow via AMC's website (you can watch the day after the premiere there).
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enjoyed among others things. the extensive opening scene/segment.
RIP Robert Forster.
Also MIKE!
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:tup
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Solid right out of the gate :metal
And yes.....that extended opening clip.....so nice
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Solid right out of the gate :metal
And yes.....that extended opening clip.....so nice
:metal
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Very good. Can't wait for the next already.
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The Gene scene at the beginning was great, so of course they probably get back to that until the next season. :lol :lol
Overall, a very good episode. I am bored with most Jimmy scenes at this point, but want to see what happens with Kim, and how this plays out with Mike and Gus should be good given that we know the nature of their working relationship by the time they get to the BB years.
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Nacho's a badass
also I could not help but crack up seeing that Realtor's expression after they walked out the door! :D
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I'm digging the first two episodes so far.
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I'm digging the first two episodes so far.
Totally forgot it was a two night kick off. I’m upset I forgot yet happy I now get to watch another episode. :lol
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Wow, I didn't know that either. I will watch.
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Watched both new episodes this evening. Man, it feels like forever since Saul was on! That was a great two hours for me. Nacho is a total badass. I love how Jimmy has fully embraced the Saul personality now. Feels great to have it back!
I was a little annoyed when I started episode 1. On AMC's player, it said it was an hour and 45 minutes long. I couldn't believe it, nearly a two-hour premier and then a second episode! Three hours of Saul! Except... they just bundled an episode of some other show along with it. Way to blue balls me, AMC. Serves me right for being naive though I suppose :facepalm: :lol
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I miss so much of the fun of the first couple of seasons. Certainly getting 'darker', but it is quite the improvement from last year. More scenes, and much more dialogue.
Damn, only seven episodes left :'(
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The Jimmy/Kim-together scenes continue to be boring as hell, but everything else was really good again.
The early scene with Nacho and Lalo was really the first time it seemed like Jimmy was all Saul, rather than Jimmy acting like Saul, if that makes sense. Even the many scenes so far where Jimmy is Saul the "criminal" lawyer, it still feels like he is just as much Jimmy McGill as Saul Goodman.
Cool to see Hank and Gomez again, although given that reports are that last night and next week's episode will be it for them, it feels a bit like window dressing and fan service.
Cannot recall if this has been discussed, but for all of the talk about the drinking problem Mike has, it will be interesting to see where he licks it, since he seems to have no problem when drinking booze in BB. Remember that he was in a bar drinking with no problem early in Season 4 of BB when Walt showed up and tried to float the idea of offing Gus which lead to Mike punching hit and kicking him a few times.
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Jimmy and Kim....I'm totally opposite. I 'love' this couple. We all know the relationship is building up to something bad, and they are taking their time to show all the ups and downs and the background that will lead to its eventual (sad) ending.
Kind of like the ants and the ice cream cone at the beginning of this episode. The simple joy and optimism of beginning life anew as Saul ended and disappeared during that car ride.
Just wish AMC would show the prior episodes just before the new ones :angry:
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I agree with DragonAttack; the Jimmy and Kim scenes are great. I really dig them as individual characters but also as a couple.
I thought the new episode was great. Love the cinematography of the ants in the beginning. Still chewing on that visual metaphor. Loved seeing Hank and Gomez. Lalo is growing on me big time. He's charismatic and I just don't know if I love or hate him. It's so fun watching Saul get his feet wet and how he's working up to the point where he unceremoniously bursts into the room and takes over the conversation with gusto.
Also, can we talk about Kim's sob story to the old man? What do people think - was she being genuine (in other words, that's a real story from her childhood) or was she trying (and failed) to channel Jimmy's schtick? And if the latter, why did she fail? Is it because she doesn't see the person she's talking to for who they really are, or because she doesn't genuinely believe in what she's doing, or is it because she hasn't fully accepted the moral ambiguity of what she's doing the way Jimmy has, so she can't close the deal? I think that whole bit was fantastic, from her first encounter to her second attempt and then coming back to wordlessly smash beer bottles. Very human scenes no matter what the deal is, imo.
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I took her story to the old man at face value. Doesn't make sense to me for it it be a con if there's no way of us knowing that it was a con.
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I took her story to the old man at face value. Doesn't make sense to me for it it be a con if there's no way of us knowing that it was a con.
I think that's the beauty of it. You can make a case for it being sincere or it being a con. Maybe the reason the symbolism of her being uneasy with the beer bottle on the railing at the beginning of the episode and then throwing it off at the end is because she tried to con the guy and failed. Or, it's because she was sincere...he didn't believe her....so now she's like 'F' it.....
The difference between Jimmy/Saul conning someone and Kim is that we know 98% of what Jimmy/Saul is doing is a con to some degree. Kim, she's near impossible to read. And, I'm digging the Jimmy/Kim scenes as well. The slow deterioration of their relationship is brutal to watch. Especially when you know Jimmy can sense it yet despite that he's continuing down the Saul path.
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When Mike was at the bar and insisted the bartender remove a picture/post card from the wall. Was there some story about that picture or was Mike just being Mike drunk.
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When Mike was at the bar and insisted the bartender remove a picture/post card from the wall. Was there some story about that picture or was Mike just being Mike drunk.
I can't recall completely....but I want to say the German builder he offed last season had something to do with that building. I think it was the Sydney Opera house in the pic
****edit****
yep...just found this online:
The image of the opera house is a visual callback to a conversation that Mike had with Ziegler before the hit — one in which Ziegler revealed that his father was one of the engineers behind the famous landmark's construction. The sight of the postcard stirs Mike's guilt over the assassination
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More people need to be talking about this season. It's so good but I forgot it came on last night so I'm catching up now. I usually have to catch it the next day anyway but I hadn't even thought about it all day. Here goes! :corn
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I think the fact that it is not getting talked about a lot says it all.
I feel like I continue to be too negative, but I am in it till the end despite being bored out of my mind at times, like with last night's episode. This show always builds way too slowly, and the payoffs are rarely worth it. It's like TV blue balls. :lol :lol
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I think the fact that it is not getting talked about a lot says it all.
But I think it's to the 'good' side of the spectrum. It's how I felt with 'Mr. Robot'. We talked about that show in the thread a bit but for the most part it was just such a good show and so well done that you are kind of just in 'awe' a bit. Like....unable to talk about it. It's so layered and so well constructed that it's near impossible to 'get' it all at once.
I love how Mike intentionally walked the same route again just to get his butt whooped....maybe even wanting to be killed? I'm fearful of where Kim's heading because unlike Jimmy....she's betraying her nature as she looks to use 'alternate' methods to get what she wants. It's tough to speculate why we don't see her in BB....she may not be dead but I get the feeling her story doesn't end well.
It's interesting to see Fring so flustered....although you know he has a plan.
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Kim and Howard :D
https://twitter.com/BetterCallSaul/status/1237528690830917632
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I think the fact that it is not getting talked about a lot says it all.
I feel like I continue to be too negative, but I am in it till the end despite being bored out of my mind at times, like with last night's episode. This show always builds way too slowly, and the payoffs are rarely worth it. It's like TV blue balls. :lol :lol
Respectfully, I can't disagree with this post more. It constantly gets critical acclaim, and it's the third highest rated show on AMC behind the TWD shows. https://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/amc-network-tv-show-ratings-33643/ Plus it's been nominated for tons of awards and won plenty.
(Also I don't really think anybody ever talks about AMC other than The Walking Dead, Mad Men, or Breaking Bad, and two of those have ended and the other is somehow still going 10 seasons in, so at least it's not tanking)
I think the payoffs are always worth it personally. The slow burn is wonderful. I think it's a shame you aren't all that excited by it but I'm happy you're still watching. :)
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BCS is even more of the ...'put the ribs in the smoker, and let 'em cook for twelve hours' instead of the microwaved burger....compared to BB. I expect the slow satisfaction.
Last week was a great episode. Even more fan service. My wife and I are now doing shots of Dos Hombres tequilla in our Twisters cups before each episode.
There are fewer people on the board than when BB was around, thus the fewer comments.
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Respectfully, I can't disagree with this post more. It constantly gets critical acclaim, and it's the third highest rated show on AMC behind the TWD shows. https://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/amc-network-tv-show-ratings-33643/ Plus it's been nominated for tons of awards and won plenty.
(Also I don't really think anybody ever talks about AMC other than The Walking Dead, Mad Men, or Breaking Bad, and two of those have ended and the other is somehow still going 10 seasons in, so at least it's not tanking)
I think the payoffs are always worth it personally. The slow burn is wonderful. I think it's a shame you aren't all that excited by it but I'm happy you're still watching. :)
With all due respect, critical acclaim means nothing to me. ;)
What awards has it won? I am genuinely asking because I know it has been nominated for a few Emmys over the years, but I don't recall any winning. I will say that the fact that Michael McKean was never nominated for Best Supporting Actor for any of the first three seasons (before his character's death) was an utter travesty. The acting and cinematography and whatnot are all top notch on this show, no doubt about it. The storytelling is just too slow and plodding.
There are fewer people on the board than when BB was around, thus the fewer comments.
I am pretty sure there is a reason for that. Call it anecdotal, but the majority of family members/friends/co-workers who started the show from the start (all of whom were huge BB fans) have stopped watching it altogether because they were so bored with it, and those who are still watching are like me in that they are gutting it out till the end because they are so invested at this point.
It's not a bad show by any means; it's just not a great one.
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I'll stay firmly in the camp of BCS is just as good if not better than BB. They're two different types of shows. BB needed the intensity and weekly anxiety of Walt's story. BCS is just beautiful storytelling with some incredible acting.
I've enjoyed the heck out of BCS......and love BB as well.
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I'm in the camp of BCS being better than BB. I get that there was more tension in BB, which is possibly what made it more exciting and warranted more discussion/speculation, but I never much liked Walter and so his downfall just didn't have much emotional resonance with me. BCS may not have the same high points but I find it much more consistently engaging.
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I'm in the camp of BCS being better than BB. I get that there was more tension in BB, which is possibly what made it more exciting and warranted more discussion/speculation, but I never much liked Walter and so his downfall just didn't have much emotional resonance with me. BCS may not have the same high points but I find it much more consistently engaging.
Yeah....that's pretty much what I was trying to say also. There HAD to be tension/drama etc etc with BB given the story that was being told. And, I'm the same way....i was never drawn to Walt as a character. I thought he was a selfish dick. At first I 'kind' of got it and sympathized a bit but once he chose to turn down the offer to go back to work for Grey Matter Technologies strictly based off of his massive ego.....i was pretty much done with him as a character and enjoyed watching his world crumble around him. It was just a shame he took so many down with him.
BCS is telling a similar story with Jimmy....but, in a much more apathetic way.....where I feel more sorry for Jimmy than anything. While I know his nature has always been to take the 'easy' way out or to hustle his way into getting what he wants......at least there's been some set up as to why he is the way he is. I don't know, I just think the storytelling is beautiful in BCS.
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What about the offer to work with Howard Hamlin?
Do you think Howard is setting something up to screw Jimmy?
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What about the offer to work with Howard Hamlin?
Do you think Howard is setting something up to screw Jimmy?
It’s awfully tough to think he made that offer for the reasons he stated. I think Jimmy sees through it also.
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I'm all caught up with the season. I'm absolutely loving it. I know I've mentioned it feeling more like an intro to Breaking Bad rather than a spin off, but I can't get enough of it. It's so well done, and nothing feels cheap or forced despite so many of the Breaking Bad cast making appearances.
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I'm all caught up with the season. I'm absolutely loving it. I know I've mentioned it feeling more like an intro to Breaking Bad rather than a spin off, but I can't get enough of it. It's so well done, and nothing feels cheap or forced despite so many of the Breaking Bad cast making appearances.
They’ve done a fantastic job of making the BB characters and their individual stories not feel like a cheap trick....or like you said, they aren’t forced. Everyone ‘fits’ into the story being told naturally.
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There was one thing that me and my dad didn't quite understand and I had to look it up to figure it out. It's Gus's behavior to his employee in the last episode. We just couldn't figure out why Gus kept making the kid scrub the fryers clean. According to the Wikipedia summary, it was literally just Gus taking out his frustration on him (the frustration at his hand being forced to fork over just shy of a million bucks to the DEA because of Saul's guy). That's kinda weird to me, I was thinking Gus was keeping him there as distraction for some big climax that we'd maybe get... but nope.
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I wondered if Gus's behaviour might have been to ensure he had an alibi while also being able to keep abreast of what was happening.
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I wondered if Gus's behaviour might have been to ensure he had an alibi while also being able to keep abreast of what was happening.
Oh man, I hadn't even thought of that. That's great. I told that to my old man and he thinks that's a possibility too, and Lyle (the kid) would've been his witness. Now I feel stupid for not getting that as I was watching.
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I wondered if Gus's behaviour might have been to ensure he had an alibi while also being able to keep abreast of what was happening.
This is what I thought.
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I think we witnessed the beginning of the end for Kim tonight. And, all Jimmy had to do was keep his mouth shut and ever mention the other ‘option’
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My reactions to this show are so bipolar. :lol :lol
Last week's episode bored me to death, while I thought last night's was great.
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I think we witnessed the beginning of the end for Kim tonight. And, all Jimmy had to do was keep his mouth shut and ever mention the other ‘option’
Totally. Kim unfortunately didn't anticipate her boss's tenacity and now she's in deep. Next week's episode is gonna be a good one.
My reactions to this show are so bipolar. :lol :lol
Last week's episode bored me to death, while I thought last night's was great.
I love how comfortable Jimmy has become with playing Saul. They're almost one and the same now.
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I'm not eloquent enough to get into detail but I absolutely love this show. Very different but as good as BB for me, and remarkable for following that show and becoming its own special thing.
Jimmy and Kim are incredible together and the key special part to this show for me is the acting, pace and under statement. I could watch Kim silently mull something over or internally react to someone all night. The slowness and intensity is so unusual and just reeks of class.
I have no idea what Howard is doing but love watching him too.
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It was nice to escape for an hour plus on Monday.
Howard is still....Howard. The semi likeable semi antagonist, who did take Jimmy's words to heart last year and quit feeling sorry for himself. Still don't know if he is married, divorced, gay, asexual..... There has to be something from the past that could bite HHM in the future, where for some reason he needs Jimmy's help. Or he wants to set him up in a bad way.
Kim......absolutely no idea why she went all 'Gisele' with the lead partner out in the hallway. She's always been the 'smart' one, but that move certainly was not. We paused and saw the picture that made her smile, but we couldn't exactly tell what IT was that caused the 'aha' moment.
Mike is still the happiest while working with his hands fixing something.
Gus is now plainly unhappy with everything, except for revenge.
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That ending was quite the surprise. Thought Kim was going to grab her cello (if she still has it) and walk out the door.
This was a 'top ten' episode.
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Fantastic episode
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Another solid one in the books.
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Last episode was pure gold.
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Finally saw it.
Jesus, Jimmy, what were you thinking. Oh my god.
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Really good episode, yes.
I got the impression that Kim was pissed more about Jimmy not telling her what he was going to do, rather than what he actually did.
I guess Mike is on Gus' side again, eh? All it took was "revenge," and Mike is over the Werner thing? Okay.
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I think Mike is actually afraid of Gus. Mike knows everything that went into the meth lab. If he were to say no to Gus, he'd probably be toast.
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Eh, Mike doesn't strike me as someone who operates out of fear. Shoot, he was ready for those gang bangers to kill him before the beatdown was presumably stopped by Gus' men and he was then moved to Mexico to recover. My guess is that Gus sold him on that idea that Lalo was the reason for the extra pressure that put Gus in the position where he had no choice but to order Werner's death, Mike bought it, and he is now out for revenge against Lalo.
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Good episode, but I have more than a minor quibble.
They made a point on numerous occasions on Breaking Bad to demonstrate what a careful man Gus is. And they have now obliterated that concept on Better Call Saul. He is a "careful man," yet he not only participates in setting the the fire at Los Pollos Hermonos, but is getting into his car 100 feet away, where witnesses could have easily seen him, as it explodes? I am sorry, but there is no way that fits what we know about Gus' character.
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Good episode, but I have more than a minor quibble.
They made a point on numerous occasions on Breaking Bad to demonstrate what a careful man Gus is. And they have now obliterated that concept on Better Call Saul. He is a "careful man," yet he not only participates in setting the the fire at Los Pollos Hermonos, but is getting into his car 100 feet away, where witnesses could have easily seen him, as it explodes? I am sorry, but there is no way that fits what we know about Gus' character.
Maybe he wasn't like that at this stage, but got more like that later?
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More comments later, but what a frickin' great episode!
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More comments later, but what a frickin' great episode!
Agree!!!
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Good episode, but I have more than a minor quibble.
They made a point on numerous occasions on Breaking Bad to demonstrate what a careful man Gus is. And they have now obliterated that concept on Better Call Saul. He is a "careful man," yet he not only participates in setting the the fire at Los Pollos Hermonos, but is getting into his car 100 feet away, where witnesses could have easily seen him, as it explodes? I am sorry, but there is no way that fits what we know about Gus' character.
Maybe he wasn't like that at this stage, but got more like that later?
This is more where my thinking is. It's definitely possible this was just an oversight by the production team, but they've been setting up how Fring's character is developing to end up where he is in BB, so I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt on this point.
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Everybody has a slip up at some point in their career. Could this be Fring's moment? Maybe he gets caught and needs Saul?
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I don't think here is any chance of that. He would have then been on the radar of the feds from that point forward, and as we saw in BB, he never was until Hank made the Gale/Gus connection. Plus, when Saul first told Walt about having a possible connection who would buy his blue in bulk, he had no idea who Gus even was; he simply knew "a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy....who knows another guy."
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I don't think what Gus did was all that out of character. It's his restaurant......he knows it has to be blown up to make Salamanca think he's still in the dark.....it's already been shown how meticulous he is so I think it's right in line for his character to want to be the one who 'does the job'. Notice, he just had Nacho breaking and vandalizing......Gus took the task of blowing up his store. He wanted it done....and he wanted it done right.
As far as walking to the car and maybe being seen....I'm sure that he had zero concerns about that. Probably wasn't even 'his' vehicle and should a witness have arose do you think that witness would have lived for long?
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^
This, and I thought of it as fan service as well.
We all remember what happened the last time he was near an explosion.......
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I've had p*ss warm beers before, but.........
Intense, but rather unsatisfying episode.
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Call me a spoil sport again, but after a great first half of an episode, the second half really dragged. Did we really need to see them walking around the desert for that long? I think, given the fact that we know Mike and Saul are going to be just fine, it didn't need to get stretched out for as long as it did. But hey, at least the storyline is getting somewhere now. :lol
On another note, Kim is f'd now. Like Mike said, she's in the game now, and showing her face to Lalo will likely end up being a tragic mistake.
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I've had p*ss warm beers before, but.........
I’ve drank my own urine. But it was on the rocks....still tasted bad though.
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One of the best episodes of the show. :metal
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Kim's gonna get whacked? Right?
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Kim's gonna get whacked? Right?
I've predicted for years now that she's gonna get offed due to Jimmy's shenanigans.
It might be the first time I'm right so long in advance, so that's cool. :lol
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Kim's gonna get whacked? Right?
I've predicted for years now that she's gonna get offed due to Jimmy's shenanigans.
It might be the first time I'm right so long in advance, so that's cool. :lol
I still think she will end up going to prison for something that Jimmy gets her involved in....some sort of illegal tactic as a lawyer that she gets nailed on. But, the chance she gets killed is just as good as her going to jail.
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To me, the most intriguing question is this: who instructed those guys to pull Saul over, take the money and kill him?
We know it wasn't Gus, as Mike would know about it and then wouldn't kill them all.
If it was Lalo, it seems odd that he would have the cousins make the hand-off and then have another group of men pull Saul over, take the money, and then kill him (which was the intention before Mike made the save). Plus, if it was Lalo, he and the rest of the Salamanca crew would go ape shit once they found out that their men were killed and that the lawyer still has the money. That would put the nail in the coffin of both Saul and Kim, and we know Saul isn't going anywhere.
Could Nacho have been behind it? Not sure what his end game would be, though, and it would seem odd for him to have ordered the move and the execution of Saul.
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Is it possible that Nacho didn't know Saul was the bag man?
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Actually, I forgot about the cold opening, where a guy in the warehouse called someone on the phone after seeing the cousins leaving with the money and asked if they were still interested, so it could simply have been a case of one of the Salamancas lackeys going rogue and looking for a quick score.
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Yeah, who's behind the 'stick up' has zero ideas from me. Also, what has to be the show's weakest plot point ever.....how does Mike stay out of view for all those miles, and know exactly where they are going to strike?
I wouldn't have minded the desert scene if there were twelve episodes, as opposed to ten.
As to Kim....they'll need someone else to play the role now, or hint at his existence, but I'm hoping that the worst she'll face is a visit to the vacuum cleaner.
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SPOILER ALERT
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Last 2 chapter titles are:
"Bad choice road"
"Something unforgivable"
Nothing good is gonna happen
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That episode ruled. Sad there's only 2 more episodes. This has been another great season.
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There's another season after this one, right?
I hope we don't get something lame like Saul throwing Kim under the bus to keep her safe from the cartel.
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I believe they have said that the next season will be the last.
The more I think about it, the more I think Kim survives the series somehow. I think the writers realize it would be a bad and unrealistic look for Saul to have been so jovial and jokey for much of BB after seeing Kim die, so I think they will find a way for her to live. Saul doesn't know yet about the existence of Ed (the vacuum cleaner guy), but maybe they will show us how he comes to find out about him, and Kim will vanish. Granted, we won't see Ed again since Robert Forrester is no longer with us, but they could still find a clever way to do it. And maybe we see that Saul is so overly worried about being recognized in the black and white flash forwards because it could mean Kim getting discovered as well.
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Kev, that makes perfect sense. Never thought about that. It is a damn shame Robert Forrester passed, as well.
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Just read a couple of reviews for S5 Ep 8.....Mike had a GPS in Saul's gas cap. I guess I get a :facepalm: for forgetting that.
I read a lot of positive reviews for this episode. Indeed, a comparison to the BB of Walt and Jesse being stuck in the desert was a given. It took them eighteen days to film this episode with Vince at the helms (as opposed to the normal nine days). I did love the directing, loved how Saul cringed at the sight of the space blanket.
But.....we knew both Saul and Mike would live (or should I put 'spoiler alert' above that line ;))
I've had p*ss warm beers before, but.........
I’ve drank my own urine. But it was on the rocks....still tasted bad though.
:rollin
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Just read a couple of reviews for S5 Ep 8.....Mike had a GPS in Saul's gas cap. I guess I get a :facepalm: for forgetting that.
I read a lot of positive reviews for this episode. Indeed, a comparison to the BB of Walt and Jesse being stuck in the desert was a given. It took them eighteen days to film this episode with Vince at the helms (as opposed to the normal nine days). I did love the directing, loved how Saul cringed at the sight of the space blanket.
But.....we knew both Saul and Mike would live (or should I put 'spoiler alert' above that line ;))
I've had p*ss warm beers before, but.........
I’ve drank my own urine. But it was on the rocks....still tasted bad though.
:rollin
https://www.facebook.com/juanmpe88/videos/10158518356792189
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Ah, the fuel cap. I was wondering why he took it before trashing the Esteem.
I think Kim will just not want anything to do with Jimmy at the end. But maybe I'm just hoping it's that as i don't want anything worse to happen to her.
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I have finally caught up with all the episodes and this season is just unbelievable so far. I mean sure the breaking bad world is merging, but they've been doing such an incredible job of getting these amazing character beats throughout. Lalo is so charismatic, I love the actor playing him. And hands down my favorite side character is the old guy playing Mr. Acker. His line describing the picture he's given had me laughing so hard. I love these typical 'Saul' bits throughout the season and is really the best thing about this show.
After this season, something tells me the wait for the final season will be quite a bit and maybe mid 2022. At least it will be 13 episodes as opposed to the regular 10.
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Took me 4 years and a pandemic to finally gear up and finish watching Breaking Bad. I started in 2016 and was very reluctant to come back to the show after watching each season, something just didn't click with me.
Started watching this show a week ago and liked it so much I binge-watched it and now I'm caught up. I won't argue which show is better but BCS is definitely more up my alley. Can't wait for the remaining two episodes to air.
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Why isn't episode 9 available to stream on AMC's website yet?
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New episode airs tonight so it should be available later.
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Gotcha. For some reason I thought it was on on Sundays.
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I'll need two hours to come down from episode 9.
I think Rhea Seehorn will get her Emmy nomination for this one.
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Holy shit what an episode. I did NOT see that ending coming! It's possibly the best episode of the series so far.
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Wow, that ending was tense.
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Yep, that was a really good episode. Kim going off like that was something else, but I shudder to think of what plans are now in Lalo's head.
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Wow, you guys have me hyped for viewing it tonight!
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Freaking amazin episode!
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Yep, that was a really good episode. Kim going off like that was something else, but I shudder to think of what plans are now in Lalo's head.
SPOILERS:
I was sure that Lalo was going to try and shoot them......and then Mike was going to waste Lalo.
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Yep, that was a really good episode. Kim going off like that was something else, but I shudder to think of what plans are now in Lalo's head.
SPOILERS:
I was sure that Lalo was going to try and shoot them......and then Mike was going to waste Lalo.
My money was on a round through the fish tank as a scare tactic.
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Yep, that was a really good episode. Kim going off like that was something else, but I shudder to think of what plans are now in Lalo's head.
SPOILERS:
I was sure that Lalo was going to try and shoot them......and then Mike was going to waste Lalo.
My money was on a round through the fish tank as a scare tactic.
I was even thinking that since Kim was so close to him and 'in' Mike's shot.....that Lalo was going to shoot/kill Kim.....she'd fall.....then right before he shot Jimmy Mike would have shot Lalo. The way they built the suspense in that scene was incredible.
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I think this show along with Breaking Bad has always been amazing in subverting expectations. They set up the scenes with the most obvious conclusions you'd think and sometimes they just go in another direction.
The beauty of this show (and BB) to me is how they film such mundane things like getting coffee or counting money and yet make it so entertaining to watch. Those sequences have payoffs or sometimes they don't but at that point you don't care because of how much joy you get from watching it.
That's why these two shows are on a whole another level.
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After Mike's conversation with Gus about Nacho.....I'm not feeling a 'happy ending' for Nacho or his family. Doesn't seem like Gus is to keen on giving up one of his assets and if he had to it's not going to be a 'thanks, have a nice life...see ya' around'. Nacho is F'd.
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Yep, that was a really good episode. Kim going off like that was something else, but I shudder to think of what plans are now in Lalo's head.
SPOILERS:
I was sure that Lalo was going to try and shoot them......and then Mike was going to waste Lalo.
My money was on a round through the fish tank as a scare tactic.
I was even thinking that since Kim was so close to him and 'in' Mike's shot.....that Lalo was going to shoot/kill Kim.....she'd fall.....then right before he shot Jimmy Mike would have shot Lalo. The way they built the suspense in that scene was incredible.
Pretty sure they did that intentionally to build the tension, and bloody hell was it tense!
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So tense. I think i held my breath for a full minute!
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Oh man that was intense! :corn
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I have to admit that I chuckled at a friend's text today that basically said, "In true Better Call Saul fasion, they have an awesome, intense scene where inevitably, nothing happens again!" :lol This is one of several friends whose main complaint is that the show too often is all build-up and little payoff. Not saying I agree about the assessment in regards to last night, but it did make me laugh.
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What an episode.
Kim's a dead woman.
Tony Dalton (the guy who plays Lalo) is an awesome actor and has become one of my favorite characters in this show.
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Is it possible Kim disappears via the vacuum guy? They've got the cash now to make that happen.
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Is it possible Kim disappears via the vacuum guy? They've got the cash now to make that happen.
That's possible, yeah, assuming he's in business at this point in that world. Did they ever say how much cash he actually got from the remainder of the bail money? I'm thinking back to the massive bag of cash Jesse and Walt both had to haul, and it didn't look like there was nearly that much money in Saul's bag. Could be wrong though, they were stacks of 100s after all.
I'm wondering now if Vince Gilligan and co. planned to have him in the final season, actually, before he passed. I would love to know when the show wraps what the behind-the-scenes intent was; surely he was on their minds to some degree, especially with how Kim handled herself toward Lalo.
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Saul's cut was supposed to be 100k. I'd assume that's how much cash was in the bag.
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Saul's cut was supposed to be 100k. I'd assume that's how much cash was in the bag.
Ahh, thank you. Some quick Googling tells me Ed charged 125k for a pickup... so I could totally see that happening.
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I guess it all depends on if Kim is a "high risk client who needs the deluxe package." :lol :lol
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(https://i.ibb.co/6RQszTw/Capture.png)
That reference scares me
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I finally caught up with this entire season in order to be in time for the finale come Monday. I basically watched all of it in the past week. What a fantastic season this has been so far, but Episode 9 was truly out of this world. I think it might beat 'Chicanery' for the best episode of the entire show so far.
A lot is going to happen in the final episode - already stoked to watch it in a few days - and I think by the end of this series, Nacho, Lalo and Kim aren't going to be around. Kim can get the vacuum treatment, sure, because Jimmy will be asking Mike for advice how to get her out. Her leaving her job is too much of a coincidence in that sense, obviously that would make her disappearance easier.
Lalo is probably going to be toast back in Mexico. Some shit is going to hit the fan there. My bet is that Don Eladio set up the money pick-up to fail, because he doesn't want Lalo back in Mexico (for reasons we don't know) and Lalo is going to see if he can get answers there and probably not accept those answers. Thing is though, Kim was absolutely spot on with her assessment of Lalo - he doesn't have anybody to trust at this point for whatever reason. I don't think Lalo believed Jimmy & Kim, but he has nothing to gain by asking them, so he actually made the smarter move of simply leaving.
Nacho - not sure how it's going to happen, but he's set up for failure at some point. He may stick around for another season.
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Is it possible Kim disappears via the vacuum guy? They've got the cash now to make that happen.
That's possible, yeah, assuming he's in business at this point in that world. Did they ever say how much cash he actually got from the remainder of the bail money? I'm thinking back to the massive bag of cash Jesse and Walt both had to haul, and it didn't look like there was nearly that much money in Saul's bag. Could be wrong though, they were stacks of 100s after all.
I'm wondering now if Vince Gilligan and co. planned to have him in the final season, actually, before he passed. I would love to know when the show wraps what the behind-the-scenes intent was; surely he was on their minds to some degree, especially with how Kim handled herself toward Lalo.
they may have brought it up on the Insider Podcast (I haven't heard this one, nor the last 4 or 5 episodes yet, I'm way behind since the Quarantine started).
https://podbay.fm/podcast/966297954/e/1586880000
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Made the mistake of watching the final scene of S5-9 with Lalo in the apartment before watching the season finale. I am worn out.
Kev, the ".....awesome, intense scene where inevitably, nothing happens again!" happened again at Lalo's. OK, well, something intense did happen, but not the way we wanted.
I also feel like this was the the second episode of 'Better Tell Giselle'. Time to try and relax and have another shot of Dos Hombres tequila.
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Kev, the ".....awesome, intense scene where inevitably, nothing happens again!" happened again at Lalo's. OK, well, something intense did happen, but not the way we wanted.
Pretty much, yeah. Those idiots have to be the worst assassins ever.
And congrats to the writers on now making Kim unlikable. She was always a bit of a scallywag, but now she is wanting to ruin Howard's career/life? What a terrible decision by the writing team.
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These were the best hitmen Gus could find? Really? :lol
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I disagree with Kev. I love Kim, and I love how Jimmy has kind of corrupted her. Kim rules.
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I disagree with Kev. I love Kim, and I love how Jimmy has kind of corrupted her. Kim rules.
Same here. There is so much depth to her character. And one could perfectly understand her "breaking bad" now if you watched her character development. From the first scam they did to the guy at the bar to blackmailing Kevin (she didn't, but she enjoyed it when Saul did and when all of her efforts failed while trying to be the "good girl" and "doing the right thing"). If you haven't seen that coming, then you haven't been paying attention. It is not like she changed overnight, it is something that has been slowly developing.
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(https://i.imgur.com/PYQvxyb.gif)
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Great gif. :lol :lol
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That shot killed me when I first saw it last night. Probably the best laugh I have had watching the show to date. :lol :lol
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What an amazing episode and great way to end the season. It's going to be such a long wait for the final season but I'm so glad we have a good chunk of characters returning.
The actor playing Lalo is absolutely killing it.
Love the Kim attitude adjustment. loved everything about the episode, to me it's peak BCS. well peak BCS was probably the end scene of ep 9 but still. What an amazing season we got.
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Also while looking for Lalo's first appearance in BCS I found this very apt interaction between Nacho and Lalo. Season 4 Ep 8 ending.
(https://i.imgur.com/wz9Pi14.jpg)
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Also while looking for Lalo's first appearance in BCS I found this very apt interaction between Nacho and Lalo. Season 4 Ep 8 ending.
(https://i.imgur.com/wz9Pi14.jpg)
Ohhhh good catch. And LOL @ that Lalo gif :lol :lol I loved that part.
I'm really sweating for Kim and Nacho next season. That final shot of Lalo walking away right as the rage really built in him gave me goosebumps. Salamanca rage meter is at max and next season is gonna be bloody.
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I'm also seeing a lot of people on twitter referencing this whole setup of Ignacio and Lalo in a couple of small throwaway lines from Saul in Breaking Bad in his introduction in Season 2 episode 8 when Walt and Jesse take him hostage.
Can't believe they built a whole series arc for Nacho and major involvement of Lalo in BCS from that BB scene.
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I'm really sweating for Kim and Nacho next season. That final shot of Lalo walking away right as the rage really built in him gave me goosebumps. Salamanca rage meter is at max and next season is gonna be bloody.
And, I love how it started with him limping on gravel to by the time he exits the scene he's in a brisk walk and the gravel noise is a thunderstorm. Really cool.
I'm perfectly fine with where Kim is at. They've done a great job with her character and all along we've assumed it'd have been Jimmy's 'fault' she wasn't around in BCS. After the finale....it looks like she's actually the one who will be her own demise. But I'm sure it won't be that simple :lol
These were the best hitmen Gus could find? Really? :lol
Exactly what I was thinking. First, they needed help getting in the compound. Then, the first guy that Lalo noticed in the window had been in that position for a bit it seemed....he couldn't have gotten a shot off? Then, the whole assault just made zero sense. You have overwhelming numbers and fire power and get taken out by one dude. Pretty sad.
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Is this the only mention of Nacho in Breaking Bad?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gM6_FCeiBA
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Is this the only mention of Nacho in Breaking Bad?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gM6_FCeiBA
Yup that's the scene I was referring to in my post. It probably is the only mention.
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That is SO cool. Never caught that. Wow!
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^
Wow! Thanks.
just passing along yet another great review from Rolling Stone
https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-recaps/better-call-saul-season-5-finale-recap-something-unforgivable-984335/
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Is this the only mention of Nacho in Breaking Bad?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gM6_FCeiBA
Yup that's the scene I was referring to in my post. It probably is the only mention.
That's awesome.
Does that mean we're going to be getting Breaking Bad overlap in the final season and/or Nacho gets out of this alive?
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I could be dead wrong, but I think it's a given now that we will see "Gene" and Kim meet up in some fashion in the present (shown as the flash forwards). She was wearing a Royals shirt last night, KC is about 3 hours south of Omaha, NE, and her hometown is listed as Red Cloud, NE (which is about 3 hours southwest of Omaha). There is no way all of that is a coincidence.
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These were the best hitmen Gus could find? Really? :lol
That was without a doubt the worst part of the episode. If you start thinking about it, none of it makes sense.
That said, it was intense indeed. Nacho is done for, definitely. He was on the verge of being able to become a big player, but there is no way (even if the attack had succeeded) that this was going to end well for him. I feel for him, he's being used by virtually everyone on the show. The only one who speaks up for him is Mike - and Lalo, surprisingly in the last episode.
Now what would have happened had Nacho not opened the gate?
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My original thought process was that Lalo had figured out that Nacho was a traitor before going to Mexico, given that Lalo seems like a smart guy who is always ahead of the game combined with the fact that Nacho has the worst poker face ever (he always looks worried or aggravated).
It was comical how awful those assassins were. It was like watching a bad action movie from the 90's. If nothing else, why is Nacho not on the look-out just in case anything went wrong (which it did)? He could have easily taken out Lalo as he was leaning over the last assassin who was wounded on the ground. That whole sequence was just poorly done. The episode was otherwise very good, but it sucks for the final five minutes to have been so mediocre.
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My original thought process was that Lalo had figured out that Nacho was a traitor before going to Mexico, given that Lalo seems like a smart guy who is always ahead of the game combined with the fact that Nacho has the worst poker face ever (he always looks worried or aggravated).
My initial thought when Nacho walked out on the porch and Lalo was sitting there was actually: "Oh, shit, that phone call was fake. Lalo set him up. He's gonna be dead now."
Would have been more interesting probably?
It was comical how awful those assassins were. It was like watching a bad action movie from the 90's. If nothing else, why is Nacho not on the look-out just in case anything went wrong (which it did)? He could have easily taken out Lalo as he was leaning over the last assassin who was wounded on the ground. That whole sequence was just poorly done. The episode was otherwise very good, but it sucks for the final five minutes to have been so mediocre.
Yes.
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I totally disagree that that scene was bad or took away from the episode in any way, but that's just me. Yeah it's a bit unrealistic that Lalo killed so many of those guys on his own but there's a lot of unrealistic stuff in this show that we forgive. I really dug the whole shebang tbh. I suppose it just depends on how far you're willing to suspend your belief. Lalo's a straight up monster with no second thoughts about shooting people in the head and he's never scared enough to wear body armor or anything. He's a badass who knows how to kill, and I think that scene was effective (for me at least) at emphasizing those aspects of his character. Even the guys that snuck into the joint weren't going for the head; Lalo's got laser focus, "Nope, you're dying right now, buh-bye, next please" and I love that.
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Is this the only mention of Nacho in Breaking Bad?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gM6_FCeiBA
Does that mean Nacho doesn't die in Better Call Saul?
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Great episode. Midway through I realised a parallel with these fantastic, lauded pulp crime noir comics I read. When Mike says to Jimmy, "Lalo Salamanca dies tonight" in his gravelly accent - boom! Fantastic! Right then I realised how much I love this stuff.
BCS might be my favourite show of all time.
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Great interview (https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-features/better-call-saul-season-5-finale-creators-interview-984340)with show creators Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould.
I like how pretty much everyone acknowledges how they don't plan too far ahead and just take it a season at a time.
The final season is going to be great no doubt in my mind but it's definitely looking like a long wait.
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Thanks for that. Good interview.
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(https://i.imgur.com/PYQvxyb.gif)
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Great episode! So excited for the final season.
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I really liked season 5 a lot, and yet nothing really happened. Episodes just flew by, and when they were done the big picture was pretty much just as it had been. We got to see Hank, and introduced to early 8-ball. Mike officially climbed into bed with Gus, but we all knew that was inevitable. We got a great war between the two kingpins, which remains unresolved. Really, season 5 just seemed like time getting to know the players, and I really loved it.
I said last season that Kim was actually Saul Goodman, and I nailed it. She's far more into this sort of thing than Jimmy is at this point, and she gets off on it.
I really like Lalo. He's got such a wonderful zest for life, and a lively sense of humor. He's a ruthless killer, but only when he needs to be. Glad he's not dead. I bet he's pretty pissed off, though.
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Eh, Mike doesn't strike me as someone who operates out of fear. Shoot, he was ready for those gang bangers to kill him before the beatdown was presumably stopped by Gus' men and he was then moved to Mexico to recover. My guess is that Gus sold him on that idea that Lalo was the reason for the extra pressure that put Gus in the position where he had no choice but to order Werner's death, Mike bought it, and he is now out for revenge against Lalo.
I agree that Mike doesn't operate out of fear. I'd go so far as to say he's fearless, and in fact, Gus has more reason to be afraid of him. But you raised a point that bugged me. How did Gus know to have Mike rescued? They glossed right over that. Is he under 24 hour surveillance? Considering the number of associates, Gus would be racking up quite a payroll having everybody spied upon.
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Kim's gonna get whacked? Right?
I don't see it. That would be too dark. Besides which, I still maintain she shows back up in her home town. She might get disappeared. She might just move on. She's in the game now, but not that deep.
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The beauty of this show (and BB) to me is how they film such mundane things like getting coffee or counting money and yet make it so entertaining to watch. Those sequences have payoffs or sometimes they don't but at that point you don't care because of how much joy you get from watching it.
That's why these two shows are on a whole another level.
Kim dropping oranges in the juicer while Jimmy was getting PTSD'd was an absolute thing of beauty.
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Saul's cut was supposed to be 100k. I'd assume that's how much cash was in the bag.
Bundles of 10k each, 3, 4, and 3 laid sideways to provide scale. Vince is nothing if not meticulous in his details.
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The beauty of this show (and BB) to me is how they film such mundane things like getting coffee or counting money and yet make it so entertaining to watch. Those sequences have payoffs or sometimes they don't but at that point you don't care because of how much joy you get from watching it.
That's why these two shows are on a whole another level.
Kim dropping oranges in the juicer while Jimmy was getting PTSD'd was an absolute thing of beauty.
Absolutely! That sequence was so well done, the sound and cut to Jimmy's face was intense. It also kinda setups the Godfather trope of something going to happen when oranges are shown.
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Eh, Mike doesn't strike me as someone who operates out of fear. Shoot, he was ready for those gang bangers to kill him before the beatdown was presumably stopped by Gus' men and he was then moved to Mexico to recover. My guess is that Gus sold him on that idea that Lalo was the reason for the extra pressure that put Gus in the position where he had no choice but to order Werner's death, Mike bought it, and he is now out for revenge against Lalo.
I agree that Mike doesn't operate out of fear. I'd go so far as to say he's fearless, and in fact, Gus has more reason to be afraid of him. But you raised a point that bugged me. How did Gus know to have Mike rescued? They glossed right over that. Is he under 24 hour surveillance? Considering the number of associates, Gus would be racking up quite a payroll having everybody spied upon.
Haha, true, but remember that in the timeline, this was right after Mike blew off Gus in regards to working for him again, so Gus probably had a guy or two following him at night or something just to see what he was up to. Considering what Mike had already done for Gus (killing Werner, for one), Gus had a vested interest in making sure Mike wasn't disgruntled enough to do something stupid like going to the cops or the feds.
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Here I am, at the end! read through it all. Wondering why "not so many people were commenting"? well, one of them waited for the episodes to be available on Netflix and watched them all one episode per day!
So, here we are at the end, reveling in the beauty of one of the best "slow" series. There is a serious ability to be applauded for building a world so captivating, that scenes where nothing happens seem so enticing.
The first episodes seem slow. Having two wasted guys doing stupid shit around town screaming "50% off!" seem so trivial compared to what happened in the latter episodes.
Some random thoughts here and there:
- I still don't understand why Jimmy entered Howard's property to throw the balls from inside to outside, especially since he was not seeing where the car was. Did I miss something? have I misunderstood the layout of the house? to me it felt like he climbed inside Howard's premises and throw the balls out in the streets.
- The desert scenes were awesome, no wonder Vince Gilligan directed that episode, he really learnt from BB to do these shots. I thought that they were gonna use the ambush to get the car from the sole survivor of the shootout, maybe Jimmy should have pretended to walk casually, notice the car and run in the desert to force the guy to come down and chase him by foot, allowing Mike to shoot him.
I've read that the car was drive by a stuntman who does these kind of crazy sheaningans - so no CGI or tricks involved, there was a guy in the car (with the proper harnesses and safety measures of course) who literally and for real flipped the car he was driving to crash it. Wow.
- A long time coming, and yet I was not ready to see Kim...... break bad. When the stuff you propose to SAUL GOODMAN leave him worried, you've gotta wonder what you're doing. It's the equivalent of having Ozzy Osbourne concerned for your drugs habits.
- Also Kim is all kind of badass. Standing up to Lalo Salamanca telling him angrily to get his shit together was more than impressive. Wow.
- I'm still not sure at how the showdown in Mexico will go down. Gus realized that Juan Bolsa (second in command with only Don Eladio above him) wanted to get the bailout money. Why? he favors Gus? he wanted Lalo to rot in jail? who called the hit on Lalo? Bolsa himself? they made a point of making Lalo look at the bottle left by a suddenly gone Nacho - did he realize it was Nacho that opened the doors?
Also, I bet everyone though that "Something terrible" was what would have happened in Mexico, maybe Nacho had to kill a lot of people to get to Lalo.... but it was Kim's idea of framing Howard. Again, wow.
About Kim... I don't think she'll die, Saul Goodman as we know it in Breaking Bad is too joyful and too casual with women to be destroyed and heartbroken by Kim's death. Either Saul leaves her for her own good, realizing what a toxic influence he became on her, or Kim goes through with the plan to frame Howard, gets caught and disbarred, and leaves ABQ.
Totally cheesy scenario but imagine Howard facing a disbarred Kim claiming that Jimmy ruined her, copying the final Walter / Skyler meeting.
Kim: "Howard, you have to understand, all the things I've done..."
Howard: "If I have to hear one more time you defending Jimmy..."
Kim: "I did it for me. I was good at it. It made me feel.... alive"
;D
Great Rolling Stone interview btw. I love how Vince is so self conscious about the rules of writing, and how they are committed to stick to the landing. I totally forgot by now but also after El Camino I've read a passage in an interview that made me realize how much he's serious about the rules of writing and offering a quality product. Total opposite of the writers of Game of Thrones.
Anyway, to think we're at this stage thanks to a throaway line in Breaking Bad, that they had Saul say ("It was not me! it was Ignacio! did Lalo send you?") just to write up a generic "this lawyer has shady connection" scene. That's like getting Scenes from a Memory just because Petrucci thought it was clever and witty to add the tag "Part 1" to Metropolis for no real reason at all.
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I have always loved that Vince Gilligan is able to step back and listen to what others have to say about storylines and characters, etc.. he's always so respectful to what serves the story best rather than overruling everyone to put his stamp on things. At least in respect to the Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul world.
To me it's why these shows are such a joy to watch and rewatch.
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- I still don't understand why Jimmy entered Howard's property to throw the balls from inside to outside, especially since he was not seeing where the car was. Did I miss something? have I misunderstood the layout of the house? to me it felt like he climbed inside Howard's premises and throw the balls out in the streets.
I think you got turned around somehow. To my eyes......Jimmy was standing on the outside of Howard's gate and chucked the balls over. I think the wall he scaled was just a divider between homes....that he just didn't come in from the front. Maybe he knew Howard had camera's or something.
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- I still don't understand why Jimmy entered Howard's property to throw the balls from inside to outside, especially since he was not seeing where the car was. Did I miss something? have I misunderstood the layout of the house? to me it felt like he climbed inside Howard's premises and throw the balls out in the streets.
I think you got turned around somehow. To my eyes......Jimmy was standing on the outside of Howard's gate and chucked the balls over. I think the wall he scaled was just a divider between homes....that he just didn't come in from the front. Maybe he knew Howard had camera's or something.
Makes more sense explained it this way, thanks.
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- The desert scenes were awesome, no wonder Vince Gilligan directed that episode, he really learnt from BB to do these shots. I thought that they were gonna use the ambush to get the car from the sole survivor of the shootout, maybe Jimmy should have pretended to walk casually, notice the car and run in the desert to force the guy to come down and chase him by foot, allowing Mike to shoot him.
That was definitely an accident. They certainly wanted to take the guy's car, but shooting a tire/driver doing 50mph will have unpredictable results. Also, I doubt the guy would have chased him on foot. He would have just shot him in the back. Popping the driver was probably the safer way to go.
I've read that the car was drive by a stuntman who does these kind of crazy sheaningans - so no CGI or tricks involved, there was a guy in the car (with the proper harnesses and safety measures of course) who literally and for real flipped the car he was driving to crash it. Wow.
That's how car stunts were done for 50 years before CGI became affordable. And for some directors it's still how it's done. That one was a little more violent than something from Dukes of Hazard, but it's still the same premise.
- Also Kim is all kind of badass. Standing up to Lalo Salamanca telling him angrily to get his shit together was more than impressive. Wow.
I agree that Kim's a badass, but not for that scene. They both thought he was going to kill them, so she literally had nothing to lose. Had that speech failed, the next one probably would have ended with ¡y chinga tu madre, cabrona!. It was when she pulled the same stunt with the banker that convinced me. That was actually a real gamble with real world consequences that she wouldnb't be dead for, and right next to her boss, to boot.
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Giving a :tup to MirrorMask for his post. I enjoyed the read.
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Thanks man! it's gonna suck to wait for such a long time for the end, but it will be worth it.
This universe is so engrained and well created, that I wouldn't mind after this an anthology show about the Albuquerque of Breaking Bad. Have every season dedicated to a different character that lives in the same universe. I don't mean having a spinoff for Kim, for Howard, etc.... just any other new character, this universe is so well done that any story in it is potentially interesting.
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FIFTY PERCENT OFF!!!
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Thanks man! it's gonna suck to wait for such a long time for the end, but it will be worth it.
This universe is so engrained and well created, that I wouldn't mind after this an anthology show about the Albuquerque of Breaking Bad. Have every season dedicated to a different character that lives in the same universe. I don't mean having a spinoff for Kim, for Howard, etc.... just any other new character, this universe is so well done that any story in it is potentially interesting.
Huell. He probably gets up to interesting stuff when he's not with Goodman.
Vince Gilligan has already said that this universe is ending with Saul. He doesn't want it to continue indefinitely. I feel the same as you, though, even though I have no idea how it could continue.
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Yeah, that's probably the smartest thing to do. I'm not saying I'm demanding, requiring and praying for more BB-Albuquerque based stories; I just think that if he wanted to do it, and his heart was into it, he could be able to do something interesting about it. But I agree in the end that it's good to end with Better Call Saul.
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" ‘Better Call Saul’ season 6 will “change the way we see ‘Breaking Bad’ forever”, says creator"
https://www.nme.com/news/tv/better-call-saul-season-6-will-change-the-way-we-see-breaking-bad-forever-says-creator-2734551?amp
:o
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Very intriguing and enticing comment!
I mean, since the first season we've been getting post-BB scenes, so I wonder if part of that is about where certain characters end up and why. Might also shed new light on what some characters were doing before BB I guess. Can't wait to see what it all means.
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Would it be any other series, I'd shrug it away as the usual hype. Coming from them, it might actually have substance. I just hope they don't go overboard with it, Star Wars prequel style where EVERYTHING had to have an explanation.
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I trust em.. They've put out such great content that it's hard to imagine anything other than whatever comes next will be terrific.
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I trust em.. They've put out such great content that it's hard to imagine anything other than whatever comes next will be terrific.
Same. Can't wait to see how this all wraps up...
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bump.
not a ton, but some details are talked about Seasonb 6 in this article
https://bleedingcool.com/tv/better-call-saul-writer-reveals-everything-about-season-6-sorta/
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bump.
hopefully he will be okay, but Twitter is blowing up about news of Bob Odenkirk collapsing on the set yesterday and sent to the Hospital.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/28/entertainment/bob-odenkirk-collapse-intl-scli/index.html
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Wow, I hope he gets better soon.
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Three musicians died in the span of 24 hours and now this? with Aaron Paul sharing on Instagram a photo of Bob saying "I love you, my friend"? come on universe, give us a break.
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https://www.tmz.com/2021/07/28/bob-odenkirk-heart-related-unconscious-medical-emergency-better-call-saul/
Bob Odenkirk was hospitalized for a "heart-related incident" ... sources with direct knowledge tell TMZ, and it was touch-and-go for the last day but it looks like he's now out of the woods.
Bob is awake inside an Albuquerque hospital and we're told he's stable and on the rebound, but when he was rushed to the hospital Tuesday after collapsing on set it did not look good. We're told he was not conscious during the early hours in the hospital, although he's now lucid.
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Fingers crossed!
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looks like he's doing okay, considering
https://twitter.com/mrbobodenkirk/status/1421195860466089991
it was pretty amazing, don't know that I've ever seen twitter so unified in love and positivity for once.
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looks like he's doing okay, considering
https://twitter.com/mrbobodenkirk/status/1421195860466089991
it was pretty amazing, don't know that I've ever seen twitter so unified in love and positivity for once.
Twitch plays Pokemon is probably the next closest thing.
In all seriousness though, I'm really glad to see him doing okay.
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Mr. Bob Odenkirk
@mrbobodenkirk
I had a small heart attack. But I'm going to be ok thanks to Rosa Estrada and the doctors who knew how to fix the blockage without surgery.
Also, AMC and SONYs support and help throughout this has been next-level. I'm going to take a beat to recover but I'll be back soon.
Phew. Glad all went wall.
Screw the timeline for the release of BCS' last season, may he get all the rest and medical attention he needs for as long as he'll need it.
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Maybe they'll adjust some plans, and shoot some scenes while he is getting much needed bed rest some time soon. These could possibly be used as Gene Takavic scenes in Omaha.
But, I don't care if it takes five years for them to finish BCS. I just wish him the best.
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Bump.
new teaser for Season 6.
https://tvline.com/2022/02/07/better-call-saul-season-6-premiere-date-teaser-watch/
article says the premiere may be Monday April 18th
"In the video, a crime scene worker has laid out evidence tags bearing the letters “D” and “R,” and some eagle-eyed fans have interpreted that to mean the premiere date is April 18. (D is the fourth letter in the alphabet, and April is the fourth month of the year, while R is the 18th letter in the alphabet.) That would make sense, since April 18 is a Monday, and Better Call Saul has typically aired on Monday nights."
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Cor! Hope it hits the UK at the same time.
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Bump.
new teaser for Season 6.
https://tvline.com/2022/02/07/better-call-saul-season-6-premiere-date-teaser-watch/
article says the premiere may be Monday April 18th
"In the video, a crime scene worker has laid out evidence tags bearing the letters “D” and “R,” and some eagle-eyed fans have interpreted that to mean the premiere date is April 18. (D is the fourth letter in the alphabet, and April is the fourth month of the year, while R is the 18th letter in the alphabet.) That would make sense, since April 18 is a Monday, and Better Call Saul has typically aired on Monday nights."
yep.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CZzeA1FFuDO/
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Season 6 Trailer
https://twitter.com/BetterCallSaul/status/1501966121473355780
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Season 6 Trailer
https://twitter.com/BetterCallSaul/status/1501966121473355780
Oh my gosh. :metal
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10 days
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Warning, spoiler for the last season: https://twitter.com/BetterCallSaul/status/1513004792049815552?s=20&t=Gk-nLgcDj5RDJ0icb1diNA
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Warning, spoiler for the last season: https://twitter.com/BetterCallSaul/status/1513004792049815552?s=20&t=Gk-nLgcDj5RDJ0icb1diNA
Not so much a spoiler anymore as it’s now everywhere on the interwebz. Not surprised at all…..would have been more shocked had it not happened. But did think it’d have been more closely guarded and at least an attempt at being a ‘surprise’. Guess they knew it’d get out eventually.
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How stupid are they to announce this? Why not let it be a surprise? They did the same thing when Hank was going to appear, but Walt and Jesse are whole other animals. Unreal how dumb this is. Are they that hard up for ratings that they did this to get on the fence viewers to watch every week in the hopes that "this is the week we see Walt and Jesse?" So dumb.
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How stupid are they to announce this? Why not let it be a surprise? They did the same thing when Hank was going to appear, but Walt and Jesse are whole other animals. Unreal how dumb this is. Are they that hard up for ratings that they did this to get on the fence viewers to watch every week in the hopes that "this is the week we see Walt and Jesse?" So dumb.
My bet is they knew they couldn’t keep it a secret so just take advantage of it and pimp it to begin the season.
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I'm wondering how they're going to do this though. As far as we know, the first time Walt/Jesse and Saul meet is in Season 2 of Breaking Bad. BCS takes place quite some time before Breaking Bad, so it doesn't really make sense to see them together (Walt and Jesse) now, let alone actually interacting with Saul. So it's probably going to be something that takes place during the time period of BB, or something completely unrelated. We'll have to wait to find out I guess.
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Yeah, I was surprised at first that they posted it, but I think they were just resigned that it was going to get out there regardless so they might as well be the ones to announce it.
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With any luck, Cranton was spotted out in public with a bald head, which would have been a dead giveaway, and their announcement is a pre-emptive strike. It would sure beat that bald cap he wore in El Camino (which I have tried to forget even happened).
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I'm wondering how they're going to do this though. As far as we know, the first time Walt/Jesse and Saul meet is in Season 2 of Breaking Bad. BCS takes place quite some time before Breaking Bad, so it doesn't really make sense to see them together (Walt and Jesse) now, let alone actually interacting with Saul. So it's probably going to be something that takes place during the time period of BB, or something completely unrelated. We'll have to wait to find out I guess.
Season 4, Episode "Quite a Ride" they did have a scene that took place during the Breaking Bad timeline. The scene in his office with Francesca
https://www.amc.com/blogs/how-better-call-saul-recreated-saul-goodmans-office--1004278
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How stupid are they to announce this? Why not let it be a surprise? They did the same thing when Hank was going to appear, but Walt and Jesse are whole other animals. Unreal how dumb this is. Are they that hard up for ratings that they did this to get on the fence viewers to watch every week in the hopes that "this is the week we see Walt and Jesse?" So dumb.
My bet is they knew they couldn’t keep it a secret so just take advantage of it and pimp it to begin the season.
I think after the last Spiderman movie, people just know that some things are too good to not make them happen. You're probably right, everyone was expecting it, the actors were willing to do it, the joke of denying is stale, might as well go for it.
Personally, I would have just answered with a non answer... "Well, if I deny it, you wouldn't believe me anyway, and if I confirm it, where's the surprise?"
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All I know, is that Jimmy and Kim have been my favorite couple of all time. We just wish they could go off in the distance with a lot of money and do what they've proven they could do..... help the misfortunate.
As much as we're looking forward to this final season, their parting is going to be very painful. We're just hoping it is not 10,000 daggers painful.
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Kim's fate is something that I cannot wait to find out.....despite not having a very good feeling about how it's going to turn out for her.
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Well, the thing with Kim is, she has been breaking bad for a while, but the difference between her and Jimmy is that while his natural instincts are to do the wrong or shady thing, I do not think Kim's are, but Jimmy and circumstances have brought out the worst in her. If she ends up with a bad ending, she will have earned it.
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Well, the thing with Kim is, she has been breaking bad for a while, but the difference between her and Jimmy is that while his natural instincts are to do the wrong or shady thing, I do not think Kim's are, but Jimmy and circumstances have brought out the worst in her. If she ends up with a bad ending, she will have earned it.
For sure. I’m just wondering if she gets killed or goes to prison OR she calls the vacuum cleaner guy?
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Robert Forster, who played the disappear-er, died, and I don't see them getting another actor to play that role, so I doubt they will go that route.
I could see a scenario where she and Jimmy go after Howard using unethical methods, which get exposed. and Jimmy somehow leaves her hanging out to dry, severing the relationship, and she gets disbarred.
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I am excited.
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Terrific 2-episode premiere tonight, although it seemed to raise more questions than answer them in a lot of ways.
I was just looking at the schedule for the air dates, and this final season seems to be split into 2 halves in that, the 1st 7 episodes will air tonight through May 23rd.
Then there's 7 weeks off.
The last 6 episodes will air beginning on July 11th through August 15th.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3032476/episodes?season=6
So the entire Month of June is a break. Unsure why, but just to build the hype of the ending the series more?
Breaking Bad its final season took 11 months off between the 1st and 2nd half, going from September 2nd, 2012, until August 11th, 2013.
I seem to recall Lost and maybe Battlestar Galactica doing something similar their final seasons as well.
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So the entire Month of June is a break. Unsure why, but just to build the hype of the ending the series more?
This was announced a while back that they will be splitting the season, though most shows that split the final season have a large gap like you said, from what I read this is for award eligibility apparently. So BCS will be eligible for two years instead of the one. I haven't checked up myself but that seems to be the reasoning.
That was a phenomenal two episodes, the story weaving on these was immaculate and couldn't have been crafted any better.
Kim was brutal, just fucking brutal. That opening montage! first time in color! When they showed the brief nudity warning, and then showed the statues and paintings, I thought oh that's the nudity warning for? but then they show us Jimmy's ass lolll
Just fantastic opening for the season, I dare say this is now above breaking bad territory for me.
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Kim is irredeemable at this point. Assuming she doesn't get a good ending, she has definitely earned whatever is eventually coming her way. Howard is a twit, but to try and destroy his life like she is doing is just scummy.
Given that Gus knew where Nacho was, I find it hard to believe that he wouldn't have had him killed right away. He cannot afford for Hector's family to get to him first and get it out of him that Gus ordered the hit on Lalo (Lalo being alive or dead doesn't really change that). Nacho surviving and then escaping the motel shootout seemed a bit far-fetched, but okay.
Loved seeing the return of the Kettlemans, although as a red-blooded male :P, I was a bit stunned at how much Julie Ann Emery has aged.
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Kim was brutal, just fucking brutal.
Kim is irredeemable at this point. Assuming she doesn't get a good ending, she has definitely earned whatever is eventually coming her way.
Yep. For the longest time I was feeling 'sorry' for her character that she had seemingly been wrapped up with Jimmy and 'led' down that road. But....it's painfully obvious that she not only enjoys and seeks the mischief out, she's pretty much the one building up Jimmy to go 'all in' on Saul Goodman.
If I had to guess her fate it's that Jimmy bails on taking out Howard and she keeps going.....ultimately getting busted, disbarred and sent to prison. Heck....I wouldn't be surprised if it's Jimmy who alerts/assists Howard in doing so. You can see he's reluctant already.
I thought a really cool subtle aspect of the episode as well was the two different approaches each side of the drug cartel took in searching Nacho's apartment. Gus's crew was methodical, measured, precise and 'clean'......while the other crew utterly destroyed everything in a haphazard manner....even nearly destroying the evidence they were looking for. Neat detail and nuance that I love about how the show is written and presented.
I dare say this is now above breaking bad territory for me.
This show surpassed BB for me in S3. Not that I don't still adore BB but I just think BCS is essentially a master class in writing by Vince Gilligan that was honed in BB. And, not that BB wasn'y littered with great acting talent because it was....but for my money across the board the performances in BCS outweigh the across the board performances in BB. I know it's all subjective but count me firmly on board the 'BCS is "better" than BB" train.
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WOW, what a great 2 eps. Man, I feel bad for Kim, but yeah, I suspect she's not going to end well.
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I am not getting into the "BCS is better than BB" talk (spoiler: it's not :P), but one of the things I am interested to see is how Gus and Mike's working relationship turns. Mike has had several disagreements with Gus on things in BCS thus far, and we all know that by the time we get to BB, Mike is crazy loyal to him and never questions him or considers turning on him (even after Walt dangled it in the bar after Victor was killed by the box cutter), so things will have to play out in a way where Gus fully earns Mike's unyielding trust and loyalty.
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Robert Forster, who played the disappear-er, died, and I don't see them getting another actor to play that role, so I doubt they will go that route.
I don't think that'd be a problem. She'd just pick up the phone and order the part--end of Kim. I still think the fact that Jimmy's in Omaha is a big clue that she's alive enough to see him, though; probably why he went there.
Well, the thing with Kim is, she has been breaking bad for a while, but the difference between her and Jimmy is that while his natural instincts are to do the wrong or shady thing, I do not think Kim's are, but Jimmy and circumstances have brought out the worst in her. If she ends up with a bad ending, she will have earned it.
Couldn't disagree more. Jimmy might have brought her natural instincts to the surface, but Kim gets off hard on being bad. Literally. She's Dangergirl. Go back and watch her reaction after ripping off Ken Wins. And there are other examples where being bad gets her all gooey. That's all on her. But, I agree about the consequences. Those are on her, too.
All I know, is that Jimmy and Kim have been my favorite couple of all time. We just wish they could go off in the distance with a lot of money and do what they've proven they could do..... help the misfortunate.
As much as we're looking forward to this final season, their parting is going to be very painful. We're just hoping it is not 10,000 daggers painful.
I agree, minus the Victor Hugo aspect.
And with that I guess I abandon this thread for a few months.
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Loved the first two episodes of the season. I have to say, I think this show tops Breaking Bad for me. It's almost tainted Breaking Bad for me in a sense. After seeing the backstory of all the key players, and how truly hardcore all of them are (in spirit, reach, and capabilities), I have a hard time believing Walter White would have gotten as far as he did with Gus and beyond.
I'm wondering how and when they're going to tie Walter back into this story. It must be after they meet in Breaking Bad, no? The scene when they had Saul in the ditch with a bag on his head? I wonder how much crossover we'll actually get between the two timelines.
@Gary
I thought a really cool subtle aspect of the episode as well was the two different approaches each side of the drug cartel took in searching Nacho's apartment. Gus's crew was methodical, measured, precise and 'clean'......while the other crew utterly destroyed everything in a haphazard manner....even nearly destroying the evidence they were looking for. Neat detail and nuance that I love about how the show is written and presented.
I found myself thinking of that scene a lot on the way to work this morning. While Gus is always neat and methodical, that approach was really necessary in this instance. Gus needed the apartment to look like it hadn't been touched so there was no suspicion surrounding the planted letter in the safe. I did ask myself during the episode "I wonder if they turned the case on it's back so the delicates fell as far from the cutting wheel as possible?".
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I have to say, I think this show tops Breaking Bad for me.
Kev....we're up 2-1 :biggrin:
I found myself thinking of that scene a lot on the way to work this morning. While Gus is always neat and methodical, that approach was really necessary in this instance. Gus needed the apartment to look like it hadn't been touched so there was no suspicion surrounding the planted letter in the safe. I did ask myself during the episode "I wonder if they turned the case on it's back so the delicates fell as far from the cutting wheel as possible?".
True....Gus needed the covert aspect, and I see your point about them tipping the safe. I just think that Gilligan always has a purpose to every shot and detail and the two scenes were stark contrasts of one another....I have to believe that was intentional.
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Oh for sure. No doubt!
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The directing on both shows has always been amazing.I think Vince has said his involvement in the show has reduced a lot and it's largely a Peter Gould show at this point. Either way he laid the blue print for everyone and the directing has been top notch. I'm excited to see Rhea Seehorn's and Giancarlo Esposito's directorial debuts this season.
Also ep1 thoughts:
It took me way too long to figure out that Lalo set up that man, from the family at the beginning of the episode, to look like his twin and even had the dentist work be identical to set up as a decoy.
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It took me way too long to figure out that Lalo set up that man, from the family at the beginning of the episode, to look like his twin and even had the dentist work be identical to set up as a decoy.
Yeah.....talk about the long play and having a plan before you even need a plan.....freaking Lalo is pretty sinister.
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It took me way too long to figure out that Lalo set up that man, from the family at the beginning of the episode, to look like his twin and even had the dentist work be identical to set up as a decoy.
Yeah.....talk about the long play and having a plan before you even need a plan.....freaking Lalo is pretty sinister.
I picked up on the shaving aspect to that plan pretty early on, but I'm still not getting the dental records part. How, even with enough lead time, can you make someone else's teeth match yours?
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It took me way too long to figure out that Lalo set up that man, from the family at the beginning of the episode, to look like his twin and even had the dentist work be identical to set up as a decoy.
Yeah.....talk about the long play and having a plan before you even need a plan.....freaking Lalo is pretty sinister.
I picked up on the shaving aspect to that plan pretty early on, but I'm still not getting the dental records part. How, even with enough lead time, can you make someone else's teeth match yours?
I don't know? Matthew Perry did it for Bruce Willis in 'The Whole 9 Yards' though.
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It took me way too long to figure out that Lalo set up that man, from the family at the beginning of the episode, to look like his twin and even had the dentist work be identical to set up as a decoy.
Yeah.....talk about the long play and having a plan before you even need a plan.....freaking Lalo is pretty sinister.
I picked up on the shaving aspect to that plan pretty early on, but I'm still not getting the dental records part. How, even with enough lead time, can you make someone else's teeth match yours?
It could be something very simple like the dentist taking the dental records of the fall guy and reporting them as Lalos.
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I have to say, I think this show tops Breaking Bad for me.
Kev....we're up 2-1 :biggrin:
Prisoners of the moment. ;)
And I am sure if you polled the public at large, it would be a landslide. Better Call Saul, assuming it ends well which I think it well, will go down as a really good dramatic TV show. Breaking Bad's legacy as one of the greatest ever is already set in stone. :hat :hat
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Robert Forster, who played the disappear-er, died, and I don't see them getting another actor to play that role, so I doubt they will go that route.
I don't think that'd be a problem. She'd just pick up the phone and order the part--end of Kim. I still think the fact that Jimmy's in Omaha is a big clue that she's alive enough to see him, though; probably why he went there.
Not sure I agree. I don't think him going to Omaha was a calculated move, as he randomly threw it out there to Walt in their conversation in the penultimate episode of BB that he'd end up there, and of course Gilligan, being cheeky as he is, put him there. They could always write the finish of BCS to make it less random than it appeared to be, but that runs the risk of being contrived.
Well, the thing with Kim is, she has been breaking bad for a while, but the difference between her and Jimmy is that while his natural instincts are to do the wrong or shady thing, I do not think Kim's are, but Jimmy and circumstances have brought out the worst in her. If she ends up with a bad ending, she will have earned it.
Couldn't disagree more. Jimmy might have brought her natural instincts to the surface, but Kim gets off hard on being bad. Literally. She's Dangergirl. Go back and watch her reaction after ripping off Ken Wins. And there are other examples where being bad gets her all gooey. That's all on her. But, I agree about the consequences. Those are on her, too.
You might be right. Even Jimmy seemed a bit put off by how far she went when she was annihilating the Kettlemens this week, so her urges to be bad might be worse than Jimmy's.
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Robert Forster, who played the disappear-er, died, and I don't see them getting another actor to play that role, so I doubt they will go that route.
I don't think that'd be a problem. She'd just pick up the phone and order the part--end of Kim. I still think the fact that Jimmy's in Omaha is a big clue that she's alive enough to see him, though; probably why he went there.
Not sure I agree. I don't think him going to Omaha was a calculated move, as he randomly threw it out there to Walt in their conversation in the penultimate episode of BB that he'd end up there, and of course Gilligan, being cheeky as he is, put him there. They could always write the finish of BCS to make it less random than it appeared to be, but that runs the risk of being contrived.
I just don't see VG dropping so many hints that she's from the neighborhood for Omaha to be a coincidence. He's spent 5 years establishing where she's from. Jimmy went there for a reason, even if it doesn't pay off in the end.
You might be right. Even Jimmy seemed a bit put off by how far she went when she was annihilating the Kettlemens this week, so her urges to be bad might be worse than Jimmy's.
Since I really dig Kim for a variety of reasons I've been paying close attention to her character. No idea what she's up to with the Kettlemens, I thought they were gone, but she's definitely not the good girl she's been trying to portray. I've been enjoying the transition.
The girl's an adrenaline junky and never knew it. Danger turns her on (literally). I never really had much question about her motivation, which started as soon as she became Giselle. We see it reflected in her growing boredom with the law. As Judge Neelix pointed out she's looking for something to restore her passion in it. Working PD certainly helps, but working the system has a better payoff.
It hadn't occurred to me until now, but Giselle is Saul. While people have been clamoring for some mystical transformation from Jimmy to Saul, it's Kim who's undergoing the transformation from good girl to criminal lawyer.
I said last season that Kim was actually Saul Goodman, and I nailed it. She's far more into this sort of thing than Jimmy is at this point, and she gets off on it.
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Finally saw the two episodes as well. Great stuff, as always.
On the "which show is better" thing, I remember having said, and I stand by it, that BCS while being its own thing stands on BB's shoulders. Everything the writer learnt through creating BB, was used as an experience to build BCS upon BB's legacy, fandom and characters.
A fairer comparison would have been between BB, and another unrelated show by the same creators, but by building upon BB's world, and with more experience by the writers, BCS has a lot of advantages in appearing better than BB.
Anway, both shows are awesome, so no harm in playing favorites!
About the characters, I don't see things going so well for Nacho. And of course Kim.... I can't see a happy ending for her, I agree that it's very likely that her attempts to take Howard down will be her undoing, and that Saul Goodman will just move on.
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I agree that BCS stands on BB’s shoulders. And it makes me think would we have watched a better Breaking Bad IF We would have gotten BCS first and BB second? Man, we would never know, but it makes me wonder.
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I can ignore the actors looking way older while playing younger versions of themselves (especially Jonathan Banks), but they have quite a few things to work towards to make everything line up with what happened in Breaking Bad.
-We have seen several examples in BCS of Mike not liking Gus' decisions and even questioning them at times, but in BB, Mike was super loyal and never questioned anything. Maybe Gus will find a way to let Mike spare Nacho that will earn Mike's trust one and for all that is then there in the BB timeline.
-It feels like many think Lalo will die, but in BB when Jesse and Walt kidnap Saul (in the first ep where we see Saul), Saul was terrified that Lalo had sent them, so in Saul's mind right then and there on BB, Lalo was still alive, so either Lalo lives or he dies somehow and Saul is unaware of it. And remember that BCS is still, I think, several years behind in the timeline of when BB begins (unless I forgot about a time jump at some point that makes it closer).
-We never knew much about Saul's private life in BB, and we didn't need to because that was Walter White's story and Saul's personal life was irrelevant to the story, but how the Kim story plays out needs to make sense with his behavior in BB. Throughout most of BCS, Saul has always been hesitant (for the lack of a better term) about anyone being offed, but right off the bat in BB, he is recommending shanking Badger in the chow line in prison to solve Walt and Jesse's problem, and later when Jesse was in the hospital after Hank beat him up, he not so subtly suggested to Walt that drastic measures might need to be taken in regards to Jesse if he does not "come around."
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Holy shit. :eek :eek :eek
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Holy fucking shit is right!!!! God what an episode.
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Holy shit. :eek :eek :eek
Holy fucking shit is right!!!! God what an episode.
:omg:
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Holy shit. :eek :eek :eek
Holy fucking shit is right!!!! God what an episode.
:omg:
I am in shock!!!
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Great, great episode.
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Holy shit. :eek :eek :eek
Holy fucking shit is right!!!! God what an episode.
:omg:
I am in shock!!!
I had hoped that the Nacho storyline would have somehow ended on a happier note....but I know that was totally unrealistic and couldn't happen. I suppose him getting assured that his Dad was free and clear was about as happy an ending that could have happened. The look Mike gave him when exiting the van was brutal.....but man, the whole episode was so well done.
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God dammit. That was not the ending I was ready for.
I loved the opening sequence, very beautifully shot, and thought it would have to do with the final scene and it did. You know that the moment he did the thing you knew it would end badly, because of how characters end up alive in Breaking Bad, but still, that was unexpected.
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It's only the third episode. ONLY THE THIRD.
What a way for Nacho to go. Like a total badass champions, on his own terms. "When you are sitting in your shitty nursing home and you're sucking down on your Jell-o night after night for the rest of life, you think of me, you twisted fuck" is right up there along with "Tell Cersei, I want her to know it was me".
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Spoilers is in the title, so probably no need for the smaller font, yes?
Honestly, I am not sure this saves his father. Maybe if it had played out like it was planned, but with his rant and letting Hector know about the pills, I don't see the Salamancas letting this matter drop.
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He also covered brilliantly Gus' ass, with the "I had to watch this asshole bring you back" part. He told them all off, and sold that he was so angry at all of them that he gladly betrayed them, without need for external motivations (Gus interfering).
Lalo however won't let the matter drop, maybe that's how he goes out.... he goes after Nacho's dad and Mike stays true to his word.
Another brilliant thing of that scene, that in no doubt will go down as one of the best scenes in the BrBa universe, is that - as pointed out in an interview by Michael Mando (Nacho) himself - all those characters are dead, they just don't know it yet. They're on top of their world and they got rid of Nacho but a few years later down the road, a frustated chemistry teacher will bring them all down more or less indirectly.
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Lalo still has to go down. I bet Mike will have something to do with that indeed.
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I was thinking Nacho was going to blow his brains out in the garage after talking to his dad. I was waiting for the camera to be on the mechanic working under the hood and then hearing the gunshot in the background or something. Yet somehow, when we got to his time, it took me by complete surprise.
Great episode.
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He also covered brilliantly Gus' ass, with the "I had to watch this asshole bring you back" part. He told them all off, and sold that he was so angry at all of them that he gladly betrayed them, without need for external motivations (Gus interfering).
Lalo however won't let the matter drop, maybe that's how he goes out.... he goes after Nacho's dad and Mike stays true to his word.
Another brilliant thing of that scene, that in no doubt will go down as one of the best scenes in the BrBa universe, is that - as pointed out in an interview by Michael Mando (Nacho) himself - all those characters are dead, they just don't know it yet. They're on top of their world and they got rid of Nacho but a few years later down the road, a frustated chemistry teacher will bring them all down more or less indirectly.
Yep, everyone else in the scene dies in BB, and Walt or Gus are responsible for the deaths of each.
Gus, Hector and Tyrus all die from the bomb Walt gave Hector.
Victor was killed by Gus.
Mike was killed by Walt.
Juan Bolsa was killed in the raid obviously arranged by Gus.
The cousins were killed by Hank (thanks to Gus' having Mike call Hank to warn him) and Mike (in the hospital, under Gus' orders).
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRfLcKkXwAIOjUE?format=jpg&name=small)
my favorite moment was seeing Hector's face after Nacho tells him he switched his pills.
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"Tell Hector. I want him to know it was me."
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRfLcKkXwAIOjUE?format=jpg&name=small)
my favorite moment was seeing Hector's face after Nacho tells him he switched his pills.
This could be a meme. :D
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"Tell Hector. I want him to know it was me."
When did he say this?
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"Tell Hector. I want him to know it was me."
When did he say this?
I was paraphrasing a quote from Game of Thrones, by Lady Olenna :D
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Oh, that's why I didn't get it :)
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So, interlocutory episode.... but we kinda needed a breather after the drama of last week.
It was absolutely hilarious seeing Jimmy cosplaying as Howard :lol
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So, interlocutory episode.... but we kinda needed a breather after the drama of last week.
Yes, but also you can see the tension is ramping up everywhere and it's not as if absolutely nothing happened. I've seen BCS described as someone boiler water. You don't notice it gets hotter if it happens slightly, but at some point it's boiling and there's no way back. BCS does this really well in pacing, story-telling, camera angles, everything. Saul is oblivious as of now, Kim and Gus know that the wolf is out there to get them. This episode showed that contrast beautifully.
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Rhea Seahorn directed this past week's episode which of course included the scene with Kim meeing Mike.
I kind of feel like they could/should have spoke for a lot longer than they did.
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Rhea did a fantastic job directing that episode, I always love the creative angles and shooting from odd spots scenes.
Spoilers...
That Jimmy doubling for Howard scene was so hilarious to see, the whole setup and execution with the sign moving was just vintage BCS.
Gus having that crazy level of surveillance gives a bit of background I guess to when Walter White comes to Gus's house to shoot him and he gets a phone call "Go home, Walter".
Another two BB characters - Wendy and Spooge.
Mike and Kim meeting for the first time, that was such a great scene.
I always love these types of episodes, it's really what makes the show great IMO.
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Why would Lalo being alive be a problem for Kim? What am I forgetting?
I always love these types of episodes, it's really what makes the show great IMO.
My favorite touch this episode was Gus not being happy with Mike's guy in his restaurant. Gus truly loves what he has built with Los Pollos, and he has just as much pride in that business as his illegal activities.
It was kind of crazy to see Spooge looking relatively successful and clean compared to how we saw him in Breaking Bad.
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Haha yeah that whole exchange was great, those bits are great. Gus also having that clip-on tie was another great touch for a manager running that place.
I think Lalo is essentially an issue for both Kim and Jimmy which is why Kim appears more worried than Jimmy lets on.
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Why would Lalo being alive be a problem for Kim? What am I forgetting?
Not a problem per se, it's more like Gus and Mike know that Lalo knows Jimmy and Kim, and they're tracking her in the off chance that Lalo contacts them.
Gust knows Lalo is alive, he's waiting for him to appear anywhere. So they're keeping track of anyone who's associated with him. In case Lalo shows up at Jimmy's doorstep, they'll know.
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Why would Lalo being alive be a problem for Kim? What am I forgetting?
Not a problem per se, it's more like Gus and Mike know that Lalo knows Jimmy and Kim, and they're tracking her in the off chance that Lalo contacts them.
Gust knows Lalo is alive, he's waiting for him to appear anywhere. So they're keeping track of anyone who's associated with him. In case Lalo shows up at Jimmy's doorstep, they'll know.
That's where my head was/is at. Kim just seemed to be flustered or worried by the news that Lalo was still alive. Wasn't sure if there was an immediate threat, or if she's just worried about her and Saul not being able to get away from the cartel, even if it's just for legal services.
Haha yeah that whole exchange was great, those bits are great. Gus also having that clip-on tie was another great touch for a manager running that place.
I must have blinked because I totally didn't' catch the clip on!
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Does Gus KNOW Lalo is alive or is just feeling it in his gut?
Obvs, Hector knows, but I didn't think anyone else did?
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Does Gus KNOW Lalo is alive or is just feeling it in his gut?
Obvs, Hector knows, but I didn't think anyone else did?
To quote the lawyer that is pissed at Saul: "there's proving, and there's knowing".
He "knows" since he realized Hector wasn't too much heartbroken over his "death", and he's actively trying to smoke him out. He doesn't have 100% conclusive proof, he just knows he's right.
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Does Gus KNOW Lalo is alive or is just feeling it in his gut?
Obvs, Hector knows, but I didn't think anyone else did?
Gus knew the moment after he spoke to Hector in Episode 2 (I think?). To me it was clear immediately, the way Hector looks at Gus in that particular scene makes Gus realise Lalo is still alive.
By the way, can we all appreciate how amazing of an actor Mark Margolis is, portraying Hector? He doesn’t say a single word, but his facial expressions speak for themselves. He’s fantastic to watch.
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By the way, can we all appreciate how amazing of an actor Mark Margolis is, portraying Hector? He doesn’t say a single word, but his facial expressions speak for themselves. He’s fantastic to watch.
I am on board with this. He didn't say a lot in Scarface in his limited role, but his facial expressions were so good that you were almost scared of him, even being just the viewer. :lol :lol
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That was one tense final scene yet again.
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Starting to thinking ahead here.... since Howard wants to know what Jimmy is up about, what if he eventually finds out his ties to the cartel but finds also himself on the path of Lalo, signifying his demise? maybe that's how Kim goes down as well, 'cause she's tied up in all this mess.
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That was one tense final scene yet again.
Very thoughtful of Lalo not to kill that lady. I thought for sure she was a goner just to leave no loose ends.
Starting to thinking ahead here.... since Howard wants to know what Jimmy is up about, what if he eventually finds out his ties to the cartel but finds also himself on the path of Lalo, signifying his demise? maybe that's how Kim goes down as well, 'cause she's tied up in all this mess.
I think Jimmy and Kim knew/know/were planning on Howard catching on....and that he's falling right into whatever plan they have and will ultimately only 'learn' what they want him to. As far as his ultimate demise or whatever the end game is....I think it's going to be whatever Jimmy and Kim have planned and that'll cost Kim her future and pave Saul's.
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I swear, I have reached the point with this show where I just want it to be over. The great episodes are far too fleeting, and the majority seem to leave me thinking, "That's it?" The boxing thing last night, while entertaining, might have been the most ridiculous thing ever conceived in the BB/BCS world. I can't believe that scene was real.
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That was one tense final scene yet again.
Very thoughtful of Lalo not to kill that lady. I thought for sure she was a goner just to leave no loose ends.
Starting to thinking ahead here.... since Howard wants to know what Jimmy is up about, what if he eventually finds out his ties to the cartel but finds also himself on the path of Lalo, signifying his demise? maybe that's how Kim goes down as well, 'cause she's tied up in all this mess.
I think Jimmy and Kim knew/know/were planning on Howard catching on....and that he's falling right into whatever plan they have and will ultimately only 'learn' what they want him to. As far as his ultimate demise or whatever the end game is....I think it's going to be whatever Jimmy and Kim have planned and that'll cost Kim her future and pave Saul's.
this whole scheme with Howard has to have a much more clever twist to it. There's no way it can be taken at face value.
I am very much of the feeling with Kim, she ends up in an acceptable place in order for Jimmy/Saul to be of the same demeanor he is in Breaking Bad. If Kim dies, it doesn't fit with the continuity of what we know about Saul's character as the chipper/sarcastic Saul Goodman (compared to the dreary temperment of Gene).
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Loved that episode, it was more 'typical' BCS and had more of those mundane yet semi-important setup scenes like the fight between Howard and Jimmy. Loved all the Jimmy scenes from the office start to the quip from Kim with the 'pow I fight for you'. Yet they still had those tense scenes where you get so relieved at the outcome more than anything.
I also can't believe it's been 32 years since I watched that soccer game from that Trivia game between West Germany v Argentina that Andreas Brehme scored on a penalty. that was the first soccer final I saw live as a kid.
We have two more left before the break and the final six episodes. I love that we still have no definitive clue as to how the end is going to happen which I predict will be left for the 2nd half of the season.
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I'm really curious how Lalo's going to find the location of the to-be meth lab. So far, all he's got is a region and "north wall" (or was it south?).
Maybe he goes after one of the guys that was working for him? But even then, I don't think any of them really have a clue where they were.
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I'm really curious how Lalo's going to find the location of the to-be meth lab. So far, all he's got is a region and "north wall" (or was it south?).
Maybe he goes after one of the guys that was working for him? But even then, I don't think any of them really have a clue where they were.
Not only that but, I know Gus is smart and all....but how did he conclude that Lalo was going that route? He's already planted the gun there and will be waiting for him. I like how meticulous he is and how he thinks things out but him pegging Lalo's move seems pretty remarkable.
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I'm really curious how Lalo's going to find the location of the to-be meth lab. So far, all he's got is a region and "north wall" (or was it south?).
Maybe he goes after one of the guys that was working for him? But even then, I don't think any of them really have a clue where they were.
Not only that but, I know Gus is smart and all....but how did he conclude that Lalo was going that route? He's already planted the gun there and will be waiting for him. I like how meticulous he is and how he thinks things out but him pegging Lalo's move seems pretty remarkable.
I think he knows that's a possibility because Lalo was already digging at that. Remember the call from season 4 (I think) when Lalo tricked Werner into divulging info on the phone about the dig? Gus probably thinks that's one of his only leads. He knows Lalo knows he'd never get close to his house, and there are too many people at a Los Pollos location.
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I'm really curious how Lalo's going to find the location of the to-be meth lab. So far, all he's got is a region and "north wall" (or was it south?).
Maybe he goes after one of the guys that was working for him? But even then, I don't think any of them really have a clue where they were.
Not only that but, I know Gus is smart and all....but how did he conclude that Lalo was going that route? He's already planted the gun there and will be waiting for him. I like how meticulous he is and how he thinks things out but him pegging Lalo's move seems pretty remarkable.
I think he knows that's a possibility because Lalo was already digging at that. Remember the call from season 4 (I think) when Lalo tricked Werner into divulging info on the phone about the dig? Gus probably thinks that's one of his only leads. He knows Lalo knows he'd never get close to his house, and there are too many people at a Los Pollos location.
Well....lets pretend that I'm old and my mind isn't what it used to be and that I forgot about that call and him tricking Werner into supplying him info :lol It's not as inconceivable to me now.
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Someone also made a comment in the BCS subreddit that Gus had pitched spice curls to Marigal last season and that mention of those fries in last night's episode made Gus connect the dots that Lalo might not be coming to get him but maybe going after his business/Madrigal/Werner hence his prep in the lab if that does happen.
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Someone also made a comment in the BCS subreddit that Gus had pitched spice curls to Marigal last season and that mention of those fries in last night's episode made Gus connect the dots that Lalo might not be coming to get him but maybe going after his business/Madrigal/Werner hence his prep in the lab if that does happen.
Thank you! I remembered the original spice curls scene but couldn't for the life of me figure out what triggered Gus to start acting the way he did. Even when thinking about that scene specifically in the moment, it didn't click. At first I thought it was just his employees fucking up and dropping trays. Leading up to that moment, including the positioning of the pen on his desk, I thought the intent was to show that Gus has total control of every single facet of his life, down to the smallest details like pen's location. Walking through the restaurant and seeing every employee being super meticulous reinforced that. I thought the employees messing up like that triggered something in Gus' mind to realize that he doesn't have everything under control and cracks were starting to show. The spice curls thing makes so much more sense now. What awesome writing.
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I'm really curious how Lalo's going to find the location of the to-be meth lab. So far, all he's got is a region and "north wall" (or was it south?).
Maybe he goes after one of the guys that was working for him? But even then, I don't think any of them really have a clue where they were.
Not only that but, I know Gus is smart and all....but how did he conclude that Lalo was going that route? He's already planted the gun there and will be waiting for him. I like how meticulous he is and how he thinks things out but him pegging Lalo's move seems pretty remarkable.
I think he knows that's a possibility because Lalo was already digging at that. Remember the call from season 4 (I think) when Lalo tricked Werner into divulging info on the phone about the dig? Gus probably thinks that's one of his only leads. He knows Lalo knows he'd never get close to his house, and there are too many people at a Los Pollos location.
Well....lets pretend that I'm old and my mind isn't what it used to be and that I forgot about that call and him tricking Werner into supplying him info :lol It's not as inconceivable to me now.
Yeah, that's ultimately what did Werner in. He fled for the weekend, and when Mike found him at the resort, he was on the phone with Lalo. Lalo was pretending to be someone involved with Fring. Mike had to report to Gus that Lalo (possibly unknown who it was at that particular time) was snooping around and Werner fucked up. Here's the scene.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhuyLmXQE1E
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For sure, the writing has always been amazing on this show and Breaking Bad. Almost everything seems purposeful. I need to go back and watch season 4 and 5. There are so many Lalo scenes I forgot about, like the one you mentioned about him digging around with Werner and Gus.
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I feel like I missed the whole significance of Gus in the bunker. I had no idea what was happening there and why (and why it took so long).
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Was that a bunker or the Meth lab they are constructing? Right before the scene, Gus tells Mike "Tell your guys we are going out." and then he walks down which I'm assuming is the same layout as the lab.
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That was definitely the future meth lab. We saw them move the washing machine or dryer to access it.
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Gus figured out that Lalo would never come at him directly, unless he had proof that Gus was working behind the cartel's back, and he imagined Lalo would eventually go after the meth lab that Werner Ziegler started building. So he went there to plant a gun so that if one day Lalo will show up there, he will be ready for him.
So basically there are chances that Walt and Jesse cooked standing over Lalo's buried remains.
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I needed last week’s change of pace, and it sure did set the table for many things down the road. Watching it again before the new one tonight
Lalo has to be one of most suave and disgustingly ruthless villains ever created
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Who’s Lakota?
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Lakota is Lalo when your phone does an autocorrect 😀
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Oh look, another episode where not much happened. :\
But hey, we did get several minutes of Mike talking to his granddaughter, numerous shots again of dripping water and simmering coffee, and more drawn out scenes that made me yawn.
I am so ready for this show to end. Just get to the finish so I can see how it ends and I can be done with it.
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I will say this, though: I think Kim and Jimmy are walking into a trap. Cliff asking Kim about Jimmy and then not seeing Howard or his PI again tells me that they are on to whatever nefarious plan they have concocted on "D-Day," and Kim turning around and getting directly involved will be what brings her down.
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Man Kev.....you are salty towards this show in a big way :lol I just don't see the distain that your seeing but I know BB is like the 10 Commandments to you so I can understand your loyalty to it and inclination to bag on BCS. But I'm enjoying the heck out of the show and think it's been great! There were quite a few 'snoozer episodes' in BB as well but it all worked together for the story. And I say that not ripping on the slow episodes as I understand those episodes are necessary for the story. You have to have the foundation(s) in place for the payoff(s) to be worth it.
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I love this show. Slower the better. :lol
There are some episodes I watch where I just think every shot is like a panel from a crime comic book. Awesome.
Do we have another episode before the break, does anyone know?
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Do we have another episode before the break, does anyone know?
I believe there is one more then the break.....
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Excellent. Can't wait to see where this goes...
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Man Kev.....you are salty towards this show in a big way :lol I just don't see the distain that your seeing but I know BB is like the 10 Commandments to you so I can understand your loyalty to it and inclination to bag on BCS. But I'm enjoying the heck out of the show and think it's been great! There were quite a few 'snoozer episodes' in BB as well but it all worked together for the story. And I say that not ripping on the slow episodes as I understand those episodes are necessary for the story. You have to have the foundation(s) in place for the payoff(s) to be worth it.
I wouldn't say I have disdain for or am salty towards the show; I am just consistently underwhelmed by it. Far too many episodes leaving me thinking, "That's it?", when it ends. The Nacho episode earlier this season was great, but then we got back to episodes moving at a snail's pace. With only seven episodes left to go in the series, it feels like the storyline ought to be moving fast, but it's just not. I am still hopeful that the payoff will be worth it, but I am not confident about it.
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Why not? the quality of Breaking Bad and all the previous seasons of BCS prove that they know what they're doing.
True, anyone can "fail", and I've always liked Ozark and was dead sure they would have ended greatly but the finale left me underwhelmed, but I just trust these writers and I know that everything will have a pay off.
Anyway, I think that whatever will happen in the next episode, it will be the downfall of Kim. And possibily of Howard.
I don't think Lalo will have any lasting damage from being hurt in the rib, but maybe that's how Gus will get the best of him? he's injured enough (or better, he ignores enough the conseguenques of being hurt) and he will make a fatal mistake when confronting Gus or Mike in the lab? (this of course assuming that Lalo will find the lab, but come on, we've been seen Gus planting a gun in it, he will get the info from the german guy, and Lalo needs proof to bring to the Salamanca clan... he will find the lab but won't make it out alive, so everyone will continue to believe he's dead, and the only one who knows the truth can't speak anymore)
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Why not? the quality of Breaking Bad and all the previous seasons of BCS prove that they know what they're doing.
In the case of Breaking Bad, yes, but the writing of that was finished nearly a decade ago. Just like musicians don't always write music of the same quality, neither do writers of TV shows, and the writing on BCS hasn't been as great or engrossing as BB, IMO. It's really not close. Heck, a few years ago they did El Camino, which showed Jesse's story post-BB, and that wasn't that great, so that was proof there for me that the writers are not clicking on all cylinders when writing in that world like they were from 2008-2013. Plus, unlike with Breaking Bad, when writing Better Call Saul, they have to follow a lot of patterns to make sure things lines up with how certain things were in the BB timeline, so maybe those slight constraints have made the writing a little less great. Hard to say. With BB, they told a story, and they were free to tell it with no worry about anything else. With BCS, they are having to connect a lot of dots to make things make sense based on the previous story (in the future, timeline-wise) they already told.
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Why not? the quality of Breaking Bad and all the previous seasons of BCS prove that they know what they're doing.
In the case of Breaking Bad, yes, but the writing of that was finished nearly a decade ago. Just like musicians don't always write music of the same quality, neither do writers of TV shows, and the writing on BCS hasn't been as great or engrossing as BB, IMO. It's really not close. Heck, a few years ago they did El Camino, which showed Jesse's story post-BB, and that wasn't that great, so that was proof there for me that the writers are not clicking on all cylinders when writing in that world like they were from 2008-2013. Plus, unlike with Breaking Bad, when writing Better Call Saul, they have to follow a lot of patterns to make sure things lines up with how certain things were in the BB timeline, so maybe those slight constraints have made the writing a little less great. Hard to say. With BB, they told a story, and they were free to tell it with no worry about anything else. With BCS, they are having to connect a lot of dots to make things make sense based on the previous story (in the future, timeline-wise) they already told.
I don't know Kev....the writing on BCS has been on par and as good as BB IMO. I think that for BB especially, it's entered this realm of 'lore' that while it's deserved....it also is now shielded from any criticism or shortcomings due to it's cultural status. While the two shows share characters and backstory and are set in the same world....they are still two different shows that require them to tell/write in a similar yet distinct manner. For my money BCS has been written and acted just as good if not better than BB but that's just me.
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I'm surprised the German guy even knew who Fring was, even if it was just in name. I would have that that'd have been security measure #1.
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I don't know Kev....the writing on BCS has been on par and as good as BB IMO. I think that for BB especially, it's entered this realm of 'lore' that while it's deserved....it also is now shielded from any criticism or shortcomings due to it's cultural status. While the two shows share characters and backstory and are set in the same world....they are still two different shows that require them to tell/write in a similar yet distinct manner. For my money BCS has been written and acted just as good if not better than BB but that's just me.
To be fair, Breaking Bad earned its status. It's not like most put it on a lofty pedestal for fun; it is put up there because of how awesome it was.
I would certainly agree that the acting on BCS has been terrific, and the production values are always top notch, but I just think the writing is a bit too style over substance at times.
I'm surprised the German guy even knew who Fring was, even if it was just in name. I would have that that'd have been security measure #1.
That's a great point, and I think the whole Gus thing is where the writers have lost the plot. Gus is a master at hiding in plain sight, but now he has this whole setup at his house where a lot of people know what is going on with him? Er, no. That goes against his entire persona that we knew in Breaking Bad. And yeah, it is not realistic that anyone building the underground lab would have known anything about the mastermind behind it. I think the writers have gone a little crazy with writers catnip where they are trying to be clever with every little thing.
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Was killing some time going through Breaking Bad's quotes, this is from an episode of season 3...
Juan: Don Salamanca had a nephew named Tuco.
Gus: Yes, I knew of him.
Juan: Then perhaps you know Don Salamanca mentored him in the business. Thought of Tuco as a son. When Don Salamanca was no longer able, Tuco took over for his uncle. He was a key man in our organization north of the border. He was loyal. This "Heisenberg" – Walter White – he was one of Tuco's local suppliers. Until he betrayed Tuco. So now you see...blood must be repaid by blood. Tuco's cousins here...they have the right to exact vengeance. The Salamanca family, the cartel...everyone stands shoulder to shoulder on this.
[Hector rings the bell in affirmation]
"When Hector was no longer able, Tuco took over"... mmh, I seem to remember that Lalo started to help because Tuco was in prison when Hector had his stroke ;D
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I'm surprised the German guy even knew who Fring was, even if it was just in name. I would have that that'd have been security measure #1.
That's a great point, and I think the whole Gus thing is where the writers have lost the plot. Gus is a master at hiding in plain sight, but now he has this whole setup at his house where a lot of people know what is going on with him? Er, no. That goes against his entire persona that we knew in Breaking Bad. And yeah, it is not realistic that anyone building the underground lab would have known anything about the mastermind behind it. I think the writers have gone a little crazy with writers catnip where they are trying to be clever with every little thing.
Someone on Reddit made a great point about this. Lalo was with Gus when Gus was pretending to build that chiller for his restaurants, and Kai was one of the guys there pretending to work on it. So he's at the very least seen Fring on at least one occasion, and may have even recognized Lalo. Gus is still kind of green in BCS compared to BB, and those kind of slip ups could explain why he's even more anal/hardcore in BB.
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I'm surprised the German guy even knew who Fring was, even if it was just in name. I would have that that'd have been security measure #1.
That's a great point, and I think the whole Gus thing is where the writers have lost the plot. Gus is a master at hiding in plain sight, but now he has this whole setup at his house where a lot of people know what is going on with him? Er, no. That goes against his entire persona that we knew in Breaking Bad. And yeah, it is not realistic that anyone building the underground lab would have known anything about the mastermind behind it. I think the writers have gone a little crazy with writers catnip where they are trying to be clever with every little thing.
Someone on Reddit made a great point about this. Lalo was with Gus when Gus was pretending to build that chiller for his restaurants, and Kai was one of the guys there pretending to work on it. So he's at the very least seen Fring on at least one occasion, and may have even recognized Lalo. Gus is still kind of green in BCS compared to BB, and those kind of slip ups could explain why he's even more anal/hardcore in BB.
Good points. I had forgotten that the guy in Germany had briefly seen Gus.
I hope this is not a spoiler, but Peter Gould, whom I believe is the main showrunner now, said something to the effect that this week's coming episode is going to be painful for a lot of watchers, which makes me wonder if Kim's arc is resolved this week. I am sure whatever we all predict or guess will be wrong, and then whatever happens will seem so obvious (these writers are good at that :lol), but I cannot imagine a good outcome for Kim at this point, and her bad decision at the end of last week's episode just feels like life-changing for her, in a very bad way.
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Yep. She had a choice to make and well….she made it. I think that was a pretty distinct moment. Eh could have had everything she essentially wanted as far as career but has seemingly thrown it away. I would feel bad for first season Kim. Not so much for sixth season Kim…..I’d argue that at this point right now she’s more sinister than Jimmy.
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I’m betting that Jimmy is going to throw Kim under the bus.
I was watching that final scene and you can see Kim hesitating, she might think Jimmy is lying to her about the judge person, that Jimmy is chickening out of whatever they’re doing now that Kim is away. Maybe I’m overthinking, but Kim is done. She should not have turned around.
Either that, or it will be the other way around; Kim will throw Jimmy under the bus. We’ll see. It’s possible the cold open holds some significance too, although I thought Kim would steal the vet’s black book.. at least we got vacuum cleaner man mentioned in there..
Well then, this is going to be interesting whichever way it goes. One of them is going down.
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The vet's black book was shown in the intro of the first episode, when we're getting the tour of Jimmy's place. So one of them definitely gets it at some point.
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I was thinking… we know Jesse and Walt will show up at some point, but I guess this will be in the second half of this final season. We’re a little unsure on when exactly BCS tales place, compared to BB. What if Season 6 Part 2 actually jumps ahead in time a little? Just an idea.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we see Walt and Jesse tomorrow in some kind of flash forward. Given that they promoted them as being in this final season, it would always seem strange to not see them until Part 2 is aired this summer.
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Your tomorrow is Tuesday for me, unfortunately.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we see Walt and Jesse tomorrow in some kind of flash forward. Given that they promoted them as being in this final season, it would always seem strange to not see them until Part 2 is aired this summer.
I'm very curious about this as well. I'm trying to remember... was Walt's first introduction to Saul by him just walking into his office?
If so, I have no idea how they work them into the show without jumping ahead in time until after BB started. Or maybe they do something like end BCS with Walter walking into his office or something.
Now that I'm typing this, I'm wondering if Walt and Jesse's return has anything to do with Saul at all. Could Gus have had W&J on his radar before they tried to meet him at Los Pollos? Maybe Gus was tailing them as soon as their meth started selling. Mike is good at hanging out in the desert. Maybe he was watching them cook?
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I wouldn't be surprised if we see Walt and Jesse tomorrow in some kind of flash forward. Given that they promoted them as being in this final season, it would always seem strange to not see them until Part 2 is aired this summer.
I'm very curious about this as well. I'm trying to remember... was Walt's first introduction to Saul by him just walking into his office?
If so, I have no idea how they work them into the show without jumping ahead in time until after BB started. Or maybe they do something like end BCS with Walter walking into his office or something.
Now that I'm typing this, I'm wondering if Walt and Jesse's return has anything to do with Saul at all. Could Gus have had W&J on his radar before they tried to meet him at Los Pollos? Maybe Gus was tailing them as soon as their meth started selling. Mike is good at hanging out in the desert. Maybe he was watching them cook?
That's an interesting idea. Remember that Combo was shot by that kid in BB who was with those two guys who were working for Gus (the ones Walt took out in the "run!" scene), and that was after Walt and Jesse had met Saul, but before Saul floated the idea of meeting "a guy who knows a guy...who knows another guy" (Gus), so Gus had to be aware of the blue meth at that point, or it is possible those two guys simply took out someone selling on their territory without running that knowledge up the chain of command. Hard to know for sure.
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One of the writers announced on Twitter that they wrote the last season as 13 consecutive episodes, so they didn't factor in the break. So, even though I'm sure the episode will end on a high note filled with tension, we should not expect a proper "mid season break cliffhanger", 'cause when it was written, they thought the next episode would air the next week.
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Kim's flashback: was this the first time we found out that she is from Nebraska?
The Goodmans vs. HHM: I have no idea who is outsmarting who at the moment.
I found the Ehrmantrauts' star gazing incredibly fascinating. We know Mike loves the them, and the anger and emotional pain were so evident. The man can loudly express himself with few (if any) words. Love that character!
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Kim's flashback: was this the first time we found out that she is from Nebraska?
Nope, can't tell you when (I just don't remember), but it's been known for years.
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Kim's flashback: was this the first time we found out that she is from Nebraska?
Nope, can't tell you when (I just don't remember), but it's been known for years.
I think it was on the JMM episode where they show this on her drivers license when getting married with Jimmy. I can’t recall more
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One of the writers announced on Twitter that they wrote the last season as 13 consecutive episodes, so they didn't factor in the break. So, even though I'm sure the episode will end on a high note filled with tension, we should not expect a proper "mid season break cliffhanger", 'cause when it was written, they thought the next episode would air the next week.
I am glad I know this now so I can mentally prepare myself for having another "That's it?" reaction when the episode ends. :lol :P
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:rollin
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Holy hell.
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Holy hell.
Dammit. I was going to wait until tomorrow to watch because the Blues game is going to go late but this response alone tells me I must watch tonight.
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I knew how that scene was going to end as soon as a certain someone made their presence known, but, jeez.
Not like we didn't know it before, but Kim is officially as slimy as Jimmy.
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Never swore as loud in a moment of angst and shock watching any TV show or movie as I did tonight
Just ‘Wow!’
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I scared the ever living fuck out of my dog.
What does Lalo expect to get out of Saul?
Also, I'm still not understanding how Lalo found the laundry.
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Just…..I mean…..wow.
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Sweet lord almighty. I legit jumped out of my chair.
So some solid sleuthing on the subreddit
When Kim visits Lalo in jail, he calls Saul a cockroach. The cockroach in the sewer made Lalo think of Saul again.
Goddamn was that some good acting by Howard, he's by far my favorite side character story arc.
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What to do with Howard is an interesting question. If Kim and Jimmy disappear him, Cliff is going to name drop Jimmy to the cops immediately. Think they might stage it as a suicide or something?
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What to do with Howard is an interesting question. If Kim and Jimmy disappear him, Cliff is going to name drop Jimmy to the cops immediately. Think they might stage it as a suicide or something?
They have portrayed Cliff as a bit of a dunce lately, but he should be able to put two and two together once he realizes that Kim skipped the meeting he had set up for her on the same day Howard had his "meltdown" (for lack of a better term), one Howard verbally blamed (correctly) to Cliff on Jimmy (but not Kim, which could be significant).
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Is Lalo's motivation to use Saul to out/blackmail Gus?
They also are going to have to give more on how Lalo found the Laundry Mat.
Also, I'm assuming the 1st time Lalo was put on hold was when Gus (Mike) had set up the tapping of the Nursing Home's phone. How Lalo realized that? was it just that he normally doesn't get put on hold. And he somehow assumed the 2nd time, it wasn't tapped despite the same "on hold" music?
We know in BB, Saul definitely fears or deals with Gus in a concerned manner. I wonder if we end up getting some dealing between Saul and Gus in the 2nd half here that sets up their dicy relationship in BB.
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I think there was a brief cut when he was on hold the first time, almost like someone was hacking into the call. He noticed it. And then when he made the second call, he said what he wanted them to hear, most likely to get security all drawn to Gus and away from Kim and Jimmy, but the question becomes, when did he figure out that Mike's guys were keeping an eye on Kim and Jimmy?
Re-watching the last scene really shows the difference now between Jimmy and Kim. Jimmy loves a good con, but I don't think he cared if Howard bounced back from it. He was happy having made him look foolish. Not Kim. She wanted him ruined. When Jimmy told Howard he'd be fine and that he always lands on his feet, Kim gives Jimmy a look like, "Really? That's not what we want." And Jimmy looked genuinely bothered for a second or two when Howard mentioned that his marriage had been in trouble, almost like Jimmy was having a pang of guilt over kicking someone when they are down. Meanwhile, Kim kept just standing there like she couldn't have cared less.
That said, I think Kim was genuinely scared for Howard when Lalo made his presence known, which is why she told him several times to leave, so it's an interesting dichotomy in that she was worried for his life just moments after making it obvious that she was totally fine with possibly having ruined his professional reputation.
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I think there was a brief cut when he was on hold the first time, almost like someone was hacking into the call. He noticed it. And then when he made the second call, he said what he wanted them to hear, most likely to get security all drawn to Gus and away from Kim and Jimmy, but the question becomes, when did he figure out that Mike's guys were keeping an eye on Kim and Jimmy?
Re-watching the last scene really shows the difference now between Jimmy and Kim. Jimmy loves a good con, but I don't think he cared if Howard bounced back from it. He was happy having made him look foolish. Not Kim. She wanted him ruined. When Jimmy told Howard he'd be fine and that he always lands on his feet, Kim gives Jimmy a look like, "Really? That's not what we want." And Jimmy looked genuinely bothered for a second or two when Howard mentioned that his marriage had been in trouble, almost like Jimmy was having a pang of guilt over kicking someone when they are down. Meanwhile, Kim kept just standing there like she couldn't have cared less.
That said, I think Kim was genuinely scared for Howard when Lalo made his presence known, which is why she told him several times to leave, so it's an interesting dichotomy in that she was worried for his life just moments after making it obvious that she was totally fine with possibly having ruined his professional reputation.
Yeah....that's exactly how I interpreted that all. Kim was WAY more enthused about what they'd done to Howard.....then once Lalo showed up both Kim and Jimmy knew Howard's life was in danger.
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Just have to say the flip in emotions by the actors in the end scene was so surreal. The horror they showed just completely switched the tone of that scene. I'll have to admit, I was initially thinking it would be Lalo knocking but when Howard showed up, I was relieved only to be confronted with my worst fears. That whole final scene was amazing.
The director and writer of the episode said before the episode that this episode wasn't meant to be a mid-season finale. It just worked that way because of issues they had with finishing the remaining episodes on time. Either way at least the remaining six episodes are just 7 weeks away.
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I am in shock :omg:
Never expected Howard to end like this. I feel bad for him. I think he always was a good guy with a tough temper, but he was in my eyes a correct man, that was looking for the best interest of his company/firm.
Man, I can't believe what I just watched.
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What to do with Howard is an interesting question. If Kim and Jimmy disappear him, Cliff is going to name drop Jimmy to the cops immediately. Think they might stage it as a suicide or something?
Was wondering the same thing? I mean, Lalo will just walk away and leave them with the mess presumably.....how do you just 'get rid' of a prominent lawyer? The suicide angle is the best one but even then they'd have to stage that suicide scene at Jimmy's apartment. You're not moving the body etc etc.
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What to do with Howard is an interesting question. If Kim and Jimmy disappear him, Cliff is going to name drop Jimmy to the cops immediately. Think they might stage it as a suicide or something?
Was wondering the same thing? I mean, Lalo will just walk away and leave them with the mess presumably.....how do you just 'get rid' of a prominent lawyer? The suicide angle is the best one but even then they'd have to stage that suicide scene at Jimmy's apartment. You're not moving the body etc etc.
I thought about this a bit more, and the suicide angle will be really hard if BCS wants to maintain realism. Crime scene investigators would know right away it wasn't a suicide. For one, the murder weapon in gone (unless Lalo leaves it for some reason). There'd be no residue on Howard's hands from the discharge, and the damage to his head is probably not consistent with a self inflicted gunshot room given that Lalo was a few feet away.
They could continue their con and say Howard stormed in violently one of them shot him in self defense (assuming they have or can get a gun). Everyone in the meeting room would be able to testify that just a few hours prior Howard was acting strange and erratic.
Edit:
Just saw these photos frame on Reddit. They could possibly go the suicide route (NSFW)
https://preview.redd.it/i4iwjgshbg191.jpg?width=768&auto=webp&s=34b882c1dad82ce1d03eb36f204e2a69af05e409
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So I just pulled up this scene because I wanted to hear the song (didn't know what it was called).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VfWzb8uf8s
I guess that's how the crew guys knew where they were going and were able to give Lalo a name. Seems like a really stupid oversight.
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I think Jimmy and Kim knew/know/were planning on Howard catching on....and that he's falling right into whatever plan they have and will ultimately only 'learn' what they want him to. As far as his ultimate demise or whatever the end game is....I think it's going to be whatever Jimmy and Kim have planned and that'll cost Kim her future and pave Saul's.
Not that this was a 'hot take' at the time or some sort of convoluted puzzle that needed to be solved.....but "you" had a hunch at the time when Howard hired the P.I. that Jimmy/Kim knew this would happen and that Howard was unknowingly digging his own grave....no pun intended.
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Maybe they will stage it like Howard was killed by his drug dealer, in the end, that's how he was portrayed in the last couple of episodes as a drug addict.
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Man I'm just sad for Howard. The guy did his best and didn't really deserve any of this. Such a meaningless death too, he wasn't even involved in any of the cartel thing.
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Man I'm just sad for Howard. The guy did his best and didn't really deserve any of this. Such a meaningless death too, he wasn't even involved in any of the cartel thing.
Yea I agree, I felt so sad for him through the whole episode. He always seemed like a righteous man but honestly his death felt kinda lame, it was too obvious to be shocking atleast for me. Still sad to see him go like that.
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I suspect Lalo could at least find a way to take care of Howard's body to stage it with much less suspicion.
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I’m honestly not sure what to think after watching that. In a way it seems unnecessary and simply there to ‘shock’. It’s meaningless and a little too far-fetched. Too much coincidence and thinks working out just right.
By the way, everything that happened was mentioned in the episode’s title.
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Blimey.
That felt like something out of Breaking Bad to me, for the first time in BCS - where the things people do can lead to unexpected, terrible consequences
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Meaningless?!? Nah, it will certainly have a deeper meaning for Kim and Saul, it was all THEIR fault that this happened. I hate Kim and Jimmy much more now.
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What to do with Howard is an interesting question. If Kim and Jimmy disappear him, Cliff is going to name drop Jimmy to the cops immediately. Think they might stage it as a suicide or something?
Was wondering the same thing? I mean, Lalo will just walk away and leave them with the mess presumably.....how do you just 'get rid' of a prominent lawyer? The suicide angle is the best one but even then they'd have to stage that suicide scene at Jimmy's apartment. You're not moving the body etc etc.
I thought about this a bit more, and the suicide angle will be really hard if BCS wants to maintain realism. Crime scene investigators would know right away it wasn't a suicide. For one, the murder weapon in gone (unless Lalo leaves it for some reason). There'd be no residue on Howard's hands from the discharge, and the damage to his head is probably not consistent with a self inflicted gunshot room given that Lalo was a few feet away.
They could continue their con and say Howard stormed in violently one of them shot him in self defense (assuming they have or can get a gun). Everyone in the meeting room would be able to testify that just a few hours prior Howard was acting strange and erratic.
Edit:
Just saw these photos frame on Reddit. They could possibly go the suicide route (NSFW)
https://preview.redd.it/i4iwjgshbg191.jpg?width=768&auto=webp&s=34b882c1dad82ce1d03eb36f204e2a69af05e409
I think the suicide angle would be hard to pull off simply because it is hard to imagine Jimmy and Kim having the poker faces to pull it off, given how in shock they were. As much bad stuff as they have done, witnessing a murder of a former colleague in front of their faces and then covering up the murder is like going for 0 to 70 in three seconds. They aren't that "in the game" yet to be able to successfully pull that off, IMO. Much will depend on how the scene plays out with Lalo (we know Jimmy makes it out alive, and I am sure Kim will as well), but I would imagine Jimmy knows he can call Mike to clean the scene, so it is possible Howard will simply disappear and many will assume the events of that day drove him far away.
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Meaningless?!? Nah, it will certainly have a deeper meaning for Kim and Saul, it was all THEIR fault that this happened. I hate Kim and Jimmy much more now.
(Spoilers, but it's also in the thread title)
No, my problem is not with it being meaningless, that was probably a wrong word choice. The odds of it happening are just so low that the entire idea felt contrived an only put in there to shock the viewer. Lalo showing up exactly 5 minutes after Howard is too much of a coincidence, especially knowing how methodical Lalo can be, he had probably even seen Howard entering their house. Howard didn't deserve this, but he was a victim of being in the wrong place at the wrong time; in that sense I do definitely see the Breaking Bad similarities that actions have larger unexpected consequences.
We needed something to happen to make Jimmy the Saul he is in Breaking Bad and this may very well be it. How Jimmy and Kim will recover from this, I don't know. Everything that happened in that scene was their making.
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We can somehow justify that with Lalo growing impatient and acting in a rushed way, which no doubt will be his undoing. He wants to get it done ASAP and so he just can't wait anymore. Probably he would have waited Howard out, but when he heard him say that he would work relentlessly to bring Jimmy and Kimmy down, he thought he would have been a problem to eliminate.
Anyway.... congratulations to the author trolling on Twitter, the one I quoted. Yeah, maybe he's since in saying that they didn't plan a mid season break, but I'm sure he told that to not have people anticipating a major shocking cliffhanger and maybe try to guess which one.
Poor Howard. Poor, poor Howard. I never felt sympathy for his character as much as now. His tearing down of Kim and Jimmy was absolutely on point. Yeah, it's a TV show, Jimmy is the protagonist, we rooted against Howard and eventually we sympathized with him when it turned out that Chuck was the real asshole, but seriously, he said it so eloquently - what did he do to deserve all of that? he's an asshole, he got daddy's help, he sided with Chuck, so out of petty revenge they ruin his life and carrer? who made Jimmy and Kim judge and jury of what should happen to regular, decent people who happen to have some flaws? and he was even depressed on top of having marital problems.
So many parallels with both Chuck and Hank.... with Chuck, the meltdown orchestrated by Jimmy and the lucid realization of what Jimmy's plan was - Howard got it down to the last detail exactly as Chuck did with the Mesa Verde paper, and with Hank, the whole "moderate antagonist that you have to realize is actually better than the protagonist and eventually dies tragically".
That scene shocked me, I kinda plan my viewing evenings to not run too late beyond my usual bedtime (hey, the day after is a working day), I had to scrap those plans and chill out a bit because I was too shocked (eventually I went for other shorter stuff, I needed those 10-15 minutes to calm down, this wasn't just another "eh, episode over, time to watch another show" thing). I was worried just as Kim and Jimmy and I didn't even properly saw the killing 'cause I was too busy saying "no, no no... NOOOO HOWARD!!!".
Nothing will ever beath Hank's death in this universe, but this probably comes in as a close second.
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Everything that gets destroyed around him is actually all Jimmy's doing.
This is the most important thing happening in this season so far, with Nacho's being a second (and I found that one maybe more tragic even). It just still doesn't make sense; there was no need for Lalo to do this and I do hope indeed that this will be his undoing.
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Howard's exact quote to Jimmy and Kim, when Lalo was listening:
"I'm gonna make it clear to everyone, because I'm going to dedicate my life to making sure that everybody knows the truth. Believe it. You can't hide who you really are forever."
This sounds like a problem to an unhinged and eager to act Lalo. Maybe, as he did in the house of Mrs. Ziegler, he would have waited for Howard to leave (come on, they were telling him already to go away), but when he heard that, he immediately enter the scene. Not after a while.... as soon as Howard said that, he came into the living room.
I too agree that he should have just waited for Howard to go away, but we can somehow rationalize this without too many mental athletics. Walter leaving a poetry book in the toilet was a far worse useful coincidence.
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Thanks, that actually makes the whole scene make a lot more sense.
Howard Hamlin was cool. Patrick Fabian really did a good job portraying him :)
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Lalo can't just leave Jimmy and Kim, can he? There's too much risk that one of them reports him as soon as he leaves. I could see him doing something like ordering Saul to somehow get Gus into the picture while he takes Kim hostage. Saul does it. Mike helps with the body. Jimmy gets his settlement money, divorces Kim so she gets half, and then that's her ticket to be vacuumed away.
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Lalo can't just leave Jimmy and Kim, can he? There's too much risk that one of them reports him as soon as he leaves. I could see him doing something like ordering Saul to somehow get Gus into the picture while he takes Kim hostage. Saul does it. Mike helps with the body. Jimmy gets his settlement money, divorces Kim so she gets half, and then that's her ticket to be vacuumed away.
The urgency in Lalo's actions, and Gus' camp preparing for everything, makes me think that things will come to a head pretty soon. I wouldn't be surprised if the final showdown between Lalo and Gus, or at least Mike, will happen already in episode 8. Then two episodes to wrap up the Jimmy timeline, and then three episodes to go back to Gene and then end the whole story.
Who knows if we'll get an iconic, and fitting lyrics-wise, closing song like it heppened with Breaking Band and Baby Blue. Maybe there's a relatively unknown band out there who's counting the days until their Spotify numbers suddenly skyrocket :lol
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Lalo can't just leave Jimmy and Kim, can he? There's too much risk that one of them reports him as soon as he leaves. I could see him doing something like ordering Saul to somehow get Gus into the picture while he takes Kim hostage. Saul does it. Mike helps with the body. Jimmy gets his settlement money, divorces Kim so she gets half, and then that's her ticket to be vacuumed away.
I cannot recall, is Jimmy aware yet of the existent of Ed (the disappearer). Robert Forster passed away in late 2019, so we obviously will not see him, but I suppose they could always work that angle without us having to see Ed.
But yeah, how that plays out in the apartment will be most interesting, not just with what do they do with Howard, but, like you said, Lalo cannot just have a chat with them and then leave.
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They don't know about his services, but they hinted at them figuring it out when Kim found his business card in the black book. We know they get that book at some point, and maybe Kim deciphers the code or something. That'd also explain how Saul knew of him and his services in BB.
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Lalo can't just leave Jimmy and Kim, can he? There's too much risk that one of them reports him as soon as he leaves. I could see him doing something like ordering Saul to somehow get Gus into the picture while he takes Kim hostage. Saul does it. Mike helps with the body. Jimmy gets his settlement money, divorces Kim so she gets half, and then that's her ticket to be vacuumed away.
I cannot recall, is Jimmy aware yet of the existent of Ed (the disappearer).
No. The scene at the vet (Ep. 6) where they flipped through the black book prominently showed the Vacuum Guy's business card though, and we know that book ends up in their hands at some point (somebody else said in this thread that it was shown in the season's cold open).
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Boy I'm stupid.
Only now I've just realized that, so far, all episodes of the season are called Something and Something.
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They don't know about his services, but they hinted at them figuring it out when Kim found his business card in the black book. We know they get that book at some point, and maybe Kim deciphers the code or something. That'd also explain how Saul knew of him and his services in BB.
No. The scene at the vet (Ep. 6) where they flipped through the black book prominently showed the Vacuum Guy's business card though, and we know that book ends up in their hands at some point (somebody else said in this thread that it was shown in the season's cold open).
Gotcha. I hope they don't go that route again. We have already seen Walt, Sault and Jesse use the disappearer to vanish. Do we really need to see another use it? It feels like a plot device they would have overused if they employ it again. I already think Hector's bell ringing has reached its expiration date and is now more annoying than anything.
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I read that Patrick Fabian (who played Howard) is a huge fan of Radiohead, Steven Wilson, Genesis, etc., and his favorite band is Rush. I think he just became one of my favorite celebs. :lol :lol
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Another thing I read is that Howard was indeed supposed to be Jimmy's antagonist, with Chuck being a mentor and a caring elder brother. While filming the first season both the actors and the writers came to the realization that it would have been far more interesting to switch roles and make Chuck the antagonist. Absolutely brilliant choice.
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Another thing I read is that Howard was indeed supposed to be Jimmy's antagonist, with Chuck being a mentor and a caring elder brother. While filming the first season both the actors and the writers came to the realization that it would have been far more interesting to switch roles and make Chuck the antagonist. Absolutely brilliant choice.
Agreed. I like when that stuff like happens. They saw what they had with the actors and realized they could change the trajectory of two characters on the fly, and boom, it worked! It reminds me of the audible they called with the Jesse Pinkman character, who was supposed to be killed off at the end of Season 1 of Breaking Bad, but once they saw how good Aaron Paul was, combined with the all-time on-screen chemistry he had with Bryan Cranston, they kept him around for the entire run.
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Tomorrow
:metal
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It is telling that AMC is showing the entire Breaking Bad series this weekend, not all of Better Call Saul, as they know that BB is far better and more popular, and the best way to get excitement and ratings up for the new BCS episode is to get fans to binge on Breaking Bad. Smart move. :tup :tup
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Not this debate again! :lol
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Shots fired! :P
(https://i.giphy.com/media/xUOrw4ud8umysrmszm/200.webp)
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Promo for the final half season https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVeTDxCwGLE
Wow, did this make me sad. We didn't watch a single BB episode until the show had ended, but we watched BCS from night one. I'll always consider BB better,
but I enjoyed Saul more. Now come all the heartbreaks and aches. We're waaay past the good old 'Hoboken Squat Cobbler' days.....
My favorite picture from our favorite show these past six plus years
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EVrSexHWkAA9de6.jpg)
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Okay, that kicked serious ass. Hot damn.
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The tension this show creates is second to none. Vince Gilligan directed the shit out of that episode. What a return to the 2nd half, I get the gut feeling this show is only going into more heartbreak.
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There is no definitive way to prove it…….it will and can be argued back and forth between camps……which is better…..BCS or BB? Both are created and guided by the same man, have characters that are inter wound between both shows…..it’s honestly a mute point because the ‘universe’ these shows exist in and the characters therein are the true treasure.
But I’ll argue till I’m blue in the face that BCS is ‘better’ than BB, especially if this shoe sticks the landing which there’s no indication as to why it wouldn’t.
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Mike looked genuinely sad at the end for Howard. Mike is a criminal and a killer, but doesn't like to see anyone not in the game get harmed, and while Howard wasn't always a likable guy, he wasn't a bad guy, and he received a terrible ending (killed for no reason, reputation destroyed, buried underneath a meth superlab next to the guy who killed him).
I like that Lalo's storyline was wrapped up last night. What happens with Jimmy/Gene and how Kim's arc plays out are the two biggies as far as what I want to see, so it was nice to see the sociopath finally get his. Amazing how they had us rooting for Gus.
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Also, a great question I saw online: how in the world did they get that mini track hoe into the lab and how do they plan to get it out??
:lol :lol
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It's also fascinating to think that as good as Mike is at his job, Lalo completely outsmarted him in those last two episodes. Gus took down Lalo despite Mike and the team around him pretty much letting him down.
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There is no definitive way to prove it…….it will and can be argued back and forth between camps……which is better…..BCS or BB?
BB all the way, a top 3 show of all time for me. I like BCS but I'm nowhere near as invested in the show at the minute as I was in BB during it's final run.
But opinions and all :)
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Also, a great question I saw online: how in the world did they get that mini track hoe into the lab and how do they plan to get it out??
:lol :lol
There is a tunnel that exits the lab. You can see it in the shots from BCS and in BB it has it's own coiling door that opens to a more refined tunnel.
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Just finished the episode, and man, what an episode.
It makes me think of Kim’s love for Jimmy. Kim Whexler attorney at law was all-in to kill some random person (for her) just to save Jimmy. Man, that hit hard.
I recently did a rewatch of BB, before BCS season 6 started. And I just noticed that while Lalo was putting the gag into Jimmy’s mouth he says: “it wasn’t me, it was….Ignacio” same line that Saul says in BB season 2 episode 8 when the gag was removed from him. ALL this time he has being living in fear that Lalo appears suddenly.
Swing Howard in the same pit with Lalo, that was powerful.
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A few new thoughts...
-Kim is now a loose end for Gus. She knows where he lives, even if she doesn't know his name. It pained Mike that he couldn't save Nacho, but maybe he finds a way to save Kim and get her to "disappear" without Gus knowing he was responsible for making it happen. No way can Kim survive as is for long with Gus around.
-The fallout from Howard's death/disappearance should be massive. Cliff knows that Kim skipped the meeting he set up for her and he knows Howard thought Jimmy and Kim set him up (Mike was not aware of either of those things). They can't just explain it away the way Mike said and have it go away.
-Gus is going to having a good time quietly whispering in Hector's ear that his nephew is dead for real this time, and will likely rub salt in the wound by admitting that he did the deed himself.
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A few new thoughts...
-Kim is now a loose end for Gus. She knows where he lives, even if she doesn't know his name. It pained Mike that he couldn't save Nacho, but maybe he finds a way to save Kim and get her to "disappear" without Gus knowing he was responsible for making it happen. No way can Kim survive as is for long with Gus around.
-The fallout from Howard's death/disappearance should be massive. Cliff knows that Kim skipped the meeting he set up for her and he knows Howard thought Jimmy and Kim set him up (Mike was not aware of either of those things). They can't just explain it away the way Mike said and have it go away.
-Gus is going to having a good time quietly whispering in Hector's ear that his nephew is dead for real this time, and will likely rub salt in the wound by admitting that he did the deed himself.
Wouldn't that put Gus in danger? I mean, Hector can't talk, but he knows how to ring a bell, so, he could let the nephews and/or others know that Gus killed Lalo.
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Oh, right. Duh. :facepalm: :facepalm:
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-Kim is now a loose end for Gus. She knows where he lives, even if she doesn't know his name. It pained Mike that he couldn't save Nacho, but maybe he finds a way to save Kim and get her to "disappear" without Gus knowing he was responsible for making it happen. No way can Kim survive as is for long with Gus around.
-The fallout from Howard's death/disappearance should be massive. Cliff knows that Kim skipped the meeting he set up for her and he knows Howard thought Jimmy and Kim set him up (Mike was not aware of either of those things). They can't just explain it away the way Mike said and have it go away.
Yeah....you'd have to believe that has something to do with Kim 'missing' from the BB world (excusing the fact she didn't exist when that show was written) You'd think this pretty much lit the fuse on Kim's characters demise....whatever that turns out to be. With them using the 'disappear' angle for three characters we know already....although it was a different show....I wonder if it'll be a different scenario? Although, Kim would then technically be the 'first' character to have used the 'disappear' method.
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Yeah....you'd have to believe that has something to do with Kim 'missing' from the BB world (excusing the fact she didn't exist when that show was written) You'd think this pretty much lit the fuse on Kim's characters demise....whatever that turns out to be. With them using the 'disappear' angle for three characters we know already....although it was a different show....I wonder if it'll be a different scenario? Although, Kim would then technically be the 'first' character to have used the 'disappear' method.
I think it is notable as well that the writers have said that Rhea Seehorn was a revelation and they never anticipated Kim being this big and important of a character, so it makes me wonder if the end of Jimmy's story in BCS, which they had to have had a general idea about going in, does not involve Kim directly. Perhaps her arc ends before then.
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Lalo appeared in Breaking Bad
(https://scontent.fmrd1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/293453616_1534516526964226_5985413345788854421_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=4YuyfCmmGTUAX-EN7ea&_nc_ht=scontent.fmrd1-1.fna&oh=00_AT-nLTgD96wpZGGo2Ki4tpYJg7yrU-eSZ_raYwwXj3az1g&oe=62D440AC)
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Nice piece of continuity.
Lalo is one of the best characters of all time, afaic. Amazing to watch.
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Goddammit I accidentally read a spoiler for Ep. 8, because I didn’t know the new episode was out already.
Oh and Better Call Saul >> Breaking Bad.
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Finally saw the episode, amazing!
I am glad I am not as smart as the writers, or the characters, I didn't see the whole episode coming. Come on, I should have realized that Lalo knew that you just can't walk up to Fring's house and shoot him, he must have known he was protected (congratulations to the guy whose job is be a stand-in for Fring and get assassinated in his place, btw).
I also thought that Kim was gonna plead with Gus, explaining the situation.... I figured that Gus would accept to pose with fake blood for a picture to "prove" to Lalo he was dead. Guess it's good I'm just a fan and not a writer, uh? :lol
One thing however I did figure out - seeing how Lalo was all guns blazing, I figured that he was not long for the show. I called it - this standoff couldn't have been dragged forever, my hunch was that he was going to die in this episode, or - like Hank in Ozymandias - at the beginning of the next one after a cliffhanger. At least I got this right.
Also - Kim was totally gonna shoot Gus. WTF. She was sent to have a chance to get out of the house, maybe go to the police, but no - she was gonna commit murder just like Jess killed Gale. Wow.
Imagine how Jimmy will be traumatized by these event. Mike straight told him that Lalo wasn't coming back, and four years later he's still afraid of Lalo, see the now infamous "It wasn't me, it was Ignacio" line to Walt and Jesse. Also, now we know how Jimmy knows Mike's skills as a cleaner, and why he sent him to Jesse's house after Jane died.
Now Lalo and Howard are out of the way, from now on it's all Jimmy / Saul / Gene!!! bring on the end!
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One thing to remember about Jimmy is that he still seems totally rattled by all of this crime and the idea of murder.
Fast forward to Breaking Bad where Saul never had an issue with it. In his first episode when he is talking to Walt and Jesse about the guy who takes the fall as Heisenberg and go to prison for them, he floats the idea of taking care of Badger in the chow line in prison (Jesse: "no shanking!" :lol)
So, a lot still has to happened between now and when BCS makes the jump to the BB timeline to where Jimmy becomes not only okay with crime, but recommending it without batting an eyelash.
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Hey, there has been a whole movie to retcon a plot hole of another one (I'm talking about Rogue One), I guess there are in-universe ways to reconcile Saul's attitude without too much trouble.
Couple ones:
- He was just testing the moral fiber of his new customers, just to take their measure and see if they are the kind of people who are ok with casual murder;
- Four years has been passed, and donning the Saul Goodman persona is a coping mechanism. You wear the mask long enough, you eventually become what you pretend to be.
Also, we still don't know what happens with Kim. Maybe that's the final blow who will make him go full Saul.
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Nica call backs shots
(https://preview.redd.it/3i76ebese4b91.jpg?width=1692&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f79e4014965b6bad7008d721f9e998c93245b4a7)
(https://preview.redd.it/r12o7bese4b91.jpg?width=1792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=466e1d8cd3ff425c85e5d34ab3f7db9594eea56d)
And this one too:
(https://i.redd.it/ptwa3b8yfeb91.png)
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still waiting for the Peter Gould quote to come in to play, but that may not happen until we find out Gene's fate.
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Hey, there has been a whole movie to retcon a plot hole of another one (I'm talking about Rogue One), I guess there are in-universe ways to reconcile Saul's attitude without too much trouble.
Couple ones:
- He was just testing the moral fiber of his new customers, just to take their measure and see if they are the kind of people who are ok with casual murder;
- Four years has been passed, and donning the Saul Goodman persona is a coping mechanism. You wear the mask long enough, you eventually become what you pretend to be.
Also, we still don't know what happens with Kim. Maybe that's the final blow who will make him go full Saul.
Perhaps, but just glossing over it instead of showing what really made Jimmy turn into full-fledged Saul who is totally cool with murder would be doing a disservice to the show, I think.
I suspect that with only five eps to go, the days of BCS doing a massive slowdown after something big are over. The foot will likely stay pressed on the gas pedal till the end.
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I thought there was a chance we were going to see Kim make an exit in the last episode as well. I thought that's what Saul was getting at when he was telling her to go.
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If that was the end for Ms. Wexler, I can live with it. Her conscience finally got the best of her. And Jimmy's true lack of one is why he became Saul Goodman full time.
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I gotta believe there's more.
Just seeing Howard's widow questioning both of them, they could still include more with her. Although she reminded me a bit of Hank's wife in that scene.
I also think there's a decent chance we'll see her in the Gene time frame per that has been a huge curiosity since the beginning of the show.
Where's Kim? Is she in any way in contact, or even somewhere near where Gene is, etc.
Omaha isn't incredibly far from her hometown.
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While I don't like them ignoring Cliff forgetting that Kim skipped the meeting the day Howard went off the rails in the Sandpiper deal, I think the Howard storyline is wrapped up. Kim's fake story seemed to finally make his widow see their truth.
Everything in the BCS timeline was seemingly wrapped up nicely, from Gus making things right with the cartel to Kim finally leaving Jimmy to Mike letting Nacho's father know that his son was gone, so the jump forward to, or close to, the BB timeline, which is what the end tonight seemed to be, seems right.
I think it is also important to remember that Saul did not pick Nebraska as his place to disappear. That was picked for him by Ed (the disappearer), so the theories out there that Saul picked Kim's hometown/home state as his place to live when in hiding to be close to her do not hold up. I think if we see Kim again, though, it will be in the post-BB Gene timeline.
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https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3032476/episodes?ref_=tt_eps_sm
just scan the Screencaps for the final 4 episodes, namely episode 6.11.
It seems that there's still some content with Kim left on these final 4 episodes.
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I appreciate the fact that there wasn’t (as of yet) some big to do with Kim’s resolution. For years there’s been theories and assumptions that she had to be dead or in jail…..or relocated by the vacuum guy. It’s practical and makes sense and fits with the arc of her character…..Howard’s death smacked her in the face and made her take a hard look at herself and Jimmy…..and she came to the conclusion we’ve all seen and known. It’ll be odd not seeing her character again if that is indeed the last time we see her…..but, it does fit.
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Rhea Seahorn's acting as Kim continues to amaze, she played it so well in that scene and was great the entire episode, you just had a feeling she wasn't the same right from the get go while Jimmy was sorta already on the mend ready to move on. I have to think we'll see her a bit more but their relationship is done. What an emotionally charged episode opposite of the previous one. The show knows how to do drama unlike any other.
You knew it was done when she kissed him after leaving the service.
I just read and also remembered a cool tidbit about Saul talking about the masturbating guy at the office at the end of the episode which in Breaking Bad was the mixup with Badger when Saul first meets him in prison asking why he masturbated in public lol.
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Yeah, I caught that about the public masturbator, but they didn't mention Starbucks, so I figured it wasn't the one he confused with Badger. :lol :lol
Agreed about Rhea Seehorn. It seems criminal that she just recently got her first Emmy nomination for her acting in this show.
I have to say that Don Eladio making fun of Hector's bell ringing was one of the funniest things in the history of the show. That made me LOL for real pretty hard.
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I love the symbolism. Two fathers lost their son. One is free, the other one is not so.
(https://i.redd.it/wq1vdjl0eic91.jpg)
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Wasn't there a man coughing in Saul's waiting room? I believe the episode ended right before Walter White entered Sau's office for the first time.
I guess I gotta check Reddit for that one, if that's true, it's a master trolling from the writers, to give the most possible cheesy ending (Walt entering Saul's office) at the end of an episode, and cutting right before it happens :D
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another thing I just noticed on imdb.
Mark Proksch who plays Daniel "Pryce" Wormald aka The Baseball Card guy, returns for 2 of the last 4 episodes
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1515989/
I wonder if he has anything to do with Gene being found in Omaha?..maybe the FBI (or US Marshalls? or whatever organization is in charge of fugitives MIA) went to him and he spilled what he knew?..although I don't think he had any interactions with Jimmy/Saul previously. He did with Mike of course, but in the Gene timeline, Mike's dead of course.
edit: he did work with Jimmy
see this montage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmk6z3qqfIw
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Refresh my memory, please.
What's a squat cobbler?
:lol
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Too bad Nacho had his guys take it to the chop shop, because who wouldn't love to see the below again? :lol
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/SMEb6qhNW7s/hqdefault.jpg)
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… did Gus get poisoned?
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Hard to believe that with only four eps left, they spent an entire one just to show that Jimmy is still running scams as Gene, but I have learned by now with this show that just when I think they have turned the corner and consistent greatness is coming, they will pull the rug out from under me. :lol :lol
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I'm sorry, but that episode was a total snoozefest.
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Yeah, that was a snooze, except for Carol Burnette.
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That episode was like season 1 BCS. Gene/Jimmy up to his old tricks and just spending time doing elaborate hijinks. I really liked it, I mean sure it was a very different change of pace. I dug it. I imagine the ending is going to be similar to this like how the show started and it sorta just fizzles away rather than some boombastic ending. Though who knows.
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I too am perplexed as to why an entire episode was dedicated to showing that Jimmy can still con anyone in any way, shape or fashion. All to honor his 'I'll take care of it myself' proclamation. With now only three episodes to go....seems like that time could have been better served but I'll withhold full judgment until the final curtain closes.....you never know what tiny detail or interaction from this episode will prove crucial later down the line.
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thumbs up on Carol Burnett.
Thumbs down on recasting Jeff.
Pat Healy does not look all that much like Don Harvey. He's even 11 years younger, lol.
Perhaps Harvey couldn't do it when they needed to film, or wanted more money?
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/90/Pat_Healy.jpg)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b7/Don_Harvey_at_the_Chiller_Theatre_Expo_2017.jpg)
I guess I was expecting a little more detail how he was going to "Fix it himself" rather than a blackmail scheme.
Also I wonder why those security guards, especially Nick, really didn't suspect any kind of extra motivation. Perhaps the whole emergency "If I die, I got nobody" speech supported that behavior/motivation.
Also I gotta wonder if Frank consuming a Cinnabon so often as he was doing with Gene, might wonder. He hardly looks like the healthiest guy, especially for his age. But what can you do? some people don't care and feel life is short. They may as well indulge on something while they still can.
I also wonder if by them having Gene "take care of it himself" and not use the Disappearer, I wonder if the death of Robert Forster dictated Gene changing his mind on not using him again.
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I went to the mall to get the wife an anniversary gift yesterday, walked by here, and had to buy one. Thank goodness, otherwise those scenes would have been
pure torture! :lol (and I hope she enjoys her present more...)
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/295247957_1252505231956854_1516151851889868420_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=ae9488&_nc_ohc=FRIaIJDqUYYAX8xK800&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=03_AVI_o3uSXsfEo4zHo1Zm0Q2yeN-yjdhrc34a_kzfZsq2qQ&oe=6305B66F)(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/294384676_404361625010858_1992994047159879428_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=ae9488&_nc_ohc=bjU12Z1MAfMAX-NE0FS&tn=YPJ3BeKtkBufcpah&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=03_AVKxj7SX9FAcHAscHTPv4Yb3tAQq8_nKcwdZ8CHJf7JA6A&oe=630499AD)
I met Don Harvey when I worked with his brother decades ago. He had quite a run, appearing in 'Eight Men Out' (as Swede Risburg), 'Die Hard 2', 'Better Off Dead', 'Casualties Of War'.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Harvey_(actor,_born_1960)
He was not available for BCS, because he had a main role in the HBO mini series 'We Own This City'. This was yet another excellent David Simon developed show ('The Wire') about the city police's brutally corrupt Gun Trace Task Force. Well worth a watch.
As to BCS and Jeff....hey, just give me some money, and I'll keep quiet. I'm not risking jail in that scheme. I was not keen with the Carol Burnett casting, but it was done perfectly. Whose to say she won't be the cause of Saul's downfall? The payoff for this episode better be something good, because my wife and I often complained throughout, but upon further review this morning have come around. Gene checking out the garish shirt and tie while walking around with a KC Royal bag was one of many nice touches (hated the snow field and the bull horn though).
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....except for.....''Slippin' Jimmy' almost being undone by a real slip and fall. We thought the ruse would end because the buffer would be out of his scheduled routine due to the scuff mark. And then his (phony) confession of loneliness and loss. There's always that one percent of real feeling, but the other 99% is all Saul.
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I think this ep was wonderful, he did all this to get rid of the only person that knows who Gene really is. I loved every minute.
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Guess the showrunners were expecting the blowback (https://ew.com/tv/better-call-saul-producer-on-gene-dangerous-move-nippy/)on this episode. I personally loved it but can see how it would derail the flow and expectations for some.
[Writer-producer] Gordon Smith hinted that these final episodes will throw some curveballs, take some big, weird swings, and take fans down some roads they don't see coming. So just when fans think they have their footing, should they stay on guard?
Well, that is certainly true of this episode. We did consciously defy expectations and we would never do that if it felt inorganic or forced; we really try to honor where the story wants to go and where the characters are moving. And it felt right to us to, finally, in this season — much later in the game than we're used to — go into Omaha world. Even though some could argue it was the wrong time. To us, it felt like it was the right time. [Laughs] We did acknowledge that people might be yelling at us either internally or out loud, but it seemed like it would be worth it in the end. I hope it was.
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I think this ep was wonderful, he did all this to get rid of the only person that knows who Gene really is. I loved every minute.
After sleeping on it for a night I really don't have any qualms with the episode and trust that it will/did benefit the story as it nears it's end.
What's strange is that was the episode they were filming when Odenkirk had his heart attack and he delivered that speech about being alone and could die at any moment etc etc. Weird.
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I think this ep was wonderful, he did all this to get rid of the only person that knows who Gene really is. I loved every minute.
After sleeping on it for a night I really don't have any qualms with the episode and trust that it will/did benefit the story as it nears it's end.
What's strange is that was the episode they were filming when Odenkirk had his heart attack and he delivered that speech about being alone and could die at any moment etc etc. Weird.
It's actually Episode (https://ew.com/tv/bob-odenkirk-heart-attack-point-and-shoot-episode/)8 'Point and Shoot' that Bob had the heart attack on.
But, as it turns out, that's not quite correct — and Odenkirk wants to set the record straight. The tragedy with a happy ending actually occurred during the filming of episode 8, "Point and Shoot,"
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I think this ep was wonderful, he did all this to get rid of the only person that knows who Gene really is. I loved every minute.
After sleeping on it for a night I really don't have any qualms with the episode and trust that it will/did benefit the story as it nears it's end.
What's strange is that was the episode they were filming when Odenkirk had his heart attack and he delivered that speech about being alone and could die at any moment etc etc. Weird.
It's actually Episode (https://ew.com/tv/bob-odenkirk-heart-attack-point-and-shoot-episode/)8 'Point and Shoot' that Bob had the heart attack on.
But, as it turns out, that's not quite correct — and Odenkirk wants to set the record straight. The tragedy with a happy ending actually occurred during the filming of episode 8, "Point and Shoot,"
Ahhh....thanks for the clarification. There were quite a few articles out this past week saying this was the episode.
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Guess the showrunners were expecting the blowback (https://ew.com/tv/better-call-saul-producer-on-gene-dangerous-move-nippy/)on this episode. I personally loved it but can see how it would derail the flow and expectations for some.
[Writer-producer] Gordon Smith hinted that these final episodes will throw some curveballs, take some big, weird swings, and take fans down some roads they don't see coming. So just when fans think they have their footing, should they stay on guard?
Well, that is certainly true of this episode. We did consciously defy expectations and we would never do that if it felt inorganic or forced; we really try to honor where the story wants to go and where the characters are moving. And it felt right to us to, finally, in this season — much later in the game than we're used to — go into Omaha world. Even though some could argue it was the wrong time. To us, it felt like it was the right time. [Laughs] We did acknowledge that people might be yelling at us either internally or out loud, but it seemed like it would be worth it in the end. I hope it was.
It was the worst timing, IMO. We've had our foot down on the accelerator and then the brakes were slammed for seemingly no reason. I know I called the episode a snoozefest, and I stand by that, but I don't think it was bad. It'd be like seeing The Police in concert only for Sting to come out and play that acoustic version of Don't Stand So Close To Me. It killed the flow of the season for me.
This should have a been a bonus episode for the fans. Dump it on us at Christmas or something as a wrap up, kind of like El Camino.
I really don't think I hated the episode all that much. It was cool for what it was, and I expected something along these lines (not a full episode though). It just felt so out of place given the season and was only done because "art". I hope I'm wrong and there's some huge payoff by the time the show wraps.
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Guess the showrunners were expecting the blowback (https://ew.com/tv/better-call-saul-producer-on-gene-dangerous-move-nippy/)on this episode. I personally loved it but can see how it would derail the flow and expectations for some.
[Writer-producer] Gordon Smith hinted that these final episodes will throw some curveballs, take some big, weird swings, and take fans down some roads they don't see coming. So just when fans think they have their footing, should they stay on guard?
Well, that is certainly true of this episode. We did consciously defy expectations and we would never do that if it felt inorganic or forced; we really try to honor where the story wants to go and where the characters are moving. And it felt right to us to, finally, in this season — much later in the game than we're used to — go into Omaha world. Even though some could argue it was the wrong time. To us, it felt like it was the right time. [Laughs] We did acknowledge that people might be yelling at us either internally or out loud, but it seemed like it would be worth it in the end. I hope it was.
It was the worst timing, IMO. We've had our foot down on the accelerator and then the brakes were slammed for seemingly no reason. I know I called the episode a snoozefest, and I stand by that, but I don't think it was bad. It'd be like seeing The Police in concert only for Sting to come out and play that acoustic version of Don't Stand So Close To Me. It killed the flow of the season for me.
This should have a been a bonus episode for the fans. Dump it on us at Christmas or something as a wrap up, kind of like El Camino.
I really don't think I hated the episode all that much. It was cool for what it was, and I expected something along these lines (not a full episode though). It just felt so out of place given the season and was only done because "art". I hope I'm wrong and there's some huge payoff by the time the show wraps.
It was 'out of character' for what the show has been for the past 5-1/2 seasons....which is.....most episodes are REALLY good. It was a 'ho hum' episode that sticks out because the series is so close to being wrapped up.
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I am sure it will make sense once we see how it all ends - it will be funny that after all of the stuff he did as Jimmy and Saul that was much worse, "Gene" gets busted for petty shoplifting because he just couldn't help himself - but it felt like an episode that would have made more sense earlier in the season.
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BTW, the coolest thing about the episode was the change in the opening intro song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fuc21B_eJow
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Now also Better Call Saul has a "Fly" episode :D
I liked it, I'm not gonna worship the episode but once you accept that the writers felt it was needed to dedicate an episode to Gene, it's kinda cool to see that he comes most alive when he goes back to be Slippin' Jimmy.
I truly have no idea how the last three episodes will go. You'd think we'd pass through the Breaking Bad era first, or that the taxi driver was a major source of conflict but now. What the hell is going to happen?
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Really all that's left is the lead up to raid on his house, no? That must have happened before Saul gets vacuumed away, otherwise, I think it'd have been in black and white. We know we're going to see something go down with the Vet and his black book (also based on the raid scene we saw).
At this point, I'm thinking anything involving Walter and Jessie isn't going to be integral to any plot point. It's just going to be a treat for the fans.
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At this point, I'm thinking anything involving Walter and Jessie isn't going to be integral to any plot point. It's just going to be a treat for the fans.
100% If I had to guess I'd say it'd be in the final moments of the show as well....maybe not final moments but final episode. There's really nothing there to 'add' by having them in the story, them being on the show is all fan service and a chance to see Jesse and Walt again.
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I don't think this is a spoiler, so I will put it out there:
The name of the next episode is: Breaking Bad
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I don't think this is a spoiler, so I will put it out there:
The name of the next episode is: Breaking Bad
Mirroring the Better Call Saul episode of BrBa :metal
So next episode we're gonna see Walt and Jesse, uh?
It would be cool if the episode was a fan service.... for Better Call Saul fans :lol I mean, I'd like to see some random scenes that contestualize what Saul's life became once a 50 years old chemistry teacher walked into his office, maybe some stuff we already know from different points of view: Mike finding Walt's whereabouts so that Saul can go to at his school, Gus learning of the blue meth, some behind the scenes discussions about Walt, maybe some new scenes of stuff we knew, but we didn't see.... something like that.
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Will be hilarious when the BCS called Breaking Bad is NOT the one with Walt and Jesse. :lol
I like the theory out there that Marion was on to Gene and is helping her son and that other guy him up. Let's face it, the bad guys in the BCS/BB universe always get what's coming to them, and make no mistake about it, Jimmy/Saul/Gene is a bad guy. What price he has to pay, we will know very soon.
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Browsing through BCS' Wikiquote and in the last episode of season 3, when Kim had her accident, there's this exchange:
Kim: I could've killed someone, Jimmy.
Jimmy: Yeah, yourself.
Don't worry Kim, if falling asleep at the wheel won't do it, maybe doing a long mean con will be the key!
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I don't know the reasons behind ¨Jeff¨ recast. But I was thinking of the last episode and I would like to believe that Jeff's re-cast in Better Call Saul is due to an issue of perception by Jimmy himself. As we saw before, Gene Takovic is more fearful and cautious. However, when he decides not to ask Mr. Vacuum again for service, he reverts back to being Saul Goodman a bit. It would be understandable that the intimidating and threatening image of the first Jeff is because Gene Takovic is afraid all the time and that's how he perceives him, as a threat. And this new image of him, much more meek and not at all intimidating, is because Saul has returned and is not afraid, he is aware that he still has the touch to resolve conflicts.
The truth is that I have not investigated anything about why the Re-cast, but I would love for this to be the reason.
Some interesting TRIVIA can be found on the IMDB link below:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt12187048/trivia/?ref_=tt_trv_trv
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Nope, the original actor was just unavailable :lol
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Nope, the original actor was just unavailable :lol
:lol I know, I just want to believe my thinking is the reason behind the recast.
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The authors said that aside from the actor himself, they didn't change anything from the script, so that was always the way it was meant to go down, but I have a hard time picturing the original Jeff being outsmarted that way. Maybe his arrogance was just a facade that would have crumbled down anyway once he saw Gene outsmarting him and basically almost threatening to bang his mom.
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I am sorry, but it has to be pointed out that in the Sunset episode of Breaking Bad, right after Hank calls Walt to see if he remembers Jesse Pinkman having an RV, Walt calls Saul and when he tells him that Hank knows about the RV, Saul's response was, "What RV?"
Yet, in the scene in tonight's BCS with Walt and Jesse, which felt like fan service and totally pointless, Saul went for a ride in the RV right after their first meeting together (when Walt and Jesse unmasked themselves).
Seems to me that he would remember that RV and not ask, "What RV?" The writers are usually pretty good at connecting the dots, but that's a serious blunder.
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Oh cmon man, that's what you're focusing on!? I mean yeah it's 99% fan service but honestly it was fine for me, it worked with the episode of the current timeline and the events they showed.
We got so much from that episode, This is now unknown territory with the post breaking bad world with Gene and things are not looking good by the looks of it. This is his breaking bad episode and I'm guessing we're done with main timeline of the show. Now it's flashbacks to breaking bad timeline and the current post-breaking bad world. Kim is out there! so is Huel and Francesca! I get a sense of where the next two episodes are going. I'm going to checkout of all theories now.
Forgive me but I thought that was a phenomenal episode. It's the artsy fartsy episodes of BCS I dig the most. It's got a lot of the season 1 vibes which truthfully I really loved.
Spoilers for the new episode, this post on reddit summed many of the observations pretty well, they keep adding more as and when people post about things noticed.
DabuSurvivor comments on Better Call Saul S06E11 - "Breaking Bad" - Post-Episode Discussion Thread (reddit.com) (https://old.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/wdzk26/better_call_saul_s06e11_breaking_bad_postepisode/iilblg4/)
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My jaw dropped seeing MICHAEL NESMITH's Tapioca Tundra come on, although I'm not overly shocked just remembering they used The Monkees "Going Down" in 1 of the Meth cooking montages in Breaking Bad. Thomas Schnauz is likely a fan.
Also funny to see Kevin Sussman aka Stuart from The Big Bang Theory make a cameo. I was thinking tho, even Jimmy likely wouldn't have done what Gene/Victor is about to do.
wasn't the scene where Walt and Jessie have Saul in the desert DURING THE DAY?..maybe I missed it, but it looked like it was dark out.
Also the whole "whose Lalo thing"..and not "whose Ignacio?"..although I recall when they introduced Lalo, it was all traced back to
Saul mentioning him to Walt and Jessie in the desert.
I do suspect Marion could ultimately be what gets Gene/Saul/Jimmy in the end.
Also beyond just an adrenaline rush/addiction, the whole conversation with Francesca and the $850K being gone, has Gene motivated to bring more $ in?..maybe to want to disappear?...it will be interesting to learn his motivations for pulling off these Identity-Theft-to-rich-asshole ruses. I.e...how much is it motivated by $ and why? etc..
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Oh cmon man, that's what you're focusing on!? I mean yeah it's 99% fan service but honestly it was fine for me, it worked with the episode of the current timeline and the events they showed.
Just an observation, not my main focus. Honestly, the Walt/Jesse scene was underwhelming, and probably the least best part of the episode. It just felt...off. However, considering Aaron Paul's hair line was starting to recede a decade ago and I doubt Cranston wanted to shave his head to do just one scene, it was a clever move to make their one scene the one where both had ski masks on covering their heads. Cranston nailed where Walt was at that point in the BB story, but it felt like Paul didn't quite nail the younger Jesse, although that could be the slight change in his voice and his face looking noticeably older throwing it off a tad.
I think Marion plays a large role in whatever brings Gene down. I can't imagine they brought Carol Burnett on to the show just to be the mom of some dope who is running a scam with Gene. Her role will be integral.
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Just an observation, not my main focus. Honestly, the Walt/Jesse scene was underwhelming, and probably the least best part of the episode. It just felt...off. However, considering Aaron Paul's hair line was starting to recede a decade ago and I doubt Cranston wanted to shave his head to do just one scene, it was a clever move to make their one scene the one where both had ski masks on covering their heads. Cranston nailed where Walt was at that point in the BB story, but it felt like Paul didn't quite nail the younger Jesse, although that could be the slight change in his voice and his face looking noticeably older throwing it off a tad.
Yeah....I was underwhelmed by their appearance....definitely felt like fan service and I think there was no real 'need' for that scene at all. I know they spent time flashing back and forward between timelines but it just seemed out of place. And as you said....Cranston was still very much Walt but Paul wasn't convincing as Jesse at all, especially for the time period they had that scene held in. But whatev's.
I dug the episode and it Jimmy finding out that all of his nest eggs were discovered and taken by the Feds definitely influenced him to start the hustle again. Problem for him is the 'crew' he's using is going to get him busted. As Kev pointed out a few posts ago....I don't believe this will be a big happy ending for Jimmy /Saul. Most likely outcome is he's behind bars in the final shot hustling someone for smokes...
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I agree that Bryan Cranston is amazing for turning on and off Walter White like a switch, while Aaron Paul just looked like his older self (and with a deeper voice).
Now Breaking Bad has an episode called Better Call Saul, and Better Call Saul has an episode called Breaking Bad... but it never occoured to me that it would also be the episode where "Gene" breaks bad. I guess he got bad news from his phone call and now he no longer cares about anything, he's becoming needlessly reckless and fixated. Just let go the cancer dude man (Hi Stuart from Big Bang Theory, btw), they already told you that the duct tape was removed and it's been too long since he was sedated. Let it go. His obstinacy was his "we're done when I say we're done" moment.
Also, it was inevitabile that, with the mirroring of titles, this episode would recall the BB one, with the desert scene.
And Mike got the honor of finally spelling out Walter's full name, six seasons into the prequel and three episodes away from the end :D
Me watching the scene...
"He's an high school chemistry teacher"
Me thinking: "Say it. Come on, say it"
"Walter Hartwell White"
"You're goddamn right" ;D
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my wife is pissed they used the demo of Tapioca Tundra which is only found on The Bird & the Bee Boxed Set from 2010 (being a massive Monkees and Nesmith fan, but she's not a BB nor BCS fan at all).
Only 1500 copies were made.
they explained a lot of hoops were jumped through trying to get access at the last minute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47u8GDC97CM
https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/the-monkees-fans-flip-out-mike-nesmith-demo-better-call-saul-tapioca-tundra.html/?fbclid=IwAR3KT76PTuaO1oFSU1Woo4aBb5gMCCVhjLkQ1N502NH6Z4l45_50dytJq2I
also Bob Odenkirk once portrayed Nesmith in Ben Stiller's "The Grungies" sketch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=togJvjdFg_8
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Interesting
https://screenrant.com/better-call-saul-francesca-phonecall-season-4-setup/
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Great stuff tonight.
I loved, loved, loved (!!) the way they went with Kim. While there is no excusing her despicable actions of the last season or so, she felt genuine remorse what she had done. That is more than we can say for Jimmy. Seeing him go down is going to be pretty satisfying.
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Great stuff tonight.
I loved, loved, loved (!!) the way they went with Kim. While there is no excusing her despicable actions of the last season or so, she felt genuine remorse what she had done. That is more than we can say for Jimmy. Seeing him go down is going to be pretty satisfying.
Yeah…..fantastic episode. Even when Kim was in Saul’s office signing the papers she realized he has crossed a line that she failed to get past.
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Agreed with the above! What really stood out for me this past episode was the acting by the leads. Just outstanding, so much emotion on the faces. God just one more to go.
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that scene, the ending of the sequence in the office was hard to watch. It was almost like he had no amount of care for her anymore.
It was bizarre to watch.
I'm not sure if the whole divorce kind of caused him to completely bury his feelings or in the window of time from when she left him til the time in there, he just lost some of his soul and how much he cared for her, which he seemed to have regained for a moment when Francesca told him she called and asked about him.
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Great stuff tonight.
I loved, loved, loved (!!) the way they went with Kim. While there is no excusing her despicable actions of the last season or so, she felt genuine remorse what she had done. That is more than we can say for Jimmy. Seeing him go down is going to be pretty satisfying.
Yeah…..fantastic episode. Even when Kim was in Saul’s office signing the papers she realized he has crossed a line that she failed to get past.
The duality of Kim's actions is intriguing. Her "turning herself in" isn't doing the right thing totally, as Cheryl pointed out that it will be difficult to prosecute, and as a former lawyer, Kim knows this. And she then knew that Mike and Gus were dead, as Jimmy said it to her on the phone, so she knew damn well that the only person left who could testify against her is Jimmy, and he is obviously in hiding. But now that she has turn her statement in, when Jimmy is caught, he can now go down for not only the crimes he committed as Saul Goodman, but for the cover-up of Howard's murder. It could be wild if we get a scene right near the end where Jimmy is shown in court and we see Kim take the stand to testify against him (similar to the end of the film Monster when Selby took the stand against Aileen).
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Did last night's episode air later than usual, or did it run long or something? I don't have cable, so I usually watch the next day on the AMC app. However, I realized it has a "Live TV option". I thought BCS started at 10, so at 10 I went to the live version of the app. A commercial was just ending and I thought the episode was starting with Jimmy at the bus stop. 15 minutes in and the credits rolled... I was so pissed :lol I thought I was starting the episode from the beginning. Luckily, the bulk of the episode had very little to do with the last 15 minutes.
Anyway, some very cool stuff in that episode. I really hate the black and white though.
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I think it has started at 9 pm EST / 8 pm CST this entire last season (I think it might have an hour later in earlier seasons, IIRC).
I think using the black and white for the current day events, rather than the past ones, has been a good way to do it, and the first shot of color in the Gene timeline being the reflection of the Saul commercial in his glasses was an amazing shot. That is like something you'd see in a film.
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A couple of articles I stumbled on last night with Vince Gilligan.
https://www.rollingstone.com/tv-movies/tv-movie-features/better-call-saul-vince-gilligan-final-episode-interview-1393644/
(from April) plans after BCS, a new Show he was/is working on:
https://www.indiewire.com/2022/04/vince-gilligan-new-show-1234715644/
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I think it has started at 9 pm EST / 8 pm CST this entire last season (I think it might have an hour later in earlier seasons, IIRC).
I think using the black and white for the current day events, rather than the past ones, has been a good way to do it, and the first shot of color in the Gene timeline being the reflection of the Saul commercial in his glasses was an amazing shot. That is like something you'd see in a film.
They seemed to rub salt in my wound in the most recent one :lol Starting with the 60 or so seconds of discussion revolving around the colors of the hard boiled eggs that we couldn't see, and then there was the office shot where people were playing solitaire. I remember being a kid and hating that I couldn't know which cards were which colors. You're right though, that scene with the reflection was brilliant. There are so many shots like that in this show (BB as well).
I felt like there were a lot of little nods in this episode. Did anyone else catch the automated parking system that used to be Mike's post?
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yes, that seemed obvious.
Also what was the deal with at least 1 part of the Kim scene back in Florida been SPLIT? like 2 scenarios, similar to the scene a few years ago showing activity from 2 scenarios (1 where and Kim and Jimmy are together, 1 where they are not).
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I thought Aaron Paul was more 'in character' as Jessie in that episode as well.....and I think it 'worked' as to the timing of Jessie being present in that moment. Obviously, it wasn't needed at all but it didn't feel out of place.
Jimmy is certainly paying for getting greedy and continuing on with the illegal crap after he had essentially taken care of Jeff. All he had to do was go back to laying low....but, we all know it was only a matter of time with him and that him just living a simple existence for the remainder of his life was never going to happen. If you look at just the 'current day' black and gray footage we've seen since the show began he's been watching old Saul tapes the entire time and basically daydreaming of the life he once had.....Jeff ID'ing him was just the opportunity he wanted to get a taste of the game again.
Tough to predict at this point but I'd say that the series could end with something as simple as him entering a jail cell and the door closing behind him. It'd be fitting, maybe not the most exciting ending ala BB but it'd fit for sure.
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I'll be damned. Missed that one! I thought the point of that scene was to be a call back to Kim doing that.
(https://preview.redd.it/8mb059l97og91.jpg?width=621&auto=webp&s=c3ba8bf3a704337b66901a48902c4451f37377db)
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Powerful lines that are more important now, on this final episodes:
(https://i.redd.it/am7d6nwglog91.png)
S6E12 paralleled with S1E1
(https://preview.redd.it/436saih68og91.jpg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e3470451ba6501678e076402250a4c4869a43488)
(https://preview.redd.it/oy4xyhh68og91.jpg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3422a74475a2f8a846c0a55d5aa9524617368552)
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Great, great episode. Really the point where all scenarios/timelines collide.
I love the black and white, the clarity of timelines is great, but the noir quality it lends just tickles me so much.
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I think it has started at 9 pm EST / 8 pm CST this entire last season (I think it might have an hour later in earlier seasons, IIRC).
I think using the black and white for the current day events, rather than the past ones, has been a good way to do it, and the first shot of color in the Gene timeline being the reflection of the Saul commercial in his glasses was an amazing shot. That is like something you'd see in a film.
They seemed to rub salt in my wound in the most recent one :lol Starting with the 60 or so seconds of discussion revolving around the colors of the hard boiled eggs that we couldn't see, and then there was the office shot where people were playing solitaire. I remember being a kid and hating that I couldn't know which cards were which colors. You're right though, that scene with the reflection was brilliant. There are so many shots like that in this show (BB as well).
I felt like there were a lot of little nods in this episode. Did anyone else catch the automated parking system that used to be Mike's post?
Yep, that was a nice touch, Kim glancing over at where Mike used to sit before passing through.
Gone last night as well was Kim's iconic ponytail!
And how sad is her life now, being in a relationship with a guy who repeats "yep" over and over during sex. :lol :lol
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I think it has started at 9 pm EST / 8 pm CST this entire last season (I think it might have an hour later in earlier seasons, IIRC).
I think using the black and white for the current day events, rather than the past ones, has been a good way to do it, and the first shot of color in the Gene timeline being the reflection of the Saul commercial in his glasses was an amazing shot. That is like something you'd see in a film.
They seemed to rub salt in my wound in the most recent one :lol Starting with the 60 or so seconds of discussion revolving around the colors of the hard boiled eggs that we couldn't see, and then there was the office shot where people were playing solitaire. I remember being a kid and hating that I couldn't know which cards were which colors. You're right though, that scene with the reflection was brilliant. There are so many shots like that in this show (BB as well).
I felt like there were a lot of little nods in this episode. Did anyone else catch the automated parking system that used to be Mike's post?
Yep, that was a nice touch, Kim glancing over at where Mike used to sit before passing through.
Gone last night as well was Kim's iconic ponytail!
And how sad is her life now, being in a relationship with a guy who repeats "yep" over and over during sex. :lol :lol
And working for that company and doing text revisions just as Howard used to punish her.
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Fantastic episode!
I 100% agree that Aaron Paul sold the Jesse vibe way, way better than the last episode. It also ties brilliantly how he came to trust Saul - remember in Breaking Bad how he sold Saul to Walter? paraphrasing from memory, "they had my bro, Emilio, dead to rights, and he made him walk", the "you need a criminal lawyer" scene.
So that's how he happened - Emilio wanted Saul, Jesse went to check him, he was hired, he let Emilio out, and Jesse learnt the benefit of having a "criminal lawyer".
It was jarring to see Kim with another man... but it was obvious that she would have moved on. Her "turning herself in" doesn't do much, but at least it might help to restore Howard's reputation.
And - do we even root for Saul, at this point? did we just see him ready and willing to murder an old lady? ok, he was a lawyer involved with drug lords but we never saw him do something so vile and disgusting as preparing to strangle an elder woman - the very morning after being equally ready to use a jar full of a dead dog's ashes to smash the head of a terminally ill man he just conned and robbed.
Obviously, a "Saul Goodman" being reported to the authorities will make everyone come storming down on him. We're in for an amazing ending!!!
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And - do we even root for Saul, at this point?
No. Just like with Walt at the end of Breaking Bad, he needs to die or get caught. Either not happening would be majorly disappointing. I suspect he will be caught, not die, and the sad life he was living will end up being sadder when it's being done behind bars. But he will have earned it.
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Walter died, Jesse escaped, Saul getting caught would be three different endings for three different characters.
Also I'd love to see some of the aftermath, maybe Kim testifying against him to restore Howard's reputation. They said the ending was going to be "psychological disturbing" so I don't see Gene riding off into the sunset.
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I forgot to point out the only short bit of comic relief, or attempt of it - when Gene was talking on the phone with Kim listing everyone who's dead, he said "Mike is dead, Fring is dead, Lalo is dead.... apparently....".
LOL, after all those years, he's still scarred by the event and he still doesn't fully, definitively, 101% believe Lalo is dead.
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I’m simultaneous excited, anxious and sad waiting for the finale. Man, this series is insane.
Have we considered Gene killing himself yet? Obviously I don’t know what will happen, but there’s absolutely no way ‘Saul Goodman’ will make it out unscathed. And he doesn’t really deserve to either. What a scumbag he has become. I think the last episode’s title says enough about what we can expect, but then again the writers have surprised us more often..
What were your favourite episodes of the entire series? Let’s look back a little before the finale. What a ride it has been!
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Vene/Jimmy/Saul will wear the read suit and will defend himself only to be exposed by Kim returning as a lawyer. I am hoping that’s what happens
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What were your favourite episodes of the entire series? Let’s look back a little before the finale. What a ride it has been!
It indeed has been a ride! it must be the weekly format but this season felt so long and 2-3 seasons combined in one, so much stuff happened!
The trilogy of episodes about Nacho... all the setup for the plot to frame Howard... Point and Execution which will go down as one of the greatest episodes of the entire BrBa universe.... and now all the Gene stuff!!! can you really believe that, if someone will eventually "binge" the show or even watch one episode per day, will go from Nacho to Howard to Gene in black in white in just 10 days?
Looking back, while I absolutely love the show and how it's headed, I sometimes miss the levity of the first season, which had two of my favorite lines / jokes:
"The only way that entire car is worth $500 is if there’s a $300 hooker sitting in it"
And (copy and paste from the Wikiquote, when Tuco breaks the legs of the skateboard twins)
"Cal: You—you are—you are the worst lawyer! The worst lawyer ever!
Jimmy: Hey, I just talked you down from a death sentence to six months' probation. I'm the best lawyer ever."
Also the Kettlemans were pure comedy gold, with all their disastrous schemes and Jimmy getting the best of them.
Obviously the high water mark of season 1 was Jimmy's confrontation of Chuck upon discovering HE was the asshole, not Howard.
SEASON 2... another great comedy moment came from Danny and the Squat Cobbler ordeal :lol also the whole switching documents with Chuck's meltdown / Sherlock-Holmesque deduction of how exactly Jimmy framed it was superb.
SEASON 3... Chicanery is a monumental episode, and all the ensuing drama leading to that lantern final scene.
SEASON 4... We got Lalo! no specific episode stands out but man, the Ziegler scenes were so intense and sad.
SEASON 5... Bagman is another monumental episode, among all the rising tensions between Gus and Lalo. And the following Bad Choices Road, with the "tell me again" scene.
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"You're not a real lawyer!"
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I'll honestly be shocked if this series ends in any way other than Saul ending up in prison. He is a "criminal" lawyer after all. Walt died and Jessie escaped (we assume). I don't see him getting either of those endings, especially since he already had his shot on the run.
I know it's a small detail, but I'm still hung up on the vet's black book with the weird language in it. We never saw Kim or Saul obtain that, right? But we know the fuzz found it when Saul's mansion was being raided. Are we to assume that's how Saul knew about the vacuum guy? For a while I thought that was going to be Kim's ticket out, thinking she would be in more danger than she ended up being in.
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I'll honestly be shocked if this series ends in any way other than Saul ending up in prison. He is a "criminal" lawyer after all. Walt died and Jessie escaped (we assume). I don't see him getting either of those endings, especially since he already had his shot on the run.
You "assume"? you didn't watch El Camino, didn't you? :D
Anyway I agree that it's very unlikely that the third major protagonist of this universe gets the same ending as one of the main two. I wonder however how he will face prison - in a bittersweet way? as in, he accepts he has to pay and maybe, dunno, he becomes a reference in jail for other people giving legal counsel and feels at ease being the "Saul Goodman for the inmates"? or Kim testifies against him and he goes to jail a miserable and bitter man, maybe hurting Kim in a "I watched Jane die" way?
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I saw and loved El Camino, but Jessie is still young, and he's going somewhere with zero support system, like Saul. For all we know, 5-10 years later, Jessie was back in the game and doing his thing.
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I saw and loved El Camino, but Jessie is still young, and he's going somewhere with zero support system, like Saul. For all we know, 5-10 years later, Jessie was back in the game and doing his thing.
I don't think that'd be the case. Jesse was trying pretty hard to escape the clutches of Walt for a while before it all went down but he couldn't shake him.....largely due to his sense of loyalty to him. I get the impression from his character and the way things ended that it was indeed a 'fresh' start. Could totally envision him just living out his life where he was at in a salt of the earth type job with a wife and kids. I don't think he had the same 'drive' or was 'attached' to that lifestyle like Walt or Gus had.
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Also, it's a show / movie. "Happily ever after" is an unwritten rule. Of course if it all was real bad things could happen to him, but since the movie ended with him escaping, we can assume he will have a tranquil and somehow happy life from now on.
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I saw and loved El Camino, but Jessie is still young, and he's going somewhere with zero support system, like Saul. For all we know, 5-10 years later, Jessie was back in the game and doing his thing.
I don't think that'd be the case. Jesse was trying pretty hard to escape the clutches of Walt for a while before it all went down but he couldn't shake him.....largely due to his sense of loyalty to him. I get the impression from his character and the way things ended that it was indeed a 'fresh' start. Could totally envision him just living out his life where he was at in a salt of the earth type job with a wife and kids. I don't think he had the same 'drive' or was 'attached' to that lifestyle like Walt or Gus had.
True, but Jesse, long before he started working Walt, was a deadbeat whose was cooking and selling meth. He never would have risen to what he did without Walt, but remember the scam he ran at the intervention in trying to sell meth to those in recovery? That is who he is. I don't think it's realistic that he will move to Alaska and give up being a petty criminal, but his El Camino "happy ending" leaves it open-ended, so I get why a more optimistic view of his future is a bit more comforting. :)
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Just saw on FB a post that says the last ep is going to have a runtime of 1h 38 mins.
I hope is true.
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yeah, I forget if it was on TheVividKiwi on YouTube or on the BCS Insider Podcast where they mentioned the Series Finale is going to be extended.
Honestly, if it is relevant, I'd have gone for it to be 2 hours aka a Double episode, but whatever. The last few episodes all have felt so closely connected, the writers/producers might have originally wrote them all as 1 long episode and split them up.
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This is a double episode though. Most of the episodes have been around 50 minutes, so essentially 1h38 is twice that.
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Haha this is fantastic! I love the last second of Howard here
https://fb.watch/eWiKkE3Equ/
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I'm so excited, yet I know half the world will see it in a few hours and I have to wait until tomorrow evening, so I'm just not going to check this thread at all and avoid social media/
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Very sad.
Jimmy was the lovable scoundrel. Saul was a bit tarnished, but some traits could be overlooked. He always retained that soft spot for the old folks. His speech at the reinstatement hearing and then his 'suckers' comments afterwards to Kim were the real beginning of the downward slide. 'Charlie Hustle's' hatred of Howard wouldn't cease, and that caused both his and Kim's ultimate downfalls. He didn't deserve the desert trek with Mike, or all that followed.
Last week's Kim ABQ scenes were gut wrenching (trivial....we did the BB/BCS tour five years ago, as my stepdaughter was working at Los Alamos. Also rode that rental car shuttle back to the airport). My wife has a Univ. of American Samoa tee shirt, I've got a 'S'all good, man' tee, we've got Saul, Gus, and Mike bobbleheads, a mini meth RV, a 'Heisenberg/Goodman' 2016 coffee mug....
....and no other weekly shows to watch after tonight.
Fortunate that Jimmy's affections for the elderly remained in tact. I'm guessing we'll see Kim see him through jail cell bars tonight, and then another future scene set in 'our' present.
Oh, and kudos to Vince Gilligan's limo driver for hooking him up with Carol Burnett. I did NOT like her casting, as I want to see the 'character', and not know the person.........but she has been perfect.
It's only a TV show, but.... :sad:
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Whew. Fantastic ending. I didn't always like the pace of the show, but overall, a damn fine show from start to finish, and dare I say, that is one of the better finales of any TV drama ever.
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That finale was the most apt finale for the character. S'all good man!
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Loved the Finale……loved the series. Great stuff.
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what it kind of lacked in action and maybe a bit of drama, it kind of made up in nostalgia and really revisiting and summarizing the entire show and even character in BB.
I guess it seems he gets more or less all of his guilt off his chest, almost like he confessed to the judge. And then he goes to prison and is well liked by the other inmates.
He's more or less found peace.
That I think is what the ending left me satisfied about.
He and Kim seem to be at peace and still alive.
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That really was a perfect finale. Well done.
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Great finale, yes, but one interesting note: I was surprised to not see Anna Gunn there as Skyler. Seems like she would have shown up to support her sister, but maybe Gunn wasn't available, so they wrote in Steve's wife to be there with Marie in court. Hard to say. Given that Saul and Skyler directly worked together, him seeing her again could have been another great little moment.
And hey, by appearing last night, Marie has the unique distinction of being only one of two characters to appear in the series finales of both Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul (Walter White being the other).
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Great finale, really tied a bow nicely on the whole BB/BCS universe. I loved the scene with Walter and Saul in the basement, really got to see Bryan Cranston flex those muscles one last time. What stood out in the last few scenes was just how much both Bob Odenkirk and Rhea Seehorn were able to do with small changes in their facial expressions.
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Bob Odenkirk and Rhea Seehorn were able to do with small changes in their facial expressions.
Not only that but the show did a great job with the make-up and way they presented the characters. The scenes of Kim in the 'Florida' era of her life she looked disheveled and just 'frumpy' and like life had beat her down. The closing scene with her in the prison with Saul she looked refreshed and more 'together'. Whereas....Jimmy was the opposite....he looked 'defeated'.
I really liked how the whole episode (time travel/regrets) ....and really a bulk of the last season or two....had set Jimmy up as this heartless asshole who cared about nothing. But in the end...he 'came clean' and made sure to clear Kim, and go on record about how he felt about turning his back on his brother. 'Saul' or 'Gene' could have ripped that Life Lock necklace off her neck and he'd have had a good head start to escape but even then his 'heart' was taking over. Despite being a real POS by the end it was good to see Jimmy get to 'confess' and try and make things right.
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Agreed, it was a lot more optimistic ending than I imagined, the acting chops of Kim and Jimmy were just fantastic in that final episode. BCS has always been more of a slowburn and artsy type of show in contrast to Breaking Bad, but both are done so well in their own way. I was very happy with that finale and really am looking forward to watching everything again. Hard to say if it has beat BB for me but I don't care to rate them, I will enjoy both of them and maybe even just treat it as one giant show.
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Jimmy's future story according to Bob Odenkirk
How does the story continue in your head? When do they see each other next?
I think she comes to see him! I think she comes to see him once a year — every other year at the least. And I think he helps a bunch of guys in prison to get out who are innocent, or he helps shorten their sentences. He gets treated really well. And I don't think he gets out early…-ish. I don't think he gets out. I don't know what kind of dispensation they have for an 80-year-old, but I believe they have some, once you get to be that age where you can do something else. But I think he's kind of the king of the prison because he's a really, really good lawyer and a great lawyer for the kind of people in there. And he puts that to good use, probably even does some good work, like, genuinely good work. And then I think they see each other and I think he thinks she should stay married to that guy and have a life. I don't know what she does, though. She doesn't seem very happy at the water place.
https://ew.com/tv/better-call-saul-bob-odenkirk-on-series-finale/?utm_source=smsshare&utm_medium=sms&utm_campaign=sms-share-article&utm_content=20220816
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Jimmy's future story according to Bob Odenkirk
How does the story continue in your head? When do they see each other next?
I think she comes to see him! I think she comes to see him once a year — every other year at the least. And I think he helps a bunch of guys in prison to get out who are innocent, or he helps shorten their sentences. He gets treated really well. And I don't think he gets out early…-ish. I don't think he gets out. I don't know what kind of dispensation they have for an 80-year-old, but I believe they have some, once you get to be that age where you can do something else. But I think he's kind of the king of the prison because he's a really, really good lawyer and a great lawyer for the kind of people in there. And he puts that to good use, probably even does some good work, like, genuinely good work. And then I think they see each other and I think he thinks she should stay married to that guy and have a life. I don't know what she does, though. She doesn't seem very happy at the water place.
Seems like a pretty realistic take on what would go down and how it'd play out for Jimmy going forward.
To think, had he not tried to get the Ice Cream on Fridays and learned that Kim had already provided the Howard reveal he'd most likely have not 'confessed' and been out in 7-8 years.
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:(
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They did it. They ended it masterfully!!!
I did not see it coming. I could envision Saul going to prison and more or less thriving in it, but the "confession"... that surprised me. The only person who could defeat Saul Goodman was.... Saul Goodman. Or better, Jimmy McGill. Kim owning up to her mistakes was what finally made him realize that he had to pay as well for all he did. Awesome ending.
It was also great to see again Marie and obviously Chuck. I knew Walter White was coming back one last time, but those two other cameos were a surprise. Interesting how even Walter White got it - "so you have always been this way?".... and funny how Jimmy could have answered back about his regrets. Walt's regret is not all the trail of death and ruin he left in his wake... it wasn't even "not dying at the right time" like he once told to Jesse... no, he's still bitter and resentful about Grey Matters. Which we knew, of course, but we got a final reminder of how he was just a bitter man out to prove the world he could build an empire.
I was ready for the show to end with the shot of Jimmy and Kim sharing a cigarette in prison. The two of them together, like in the first episode, and a light hearted joke from Jimmy. It would have been perfect. Ok, the final shot was poignant (was it cheesy to expect the color to return?), but if they ended with the shot of Jimmy and Kim in the cell, I probably would have applauded like I did with Breaking Bad's ending.
Speaking of Breaking Bad's ending, we didn't get this time around a memorable and iconic closing song such as Baby Blue! my enjoyment of the series is ruined :P
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I loved the closing shot. Kim turns the corner and looks back at Jimmy, whose face is the last thing we see before he falls out of her vision as she keeps walking.
While he is not looking forward to dying in prison (86 years means he won't live until whenever he could get out with good behavior), Jimmy did take great satisfaction in knowing that he talked his way down to 7 years before his confession. It was, in essence, his last con. And, like always, he pulled it off masterfully.
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The more I think about it, the more I feel that was a near-perfect finale, great drama, cameos that gave additional depth, Jimmy's whole arc in just the episode was stuff you could fill a whole season. Everything neatly tied without really feeling out of place or gratuitous. Just excellent.
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I loved the closing shot. Kim turns the corner and looks back at Jimmy, whose face is the last thing we see before he falls out of her vision as she keeps walking.
While he is not looking forward to dying in prison (86 years means he won't live until whenever he could get out with good behavior), Jimmy did take great satisfaction in knowing that he talked his way down to 7 years before his confession. It was, in essence, his last con. And, like always, he pulled it off masterfully.
Yeah. I’m now thinking that Jimmy never intended to not confess. But, that….like you mention…..he just wanted to prove that he ‘could’ basically get away with it all. Which that original sentence would have accomplished.
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I loved the closing shot. Kim turns the corner and looks back at Jimmy, whose face is the last thing we see before he falls out of her vision as she keeps walking.
While he is not looking forward to dying in prison (86 years means he won't live until whenever he could get out with good behavior), Jimmy did take great satisfaction in knowing that he talked his way down to 7 years before his confession. It was, in essence, his last con. And, like always, he pulled it off masterfully.
Yeah. I’m now thinking that Jimmy never intended to not confess. But, that….like you mention…..he just wanted to prove that he ‘could’ basically get away with it all. Which that original sentence would have accomplished.
I think he planned to confess, so long as Kim showed up, but had she not, I don't think he would have confessed. For as much as he came off like Slippin' Jimmy during the negotiations, you could almost see the humanity come back into his face when he saw Kim in court. And when he was done confessing, he sat down and then turned around in his seat and looked right at her. It was almost like he was seeking her approval for what he had just done. In a way, Jimmy always knew he who he was. He knew he was a con man, but he thought Kim was better than him, which is why he was always so hesitant about her ideas to go the extra miles for example with the Howard scam, because, in his mind, she was better than that. To a large degree, I think he viewed her as the kind of person he wishes he could be.
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The way I interpreted, Jimmy totally planned to get away with it. He even said that in reply to the lawyer, "how do you plan to come out of this?", he said "on top, like always".
So he was actually able to get his way, and get just 7 years in prison. Only when he learnt that Kim confessed about Howard he changed his mind, and realized that Kim really went through with "turning herself in first", as he spitefully suggested during their phone call.
He finally, at long last, realized that he had to change and to pay for his crimes, so he threw his deal to the wind owning up to what he did, and clearing Kim. Seven years of prison and a life alone? no, better to die in jail but knowing he did Kim right, and showed her he still cared for her and he was able to owning up to his mistakes.
Also, what a big, gigantic F U to Walter White. A man so consumed by "his pride and ego" (RIP Mike) outed as someone who would have been dead or in jail in a month, had it not been for Saul Goodman guiding him, mentoring him and introducing him to Gus. I don't know how famous Saul's "confession" will become in-universe, but what a way to ruin the legacy of the great, terrible Heisenberg. Screw you Walt, that's payback for being a condescending, uptight asshole when someone asks you about a time machine :D
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That’s a great interpretation and how I felt about Jimmy’s actions as well.
There was a lot of symbolism in this episode and some stuff was awesome. Giving Mike a final scene, even though we know he’ll die in BB, so what he said makes it a little sad. Walter’s final scene - as people predicted in the safe house!! - was amazing. That was definitely end-of-BB Heisenberg we got. It showed us that Walter was always a miserable person. In essence his final remark to Saul, also applies to himself. And then we got the ‘McGill. My name is James McGill’ scene which was fabulous. He killed Saul himself, the moment he said out loud that he felt reaponsible for his brother’s death. I was nearly crying and then WE GOT CHUCK. Biggest surprise of the entire season, honestly.
We all knew this wouldn’t end well, and this is not a typical finale in any way, but then again, this was not your average show either. I watched Breaking Bad only when it had already finished. I started Better Call Saul from the first episode onwards. 6-7 years of amazing television ended. I’m sad, and greatly thankful. What a ride.
Two things:
Better Call Saul > Breaking Bar
Nobody helped out poor Jeffie :lol
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Eh, my stance is that it's impossible to properly judge the two shows since one is a spinoff and stands on the shoulder of the show that came before.
When Vince and Peter will do another show, that will be a fair comparison, but Better Call Saul benefits from the characters and the fandom of Breaking Bad, plus of the years of experience the writers gained while writing Breaking Bad.
By all means everyone is entitled to prefer one show over the other, but BCS had a good head start, while BrBa had to built everything from scratch. It didn't have characters, a fandom and the experience of the writers in that fictional universe already served on a silver plate.
Nobody helped out poor Jeffie :lol
Also Better Call Saul had to have a "What will become of Huell" moment :D
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That is absolutely true, so in that sense I agree that it's an unfair comparison. That said, I think that while BCS definitely benefited from the Breaking Bad world already existing, it also managed to add a lot to it. I found the pacing of Better Call Saul to be better as well; things unfolded rather slowly, but there were also multiple things happening at the same time (it wasn't necessarily just Saul) and more than one storyline to follow, and those occasionally intertwined, whereas Breaking Bad was basically all about one man and what happened around him.
Yes, the comparison is unfair, but also my enjoyment of watching Better Call Saul was higher than with Breaking Bad (which, for the record, already set an incredibly high bar).
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Great wrap up to the series. I still don't like how the last four episodes were handled, but it was still good and the kind of ending I think we all needed. It was kind of poetic seeing an elderly woman take down Saul seeing as the exploitation of one kind of got Saul on his feet in law. I was so happy to see Chuck get a final scene. I had a feeling we were going to get one more with Walter because Jessie got a solo spot, but Chuck caught me off guard. So did Marie! Was not expecting to see her at all. Speaking of Walter, hats off to BC as an actor. Man, that guy stepped right back into that role like he never left.
I really enjoyed this series, and it's a shame how many people I know who bailed early on because it was too slow. I can't wait to go back an re-watch this in a year or two after I forget half of the little things that happened.
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I am glad Jeff was not mentioned after Jimmy was caught. He was a doofus whose character was no longer an integral part of the plot once Jimmy was arrested. Great decision.
I also liked how they didn't insult our intelligence by having Jimmy become some street smart criminal who was able to evade the cops for any duration. He was a con man and a criminal lawyer, not a savvy street smart guy, so getting caught right away made a ton of sense.
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Great wrap up to the series. I still don't like how the last four episodes were handled, but it was still good and the kind of ending I think we all needed.
See it this way: Better Call Saul ended with Kim and Jimmy splitting up, fueling his full descent into the Saul Goodman persona.
The last four episodes are an epilogue for Breaking Bad, and closure for Kim's character arc.
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Also, what a big, gigantic F U to Walter White. A man so consumed by "his pride and ego" (RIP Mike) outed as someone who would have been dead or in jail in a month, had it not been for Saul Goodman guiding him, mentoring him and introducing him to Gus. I don't know how famous Saul's "confession" will become in-universe, but what a way to ruin the legacy of the great, terrible Heisenberg. Screw you Walt, that's payback for being a condescending, uptight asshole when someone asks you about a time machine :D
Very true....and while Jimmy was saying this and making this point I was thinking to myself he's just saying this to try and make himself look good and for his own ego boost. But then, when you really consider everything he said....he's spot on. Heisenberg never exists without 'Saul', plain and simple.
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That's what the authors probably meant when they said that we would have seen Breaking Bad under a new light. Yeah, Walter was the protagonist, but we now know Saul Goodman had a bigger role in creating Heisenberg than any of us realized.
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It's really rare that a show I like ends up giving me everything I wanted and more as it sticks the landing. Even more impressive that a prequel/sequel was able to do it.
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What a show BCS was. Great, great stuff. Changed the way I see TV. Loved it. Going to miss it.
And, even though I guess they wouldn't want to risk their record, I fancy a Take The Fall Saul series from prison. :biggrin:
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It went beyond my wildest expectations.
I don't really remember what I thought about it when it was announced - I've seen Breaking Bad over the course of a year only after it has finished (I saw it from 2013 to 2014), and Better Call Saul was just a fun show to follow whenever it came out. I remember "binging" the first seasons only after they were released (I consider binging wathcing one episode per day), this is the only one I followed in real time if I remember correctly.
Anyway, I thought it would have been "just" the origin story of Saul Goodman. Jimmy slowly becomes Saul, and we see him doing Goodman-ish things, with some added bonus from seeing Mike and Gus.
I would have never anticipated it would become the giant it turned out to be. Probably not even the writers did - I expected it all to be with the same levity of the first season, that it would have all been skateboard twins and Kettlemans. What a glorious ride it has been.
The writers are basically the Dream Theater of TV shows, they could have done - like it was their initial idea - a comedy with week by week cases by Saul Goodman, but no, they had to create a compelling drama on par with Breaking Bad, just like DT told themselves "let's write a short epic" and came out instead with Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence :D
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That's what the authors probably meant when they said that we would have seen Breaking Bad under a new light. Yeah, Walter was the protagonist, but we now know Saul Goodman had a bigger role in creating Heisenberg than any of us realized.
I don't agree with this part. I think it was obvious watching Breaking Bad that Saul was integral in helping Walt. Without Saul, who knows what happens when Badger got arrested, and without Saul, Walt never gets hooked up with Gus. That was clear as day when watching BB.
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BCS items for auctions
https://propstoreauction.com/auctions/catalog/id/342
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That's what the authors probably meant when they said that we would have seen Breaking Bad under a new light. Yeah, Walter was the protagonist, but we now know Saul Goodman had a bigger role in creating Heisenberg than any of us realized.
I don't agree with this part. I think it was obvious watching Breaking Bad that Saul was integral in helping Walt. Without Saul, who knows what happens when Badger got arrested, and without Saul, Walt never gets hooked up with Gus. That was clear as day when watching BB.
Yeah....I think those who watched BB understood that Saul was a cornerstone and vital part of what Walt was doing......but maybe what MirrorMask meant was that Jimmy's confession really drove home the point as to just how vital he was. It was glossed over a bit in BB....BCS demonstrated the true importance of his role.
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That's what the authors probably meant when they said that we would have seen Breaking Bad under a new light. Yeah, Walter was the protagonist, but we now know Saul Goodman had a bigger role in creating Heisenberg than any of us realized.
I don't agree with this part. I think it was obvious watching Breaking Bad that Saul was integral in helping Walt. Without Saul, who knows what happens when Badger got arrested, and without Saul, Walt never gets hooked up with Gus. That was clear as day when watching BB.
Yeah....I think those who watched BB understood that Saul was a cornerstone and vital part of what Walt was doing......but maybe what MirrorMask meant was that Jimmy's confession really drove home the point as to just how vital he was. It was glossed over a bit in BB....BCS demonstrated the true importance of his role.
I think it was more directed at the people in that universe. Sure, to us it was pretty clear. But the people in that court room.. Marie, Kim... probably even the judge, thought Walt played a much larger role than he actually did. I'm sure part of it was an omission of guilt, but probably a flex too. Saul loved showing off his talent (thinking job interview scene). He did all that and then, while representing himself, got the prison sentenced dropped down to just seven years. He won. He was the best. I think part of him wanted everyone to know that. Part of him needed that credit.
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That's what the authors probably meant when they said that we would have seen Breaking Bad under a new light. Yeah, Walter was the protagonist, but we now know Saul Goodman had a bigger role in creating Heisenberg than any of us realized.
I don't agree with this part. I think it was obvious watching Breaking Bad that Saul was integral in helping Walt. Without Saul, who knows what happens when Badger got arrested, and without Saul, Walt never gets hooked up with Gus. That was clear as day when watching BB.
Yeah....I think those who watched BB understood that Saul was a cornerstone and vital part of what Walt was doing......but maybe what MirrorMask meant was that Jimmy's confession really drove home the point as to just how vital he was. It was glossed over a bit in BB....BCS demonstrated the true importance of his role.
I think it was more directed at the people in that universe. Sure, to us it was pretty clear. But the people in that court room.. Marie, Kim... probably even the judge, thought Walt played a much larger role than he actually did. I'm sure part of it was an omission of guilt, but probably a flex too. Saul loved showing off his talent (thinking job interview scene). He did all that and then, while representing himself, got the prison sentenced dropped down to just seven years. He won. He was the best. I think part of him wanted everyone to know that. Part of him needed that credit.
Yeah....great post Brian. Wasn't really considering the aspect that Jimmy stated all of that for the folks in the room and the government....who were all under the assumption that Walt was the mastermind of it all. Probably was a bit of an 'ego' thing for Jimmy to clarify how important he was....and, also....needed to be known for his confession to mean the most it could mean.
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I like the way they ended the show, but not so much how the show ended. I liked Kim, and her life was just so sad and pointless after Howard. Unlike most people, I don't blame them for Howard's death. As she told his cunt ex-wife, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, and he was there because he drunkenly showed up to berate them. Their sin was destroying his legacy, not causing his death. That is certainly an awful thing, but not worth what she subjected herself to. It seemed to me like she should have been able to get her life back on track, but instead she just gave up.
As for Jimmy spending the rest of his life in jail, I don't guess I have a problem with it, but it sure seems like he should have been able to save Kim (and in truth, I'm not sure what he actually saved her from--a pointless civil suit?), and still get a decent deal. Honestly, none of that made a lot of sense to me, except as a plot device to allow him to confess his sins.
Oddly, it bugs me that after all of this people still think Walter killed Hank and Gomie. Not once did anybody ever point out that it was the scumbag white supremacists. Seems like that would be one of the secrets that somebody used as leverage. Even Skyler and her worthless son thought he killed Hank.
Nacho went out like a fucking boss. I loved to see that. I liked the guy, and though he had to die, I was hoping it'd be a good death. That exceeded my expectations by miles. I love it when people go out with a final act of defiance, and that was one of the best I've seen.
I can't imagine how people watched this week by week. The fact that I was able to watch Plan and Execution and Point and Shoot all at once made the whole thing so much better. That was seriously as good as TV gets. Putting a break between the two parts was unconscionable, I think.
It's the details that matter. On his way down Howard smashed his head on the coffee table. It happened so quickly it was hard to catch, but that one thing greatly increased the shock value of his sudden execution.
Kim trying to not be the one to leave in Point and Shoot was Seehorn's finest hour. Just a wonderful performance. It's not surprising that's where Odenkirk had his heart attack.
Kim and Mike having a sitdown was great. It's so rare when to major characters meet for the first time like that. And when he said that she was made of sterner stuff it immediately clicked in my head. There was no way they wouldn't be proving that. They did so when she was absolutely going to clip Fring to save Jimmy.
It was fun to see another example of just how good Mike is as a cleaner. Even though he got totally played by Lalo, dealing with the aftermath of the whole thing was one of his finest hours as a character. That dude's damn good at his job.
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Oddly, it bugs me that after all of this people still think Walter killed Hank and Gomie. Not once did anybody ever point out that it was the scumbag white supremacists. Seems like that would be one of the secrets that somebody used as leverage. Even Skyler and her worthless son thought he killed Hank.
That info is known though, isn't it? The last time Walter saw Skyler, when she let him hold Holly, he gave her that lottery ticket. The numbers of which corresponded to the GPS coordinates of where Hank was buried. He told her the story about how his money was out there, stolen, and then ended up being where Hank and Gomez were laid. I think he even instructed her to use it as a bargaining chip.
I can't imagine how people watched this week by week.
I was wondering when you were going to chime in :lol
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Oddly, it bugs me that after all of this people still think Walter killed Hank and Gomie. Not once did anybody ever point out that it was the scumbag white supremacists. Seems like that would be one of the secrets that somebody used as leverage. Even Skyler and her worthless son thought he killed Hank.
That info is known though, isn't it? The last time Walter saw Skyler, when she let him hold Holly, he gave her that lottery ticket. The numbers of which corresponded to the GPS coordinates of where Hank was buried. He told her the story about how his money was out there, stolen, and then ended up being where Hank and Gomez were laid. I think he even instructed her to use it as a bargaining chip.
He told here where it happened, and how to use it for leverage, but my recollection was that he never really explained how he died, and the impression was still that he killed Hank.
I was wondering when were going to chime in :lol
I watched it over 3 sittings this week. Funny story. . . I downloaded the whole thing about a week ago thinking it had ended. Waterworks was the last episode available and I thought that was it. I was pissed off at it ending on a cliffhanger. VG is simply better than that. It wasn't until I read through this thread and got nearly caught up that I figured out there was another episode. That was right around my normal bedtime. I decided that I couldn't not finish it last night, and what's another 55 minutes. Little sleepy this morning. :lol
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I can't imagine how people watched this week by week.
I was debating waiting for the whole show to end and then catchup, I just couldn't do it. In a way I'm glad but also jealous of those who can wait.
It's the details that matter.
This show is a joy with those details, I can't wait to re-watch the whole thing again and pay attention, they have so many things in there that truly elevate the entire series. I think they try to not go the extremely predictable route. Like I think it was season 3? when Kim had her accident, the way that scene was edited made it so effective and shocking, made it more jarring than show the whole car crash realtime.
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I like the way they ended the show, but not so much how the show ended. I liked Kim, and her life was just so sad and pointless after Howard. Unlike most people, I don't blame them for Howard's death. As she told his cunt ex-wife, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, and he was there because he drunkenly showed up to berate them. Their sin was destroying his legacy, not causing his death. That is certainly an awful thing, but not worth what she subjected herself to. It seemed to me like she should have been able to get her life back on track, but instead she just gave up.
I think this will be a hotly debated argument, with different points of view based on one's own experience, morals, and judgement.
I totally consider Kim and Jimmy responsable for Howard's death. Of course they didn't mean it, and of course they didn't pull the trigger nor they could have ever imagined Lalo was there. But, unintended consequences are still consequences.
Anyone has seen American Gods? no? well, don't, read the book instead. But there's a scene with a god involved and a good plan goes awry, and the character says "how could it have gone wrong? I accounted for everything", with the god replying "no, you didn't account for divine intervention".
There's a lot of things Jimmy and Kim didn't think of. Did they know Howard's marriage had troubles? did they know he was depressed? maybe the illness would have relapsed and he would have killed himself in shame. Maybe while driving drunk he could have had a fatal accident, to himself or with an innocent driver. So many things could have gone wrong, and while Lalo showing up at the exact same time was a cosmically difficult to predict event, still it happened.
And again - what was it all for? yeah, money from the settlement, but pretend for a moment it's real life. The scam was insane. How many people do you (generic "you") know in real life that would go all the trouble Jimmy and Kim did to ruin someone's life? in Howard's words, "what gives you the right?".
Jimmy told him "Howard, come on. Y-you'll be fine. You always land on your feet.".
Instead he landed on the ground with his brains splattered all over their living room. If two adult and intelligent people don't understand how dangerous is to pursue such a defamatory campaign, maybe a cosmic coincidence which result in a violent death will help them understand. "What's the worst that could happen?", they probably thought.... Lalo could have happened. And it did.
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Oddly, it bugs me that after all of this people still think Walter killed Hank and Gomie. Not once did anybody ever point out that it was the scumbag white supremacists. Seems like that would be one of the secrets that somebody used as leverage. Even Skyler and her worthless son thought he killed Hank.
That info is known though, isn't it? The last time Walter saw Skyler, when she let him hold Holly, he gave her that lottery ticket. The numbers of which corresponded to the GPS coordinates of where Hank was buried. He told her the story about how his money was out there, stolen, and then ended up being where Hank and Gomez were laid. I think he even instructed her to use it as a bargaining chip.
He told here where it happened, and how to use it for leverage, but my recollection was that he never really explained how he died, and the impression was still that he killed Hank.
I was wondering when were going to chime in :lol
I watched it over 3 sittings this week. Funny story. . . I downloaded the whole thing about a week ago thinking it had ended. Waterworks was the last episode available and I thought that was it. I was pissed off at it ending on a cliffhanger. VG is simply better than that. It wasn't until I read through this thread and got nearly caught up that I figured out there was another episode. That was right around my normal bedtime. I decided that I couldn't not finish it last night, and what's another 55 minutes. Little sleepy this morning. :lol
I had to look it up because curiosity got the better of me.
https://genius.com/Breaking-bad-felina-script-annotated
SKYLER: We don't want your money, Walt. I thought Flynn made that clear.
WALT: He did, and I don't have any to give you. I spent the last of it getting here. All I have to give you is this.
He takes out the lottery ticket and places it on the table
WALT: Call the DEA once I leave and tell them I was here. That I forced my way in, tell them, tell them I wanted bacon and eggs on my birthday and that I gave you that ticket. Those numbers are GPS coordinates.
SKYLER: For what?
WALT: A burial site. That's where they'll find Hank and Steve Gomez.
Skyler begins to cry
WALT: It's where I buried our money and the men who stole it from us, the men who still have it, they murdered Hank and Steve and put them in that hole. Now, you trade that for a deal with the prosecutor. You get yourself out of this. Skyler. Skyler. All the things that I did, you need to understand-
He just tells her that other people did it though. He didn't give any specifics.
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Oddly, it bugs me that after all of this people still think Walter killed Hank and Gomie. Not once did anybody ever point out that it was the scumbag white supremacists. Seems like that would be one of the secrets that somebody used as leverage. Even Skyler and her worthless son thought he killed Hank.
That info is known though, isn't it? The last time Walter saw Skyler, when she let him hold Holly, he gave her that lottery ticket. The numbers of which corresponded to the GPS coordinates of where Hank was buried. He told her the story about how his money was out there, stolen, and then ended up being where Hank and Gomez were laid. I think he even instructed her to use it as a bargaining chip.
He told here where it happened, and how to use it for leverage, but my recollection was that he never really explained how he died, and the impression was still that he killed Hank.
I was wondering when were going to chime in :lol
I watched it over 3 sittings this week. Funny story. . . I downloaded the whole thing about a week ago thinking it had ended. Waterworks was the last episode available and I thought that was it. I was pissed off at it ending on a cliffhanger. VG is simply better than that. It wasn't until I read through this thread and got nearly caught up that I figured out there was another episode. That was right around my normal bedtime. I decided that I couldn't not finish it last night, and what's another 55 minutes. Little sleepy this morning. :lol
I had to look it up because curiosity got the better of me.
https://genius.com/Breaking-bad-felina-script-annotated
SKYLER: We don't want your money, Walt. I thought Flynn made that clear.
WALT: He did, and I don't have any to give you. I spent the last of it getting here. All I have to give you is this.
He takes out the lottery ticket and places it on the table
WALT: Call the DEA once I leave and tell them I was here. That I forced my way in, tell them, tell them I wanted bacon and eggs on my birthday and that I gave you that ticket. Those numbers are GPS coordinates.
SKYLER: For what?
WALT: A burial site. That's where they'll find Hank and Steve Gomez.
Skyler begins to cry
WALT: It's where I buried our money and the men who stole it from us, the men who still have it, they murdered Hank and Steve and put them in that hole. Now, you trade that for a deal with the prosecutor. You get yourself out of this. Skyler. Skyler. All the things that I did, you need to understand-
He just tells her that other people did it though. He didn't give any specifics.
Fair enough. She certainly didn't seem to share that information, though.
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Agreed entirely.
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I like the way they ended the show, but not so much how the show ended. I liked Kim, and her life was just so sad and pointless after Howard. Unlike most people, I don't blame them for Howard's death. As she told his cunt ex-wife, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, and he was there because he drunkenly showed up to berate them. Their sin was destroying his legacy, not causing his death. That is certainly an awful thing, but not worth what she subjected herself to. It seemed to me like she should have been able to get her life back on track, but instead she just gave up.
I think this will be a hotly debated argument, with different points of view based on one's own experience, morals, and judgement.
I totally consider Kim and Jimmy responsable for Howard's death. Of course they didn't mean it, and of course they didn't pull the trigger nor they could have ever imagined Lalo was there. But, unintended consequences are still consequences.
Anyone has seen American Gods? no? well, don't, read the book instead. But there's a scene with a god involved and a good plan goes awry, and the character says "how could it have gone wrong? I accounted for everything", with the god replying "no, you didn't account for divine intervention".
There's a lot of things Jimmy and Kim didn't think of. Did they know Howard's marriage had troubles? did they know he was depressed? maybe the illness would have relapsed and he would have killed himself in shame. Maybe while driving drunk he could have had a fatal accident, to himself or with an innocent driver. So many things could have gone wrong, and while Lalo showing up at the exact same time was a cosmically difficult to predict event, still it happened.
And again - what was it all for? yeah, money from the settlement, but pretend for a moment it's real life. The scam was insane. How many people do you (generic "you") know in real life that would go all the trouble Jimmy and Kim did to ruin someone's life? in Howard's words, "what gives you the right?".
Jimmy told him "Howard, come on. Y-you'll be fine. You always land on your feet.".
Instead he landed on the ground with his brains splattered all over their living room. If two adult and intelligent people don't understand how dangerous is to pursue such a defamatory campaign, maybe a cosmic coincidence which result in a violent death will help them understand. "What's the worst that could happen?", they probably thought.... Lalo could have happened. And it did.
Had Howard been killed by a drunk driver on his way to their condo would it have been their fault? What happened is pretty equivalent, I think. I will say that had he killed himself as a consequence I'd put much of it on them (there were still plenty of other factors, not the least of which was Chuck), but it's not what happened.
As for what it was all for, danger made Kim all gooey. I've been saying that for years. She liked being in the game, though she was naive as to how dangerous it all was. Howard certainly did have his flaws, and they did have reasons to hate the guy (he laid them all out, in fact), and they certainly wanted the money, but in the end it was all about the con. Their con was finished, though.
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I'd say while not directly responsible they did contribute to the circumstances that led to his death. There are degrees of culpability. And even then, being technically innocent does not guarantee that you will feel free of guilt. Kim watched Howard die in front of her. He would not have been there that night if not for how they chose to interact with him. That's going to fester in any person with even a smidge of conscience. Especially someone who, excepting their predilections for cons, is as moral and good-hearted as kim was at her core.
As for the finale, it didn't wow me initially like the BB finale did, but it has definitely grown on me. To me, it feels a little bit like the end of the Irishman by Scorsese: a sombre and low key end to a life filled with crime and violence, the only difference is that Jimmy still had enough good left in him that he recognised he had the opportunity to atone, and took that chance. And I like that he did.
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(https://i.imgur.com/dnck3HO.jpg)
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I'd say while not directly responsible they did contribute to the circumstances that led to his death. There are degrees of culpability. And even then, being technically innocent does not guarantee that you will feel free of guilt. Kim watched Howard die in front of her. He would not have been there that night if not for how they chose to interact with him. That's going to fester in any person with even a smidge of conscience. Especially someone who, excepting their predilections for cons, is as moral and good-hearted as kim was at her core.
I don't really disagree with that. I just don't think contributing to the circumstances is the same as causation, and in my opinion her contribution didn't warrant squandering the rest of her life the way she did.
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It went beyond my wildest expectations.
I don't really remember what I thought about it when it was announced - I've seen Breaking Bad over the course of a year only after it has finished (I saw it from 2013 to 2014), and Better Call Saul was just a fun show to follow whenever it came out. I remember "binging" the first seasons only after they were released (I consider binging wathcing one episode per day), this is the only one I followed in real time if I remember correctly.
Anyway, I thought it would have been "just" the origin story of Saul Goodman. Jimmy slowly becomes Saul, and we see him doing Goodman-ish things, with some added bonus from seeing Mike and Gus.
I would have never anticipated it would become the giant it turned out to be. Probably not even the writers did - I expected it all to be with the same levity of the first season, that it would have all been skateboard twins and Kettlemans. What a glorious ride it has been.
The writers are basically the Dream Theater of TV shows, they could have done - like it was their initial idea - a comedy with week by week cases by Saul Goodman, but no, they had to create a compelling drama on par with Breaking Bad, just like DT told themselves "let's write a short epic" and came out instead with Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence :D
the initial speculation (and I recall Gilligan even commenting about this in an interview or podcast) was it was going to be like a sitcom.
Sort of like
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6v-ApehVbc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8domW4NwpBQ
And while it might not have had as much staying power, I still think that idea could have been good/funny/worth trying.
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Chino said a lot of what I wanted to say about Walt and his role in the murders of Hank and Gomez. Walt made it clear to Skyler that others were directly responsible for their deaths, but whether Skyler told that to the feds when making her deal with the lottery ticket is anyone's guess.
But, it's not like Jesse's name was cleared either. He had to flee to Alaska under a different name because he is still a murderer and a cooker of meth who is wanted by the feds. If caught, he'd be in prison for life.
Such is the price Walt and Jesse had to pay for their many sins. And while Jesse showed genuine sorrow for what he had done, he still did it. I don't have these blue-eyed visions that he was some great guy who was made bad by the evil Walter White. Jesse Pinkman is still the guy who knocked on Gale's door and shot him in the face. No matter how bad he felt about it, he did it.
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Chino said a lot of what I wanted to say about Walt and his role in the murders of Hank and Gomez. Walt made it clear to Skyler that others were directly responsible for their deaths, but whether Skyler told that to the feds when making her deal with the lottery ticket is anyone's guess.
But, it's not like Jesse's name was cleared either. He had to flee to Alaska under a different name because he is still a murderer and a cooker of meth who is wanted by the feds. If caught, he'd be in prison for life.
Such is the price Walt and Jesse had to pay for their many sins. And while Jesse showed genuine sorrow for what he had done, he still did it. I don't have these blue-eyed visions that he was some great guy who was made bad by the evil Walter White. Jesse Pinkman is still the guy who knocked on Gale's door and shot him in the face. No matter how bad he felt about it, he did it.
How far removed is Jesse shooting Gale in the face from Kim trying to shoot Gus in the face? They were both acting under pressure from outside influences. And I'm not defending Jesse at all. He was a bad guy. It's just that necessity can really fuck up the line between good guys and bad guys.
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How far removed is Jesse shooting Gale in the face from Kim trying to shoot Gus in the face? They were both acting under pressure from outside influences. And I'm not defending Jesse at all. He was a bad guy. It's just that necessity can really fuck up the line between good guys and bad guys.
That's a good question, one for which I do not have a quick answer.
My initial thought is that it was apples and oranges considering Kim was still in shock from seeing Howard shot dead right in front of her and felt that doing what she was told was her only way to save Jimmy, someone she legitimately cared about, whom she knew was being held captive by Lalo, Howard's murderer, until she did what he ordered her to do.
But yeah, the line between the good guys and the bad guys can get blurry, and as well as between the bad guys and the really bad guys.
Consider that as awful as Jesse felt for having to kill Gale (you could see in his face along with the tears), that was nearly identical to Walt's reaction to his own first murder (of Krazy-8), where Walt broke down and kept repeating, "I'm sorry," after choking him to death with the bike lock. And yet Jesse still had no problem cooking meth after that. He seemed stunned when he had to kill the Salamanca nephew when he, Gus and Mike were making their escape after Gus poisoned them all at Don Eladio's, but Jesse still was all about cooking meth and making fat stacks, even after Gus was gone. Jesse never reached his breaking point where he had to stop until Todd shot the kid on the bike after the train heist.
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Yep. Jesse had a sweet spot for kids. Probably because his parents basically bailed on him…..but the series always placed him in instances where he was…….for the lack of a better term…..parental to a couple kids.
After Todd shot that kid you could see Jesse clocked out. He was done. As has been mentioned, Jesse murdered and was a meth cook…..certainly not an upstanding citizen. But, the cool dichotomy of his character compared to Walt’s was that Jesse progressively worked his way towards ‘good’ whereas Walt progressively headed down a dark path.
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Yep. Jesse had a sweet spot for kids. Probably because his parents basically bailed on him…..but the series always placed him in instances where he was…….for the lack of a better term…..parental to a couple kids.
After Todd shot that kid you could see Jesse clocked out. He was done. As has been mentioned, Jesse murdered and was a meth cook…..certainly not an upstanding citizen. But, the cool dichotomy of his character compared to Walt’s was that Jesse progressively worked his way towards ‘good’ whereas Walt progressively headed down a dark path.
Good points.
Of course, Jesse's parents bailed on him after he repeatedly hung himself with the rope they kept handing him. He didn't deserve them anymore.
Interestingly, even after Todd shot Drew Sharp, I think Jesse would have been okay with cooking had Mike and Walt been on his side to either fire or off Todd, but once they outvoted him to keep him part of the operation, he checked out. Seeing Walt humming to himself in one of the tented houses after expressing how sad he was about the kid dying as well was a key moment, too, as it came off to Jesse like Walt really didn't care that much that someone in their operation had killed a kid for what Jesse considered a pithy reason.
I definitely agree with you about the dichotomy between the two, though. I know that I was one of millions who was hollering at the TV with glee when Jesse strangled Todd to death in the BB finale (I will not feel bad for cheering on the death of a fictional character :lol).
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And because, why not :lol, here is me spitballing a list of the 10 greatest characters in the BB/BCS universe
01 Walter White
02 Jesse Pinkman
03 Jimmy McGill/Saul Goodman/Gene
04 Kim Wexler
05 Gustavo Fring
06 Mike Ehrmantraut
07 Hank Schrader
08 Chuck McGill
09 Skyler White
10 Howard Hamlin
Walter Jr. ranks 193rd. Sorry, Lalo fans, he does not make the cut.
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I’d replace Skykar with Lalo on your list……he was awesome. Skylark was serviceable…..but she wasn’t in that tier IMO
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I put Skyler on there because her character arc was more interesting. She really wasn't a likable character (which seemed to shock Anna Gunn; did she think Skyler was supposed to be likable??), but she was a fascinating one.
Lalo was basically a psychopath with no nuance. We saw everything about him early on (he was crazy, but could be super charming when he had to be), and that was him in a nutshell.
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Walt - Kinda has to be top on the list.
Chuck - The ultimate antagonist. You hated him and pitied him at the same time. I wanted him to die and took zero satisfaction when it happened. That's how villains should be.
Kim - I don't know as her character changed, but it certainly came into view more and more. Interesting gal.
Mike - The ultimate badass. Brilliant at what he does, and despite being totally ruthless he's got a big heart.
Gus - I hide in plain sight. The duality of his life fascinated me. He'll serve fried chicken to cops even while he's plotting evil shit. Also, brilliantly clever.
Lalo - Kev might be right that he's a glib and superficial psychopath, but he overlooks Lalo's Joie de vivre. Nobody had as much fun being a criminal as he did.
Nacho - Smarter than his peers, yet always struggling to keep himself afloat. Went out like a boss.
Jesse - I honestly never found Jesse all that interesting.
Jimmy - I like Jimmy a lot, but don't really consider him a great character. More of a vehicle for everything to happen around him.
Tyrus - He and Mike really didn't seem to get along, and he was itching to shoot Mike on a few occasions, but he never hesitated to follow his orders. His loyalty was to Gus, but he respected Mike, even if he didn't like him.
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Reflecting further on Lalo, he really was unique. Not one damn one of of these people ever had fun. As good as it got for any of them was simply relaxing for a spell. Even when Gus entertains and makes that bouillabaisse of his it's still all about business. Most of these people seem miserable. The exception would be Kim and Jimmy because at least the con gets them off. Seems like trying to win and trying to survive is a 24-7 effort. Lalo's charm seemed legit to me because he always seemed to find the pleasure in what he was doing.
Seems to me that the Soprano crew always managed to find time to enjoy themselves. BBQs. Nice restaurants. Titty bars. Even just chilling in front of the meat market made them happy. The BBBCS crews were just too driven for their own good.
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while they were lesser characters, I found people like
Hector
Tuco
Pryce
Skinny Pete+Badger
were as entertaining as any characters as they had in the shows. I just liked seeing them meltdown which added comic-relief.
Also Ted Beneke, who was totally naive, when they introduced Howard, I was totally reminded of.
I.e. I wondered if Howard was basically going to be the BCS version of Ted. Which didn't really happen that much, but in a small way, I still wonder if that's what the writers were going for.
That being said, if I picked favorite characters:
-Mike
-Saul in BB
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I managed to binge re-watch this since the finale, as I had planned. Definitely better the second time around, and while it didn't have the consistent highs of a certain other show that shall remain nameless ;), it was still pretty damn great overall. The slower pace works better on the binge for sure. A few thoughts...
-The conversation between Mike and Nacho's dad is a great reminder to us that while it is easy for us to watch and differentiate between the "good guy" bad guys like Mike and Nacho and the "bad guy" bad guys like Gus and Lalo, to most of society, the law-abiding citizens, they really are all the same.
-Special kudos should go to the college students who played Jimmy's camera crew. The tall guy was fairly nondescript, but the camera guy was so always so ambivalent about everything and just wanted his money and for no one to touch his camera, and the gal was sneaky hilarious (her enthusiasm for always trying to get someone camera-ready was money).
-Steven Bauer gets mad props for his portrayal of Don Eladio. He didn't get a lot of scenes in this or Breaking Bad, but he killed it in both. The scene when Lalo gives him the car is so funny. He was like a child getting what he wanted for his 6th birthday and being all giddy about it, and then him repeating his own "frunk" pun had me LOLing for real.
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Has anybody started watching BB again since BCS has ended? I watched a video earlier on YT where some guy analyzed a scene from BB, one from BCS that adds some tone and background to it, and then goes back to the BB scene. He was of the opinion that it changed the meaning a little bit. That might be a reach, but it certainly provided a lot of insight into why Mike behaved a certain way, and perhaps what he meant. We take it as a given that VG is so good at this that he's not going to screw up a show with continuity issues or by changing a character's nature. In fact he's probably good enough that every scene he made in BCS was done with an eye towards improving BB. A second viewing of it might be very different now that we better understand three of the main characters.
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Not yet, but I am sure I will want to do another BB re-watch at some point.
I will say, though, and we might have touched on this already, that I disagree with the sentiment I have seen since the BCS finale that we know now how much Saul meant to Walt. That is not new. It was blatantly obvious to BB viewers to Saul had a MASSIVE hand in Walter White building his meth empire, but I think the BCS finale was Jimmy McGill letting the (imaginary BB/BCS) world know that, "hey, Walter White is not a name any of you would know without ME."
I suspect some could re-watch some of Saul's more relaxed BB moments and relate them to Kim in some way. For as much as a clown show as Saul could be when he was doing his thing, he could do the more subdued moments really well as well where you saw a slightly different side of him, a side that was obviously fleshed out in BCS. Like, you could tell Saul didn't feel great about the ruse where he had to have Francesca call Hank to tell him Marie was in the hospital (to get Hank away from the RV where Walt and Jesse were trapped inside).
I always liked the moment late in Season 3 of BB when Mike threatens to break Saul's legs if he doesn't tell him where Jesse is. When Saul breaks and tells him where the notepad is where Jesse's (fake) location is written, he still tells him not to touch anything on his desk. While not a tough guy, Saul still showed some balls there by giving that directive, and one could definitely now see that as more impactful now having seen the backstory of how their working relationship began.
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I always liked the moment late in Season 3 of BB when Mike threatens to break Saul's legs if he doesn't tell him where Jesse is. When Saul breaks and tells him where the notepad is where Jesse's (fake) location is written, he still tells him not to touch anything on his desk. While not a tough guy, Saul still showed some balls there by giving that directive, and one could definitely now see that as more impactful now having seen the backstory of how their working relationship began.
Not to mention that Saul has witnessed two guys getting their legs broken.
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I always liked the moment late in Season 3 of BB when Mike threatens to break Saul's legs if he doesn't tell him where Jesse is. When Saul breaks and tells him where the notepad is where Jesse's (fake) location is written, he still tells him not to touch anything on his desk. While not a tough guy, Saul still showed some balls there by giving that directive, and one could definitely now see that as more impactful now having seen the backstory of how their working relationship began.
Not to mention that Saul has witnessed two guys getting their legs broken.
Best lawyer ever! He got those clowns from a life sentence down to six months. :lol :lol
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I always liked the moment late in Season 3 of BB when Mike threatens to break Saul's legs if he doesn't tell him where Jesse is. When Saul breaks and tells him where the notepad is where Jesse's (fake) location is written, he still tells him not to touch anything on his desk. While not a tough guy, Saul still showed some balls there by giving that directive, and one could definitely now see that as more impactful now having seen the backstory of how their working relationship began.
Not to mention that Saul has witnessed two guys getting their legs broken.
Best lawyer ever! He got those clowns from a life sentence down to six months. :lol :lol
Still one of the very best lines of the entire show, hands sown.
"You're the worst lawyer.... the worst lawyer ever!!!"
"I talked you down from a death sentence to six months' probation. I'm the best lawyer ever".
Anyway, I would love to see the outside perspective of what the public know about the whole Heisenberg drama. I must have seen someone on Reddit mentioning it too - having a movie without any of the major protagonists, to show people find out about Heisenberg, the whole manhunt, which details were gotten right and which ones were dramatized to increase the legend of Heisenberg, and so on. Included Saul's arrest.
"Truth is, Walter White couldn't have done it without me".
Hello, pride and ego of Walter, how are you doing? :lol
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"Truth is, Walter White couldn't have done it without me".
Hello, pride and ego of Walter, how are you doing? :lol
While the bolded is true.......the statement he made is factual as well.
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But the general public, I assume, just learnt of Heisenberg and how a chemistry teacher built a drug empire. Now the everyday man will read in the news that his lawyer assumed full responsability and even credit for guiding him and preventing him to be dead or in jail within a month.
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Rhea Seehorn didn't win the Emmy, however she will be eligible next year.
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Yep, this nomination was for Season 6a. She can still win it next year for 6B.
Julie Garner was awesome on Ozark as well, so I have no issues with her winning. Everyone cannot win.
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Rhea Seehorn to star in Vince Gilligan's next show that has a 2-season order exclusively on Apple TV+,
which given I don't subscribe to that service, I'm not thrilled about.
However, my wife is a Mac user and thus she may have access (I have not tried, although I would like to to check out Ronald D Moore's "For All Mankind" on there if possible)
https://deadline.com/2022/09/vince-gilligan-next-series-rhea-seehorn-star-apple-tv-plus-two-season-order-1235124488/
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Hector Salamanca aka Tio aka Mark Margolis RIP.
was a big part of the BB/BCS stories.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/mark-margolis-dead-breaking-bad-better-call-saul-1235551107/
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Oh, noooooooo :'( :'( :'(
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https://twitter.com/itsSaulGoodman/status/1704912631088177389
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6kRALeWgAAvqO5?format=jpg&name=large)
still uncertain about this, but if true, this is worth looking forward to. It doesn't exactly correlate with what Vince Gilligan said after Better Call Saul ended though.
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I want to believe.
I'm in.
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Ehhh…….I don’t know about this one. I think that character has been pretty much flushed out and detailed to the point there’s really nothing left to learn. Even if there are some aspects here and there that are unknown or not covered…..”better to save the mystery, than surrender to the secret”.
‘If’ this does happen I’ll watch because BB and BCS were both incredible…..but don’t know if that third bolt is being caught in the bottle.
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It's difficult to figure out if that's an official account.
When I searched for Saul Goodman there are like 5 blue checked accounts.
The official show channel is better call Saul with a yellow checkmark.
Plus with the strike going on, I doubt this is real
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That account also has a Better Fuel Huel poster on the account. Kinda weird account just posting random pics of the show and made up posters
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The only way you could create a show on the guy is to make it another prequel, for obvious reasons. Giancarlo is too old to pull of the young, still in Peru Gustavo. Same with the other characters that could be included (a variety of Salamancas). That said, if VG wanted to recast them and make such a show I bet it'd be good. Not happening, though, with him working on the Rhea Seahorn thing.
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The only way you could create a show on the guy is to make it another prequel, for obvious reasons. Giancarlo is too old to pull of the young, still in Peru Gustavo. Same with the other characters that could be included (a variety of Salamancas). That said, if VG wanted to recast them and make such a show I bet it'd be good. Not happening, though, with him working on the Rhea Seahorn thing.
I wonder if they could do a show that ran in parallel with the events of Breaking Bad. It wouldn't require that much de-aging (less than BCS), and there'd already be a source timeline to thread the story through. It would be tough to write, but it could be cool to see Walt's empire climb through Gus' eyes.
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Gus is a character where less is more.
The more he was hidden and mysterious and enigmatic, the more he was scary. The more you explore his life, he becomes a bit more mundane.
I am curious to know what happened in Chile, but I also know that there is no complete explanation that will be better than the vague and scary idea that this dude helped Pinochet's regime and did some bad things.
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The only way you could create a show on the guy is to make it another prequel, for obvious reasons. Giancarlo is too old to pull of the young, still in Peru Gustavo. Same with the other characters that could be included (a variety of Salamancas). That said, if VG wanted to recast them and make such a show I bet it'd be good. Not happening, though, with him working on the Rhea Seahorn thing.
I wonder if they could do a show that ran in parallel with the events of Breaking Bad. It wouldn't require that much de-aging (less than BCS), and there'd already be a source timeline to thread the story through. It would be tough to write, but it could be cool to see Walt's empire climb through Gus' eyes.
That's an interesting premise, but I think MM is correct. We've seen the perfect amount of Fring. If we wanted to show the going's on from a different perspective, Gildenhank and Rosengomez are dead. That'd actually be a pretty cool show.